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JUMP FATIGUE we dont want it any more, please remove from eve!

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Juan Mileghere
Mackies Raiders
Wild Geese.
#81 - 2015-03-18 06:33:34 UTC
Bobbyd wrote:
Hello all, Hi I'm outraged with this thing in eve called Jump Fatigue

First off congrats on the working code and the idea was great at first, but I'm sorry to say the news isn't all good.

Game play in eve has changed due to fatigue. I was hoping for a positive change and left feeling the adverse effects and none of the great small fights that we had anticipated,

Please Devs/ISD when you moderate this thread ( I'm sure there are many others like this but your forum search function doesn't work for me to search for them) can you read it and advise what players can do to speak with the Game makers and Designers to have this re-looked at,

I don't want to make a post that is TL:DR for everyone so I'll just list what has been changed for me.

1) Small gang fleets have been reduced, I live in null sec and its a lot of jumps to find good fights (Jumps = Time), we have Jump Bridges in place but most our mates have to high fatigue from CTAs to use the bridge so they stay at home and do not join small fleets,

2) My Black Ops hasn't been used since the fatigue was brought in due to fatigue accumulation on other fleets, I'm finding I'm missing a lot of opportunities to join fleets or other members do not join my fleets due to fatigue. so I'm finding I'm getting a lot less content now.

3) My Titan hasn't logged in for a fleet in months, we used to use for bridging fleets for content now it feels like a wasted asset.

I could go on forever about fatigue but to keep this OP short I'll stop there,

I myself do not like it. my corp mates do not like it, my alliance friends do not like it, my coalition friends do not like it, and my red friends on the other side of eve do not like it, in fact I have not talked with anyone in null sec that supports jump fatigue.

Seems to me the only players that like or have no opinion on the matter either do not use jump drives or have no interest in Null sec.

What I do like is the jump cool down and the range reduction, this has helped in making the map much bigger.Please keep these features as they are working well.

If you live in Null Sec and do not like fatigue please speak up!

So stop using them and sell them at a loss or go out in a blaze of glory

Blobbing Explained
Lugh Crow-Slave
#82 - 2015-03-18 06:37:41 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:


A better plan would be to cut the fatigue cap by 2/3rds and compensate for that by tripling the reactivation timer. At the height of my reaching the cap I had 30 days of fatigue and a 2 day reactivation timer, if CCP did it like I describe, I'd have had 10 days of fatigue and a 6 day timer. I think the jump reactivation timer is a better curb to power projection abuse in the 1st place.


ignoring weather or not this would fix anything it certanly would hurt blops that with the range boost managed to come out of this in just about an equal place as before so long as you put a bit of effort in making sure your fatigue timer doesn't exceed 5hrs


your idea also just punishes people who currently can manage their fatigue, just so you can ignore it and not have to worry about it getting to high

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Vyl Vit
#83 - 2015-03-18 07:08:04 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Vyl Vit wrote:
Bronson Hughes wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
but creating situations where people CAN'T play is imo not the right choice.

How is having 30 days of jump fatigue preventing you from playing? All it's doing is preventing you from playing the way you want.

Find other ways to play, preferably ones that don't involve jump drives, jump bridges, etc. If you're relying on them so much to find content, why not move closer to your content?
That would mean Jenn couldn't push Jenn's "version" of facts.


That's evidence of when I've hurt someone enough in the Butt Parts that they have to start sniping from the sidelines. Though said butt hurt was not my intention, it is welcomed nonetheless.
A friend of mine once said, "People are either interesting, or amusing." I said, "Oh yeah? What about boring?"

Paradise is like where you are right now, only much, much better.
FireFrenzy
Cynosural Samurai
#84 - 2015-03-18 07:32:59 UTC
@OP: SO IT IS WORKING!
xttz
GSF Logistics and Posting Reserves
Goonswarm Federation
#85 - 2015-03-18 08:50:17 UTC
Like many (especially recent) CCP ideas, the concept of jump fatigue is much better than the execution. While EVE did need travel limits to be introduced, they've been done in a very hamfisted way that is unintuitive for players and reduces scope for player choice.

Despite a stated goal to reduce long-distance travel time for capital ships, the current formula actually punishes multiple shorter jumps more than long ones due to the way fatigue builds up. Thanks to the short max ranges for most ships and a fixed lower bound on the fatigue formula it detracts from the sandbox element of Eve. There is little scope for a trade-off between short jumps with lower penalty or long jumps with a very high penalty.
It's also rather convoluted from a mathematical point of view. How many of you can predict the overall impact of fatigue and jump delay from a route without using out-of-game tools?

During the pre-Phoebe discussion thread I pitched a possible approach to both simplify the system for players, and give them more choice between convenience and penalty in what's meant to be a sandbox:

"xttz" wrote:
1) Set all ship jump ranges to exactly 10 light years. Carriers, Titans, Blops, everything. Starbase JBs remain at 5LY.

2) Jump fatigue is measured from 1-100%. Whenever you jump, your fatigue is increased by whatever percentage of 10LY you jump. So a 4LY jump adds 40% fatigue, 8.5LY adds 85%, etc. Simple.

3) Fatigue decays on a curve akin to shields and cap regen, just in reverse. This means that it's much quicker to go from 30% to 20% than from 100% to 90%.*

4) Until the fatigue decays completely, this percentage is a limit on subsequent jumps. Someone with a 90% fatigue cannot jump more than 1LY, while someone on 35% fatigue can jump up to 6.5LY

5) Special-cases like blops, freighters and JFs build fatigue at a reduced rate (50% is probably fair).

6) Training Jump Drive Calibration speeds up fatigue decay.

This is far simpler to understand for players, easier to do math on the fly, and means less sitting around waiting on cooldown timers doing nothing in what's meant to be a video game. Inter-region travel is just as slow, but local travel is viable. There's an incentive for players to make shorter jumps or take gates, as recovering from a long jump would take much longer than several shorter ones.
The higher range introduces a trade-off for jump-capable combat ships; the further away they hide the easier it is to make a surprise attack, but the harder it becomes to get away again. In the future, power projection can be tuned by simply adjusting the base rate of fatigue decay.

Examples:

An Archon pilot jumps from Sahkt to Karan, a distance of 6.32LY. After the jump, his fatigue is set at 63.2%. His next jump must be 3.68LY or less, although this will gradually increase as fatigue decays.

A jump freighter pilot jumps from CCP-US to DO6H-Q, a distance of 3.24LY. After the jump, his fatigue is set at a reduced rate of 16.2% (half of 32.4%). His next jump must be 8.38LY or less, although this will gradually increase as fatigue decays.

A Rifter pilot takes a starbase jump bridge between CCP-US and DO6H-Q, a distance of 3.24LY. After the jump, his fatigue is set at 32.4%. His next jump must be 6.76LY or less, meaning he can use at least one more Jump Bridge immediately. This means a return trip is easily possible, but using more than 1-2 bridges means a lengthy delay.

*The curved decay is based on shield/cap regen. It works the same way (with a peak at 30%) only moving in reverse from 100% down to 0%. The idea behind it is to incentivise shorter jumps - i.e. local travel. A jump of 2 to 4LY puts you in the peak decay rate, making it far quicker to recover from. Jumps 8 to 10LY put you at the slowest rate of decay, which could take around a day to recover from. The dip at the lower end of the curve (0-10%) also has a slow rate, meaning lots and lots of short jumps will build up a larger drawback over time.
thebarry
7-2 Ronin
#86 - 2015-03-18 12:25:34 UTC  |  Edited by: thebarry
I'd be open to setting capital jump range a little higher than 5au and then making Jump Drive Calibration reduce the effect of fatigue by 5% per level for example, but honestly I think the changes are working pretty well and atm there are far more important things that must be addressed first...we can come back to tweak jump drive mechanics later on. I think(hope) the sov changes will result in the disintegration of the major blocks along timezones, and this should help you to find more targets to shoot heh.
Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#87 - 2015-03-18 13:12:11 UTC
This is like the posts declaring time dilation to be a bad thing. You're attacking the bread crust for being dry, unaware it supports the bread you rely on.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#88 - 2015-03-18 17:18:58 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
The point is that, the penalty for having fun in jump capable ships is steeper than is prudent.

Jenn... I respect you as a fellow bloodthirsty PvP drunkard... but I disagree with you completely.

Since the Jump Fatigue changes low-sec has DRASTICALLY opened up.

I can fly a battlecruiser around without too much fear of being hotdropped!! (it still happens, just with FAR less regularity).
I can use my Moros and Thanny again for small to medium sized engagements without having to "suicide fit" them.
There is more traffic coming and going through gates both in low and null-sec... opening up opportunities (and targets) for roaming shenanigans!


Granted... moving stuff around is more painful. Capital and Blops Ops are now tricky. Alliances now have to commit to certain areas which has effectively regionalized them. But you know what? I like it this way. There is more "breathing room" for tactics beyond "hey guys... is that a cyno ship? ****!! Bail!!!!" *40 carriers drop in on a 20 man cruiser fleet*

Jenn aSide wrote:
Goal of limiting jump capable ship projection achieved, goal of exacting consequences on someone who is wreckless (or drunk...) with jump capable ships achieved and all without suspending someone from some interesting game play (like blopsing and such) for the better part of a whole calendar month.

Try playing the market when you are drunk. You'll be spending a whole month trying to recoup your losses (and no PvPing because you can't afford it anymore) from one night of bad investments.

EVE is hard. And the "consequences" don't care if you are drunk or not. Now bend over and take it like a man! Twisted


And once again is has nothing to do with no accepting consequences. It has everything to do with "this is silly, one night of fun should ever equal 30 days of punishment", especially when the mechanic in question was introduced for another purpose (slowing capital projection.

This is why CCP backed off the infinite jump fatigue mechanism and capped it at 30 days. I'm saying that cap is still too high for the intention, and it's also one that unnecessarily favors people like me (with multiple accounts) over run of the mil single account types. I was able to keep playing (whether in fleet or elsewhere), but the person who isn't like me would suffer a bit more. There is a balance between good restrictions in a game and overly harsh restrictions. This is why we don't lose SP anymore when we get podded, for example.


And for the record, I am the exact wrong person to tell to 'adapt' to something. I've been adapting for 8 years, I pre-adapted to this (and every) situation by having multiple accounts (my one mistake in this case was getting drunk on vacation and playing a video game after having sold my actual reserve pvp alt a couple months ago, but the one I have now can fly all my alliance doctrine and npsi ships in 7 days so that's fixed as well).
If ccp doesn't change the jump fatigue system in ways I or someone else suggest i'll still be playing EVE 10 years from now, because in another 42 days i'll have a 3rd reserve pvp alt (if I don't just up the cash and buy one before that) then the Kentucky economy will flourish on my next vacation because I won't personally give a damn about jump fatigue on 2 characters lol.

I'm simply pointing out that CCPs original compromise cap (30 days instead of infinite) is still too high. Whatever happens next (they change it or they don't) doesn't actually matter, at least to the space rich lol.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#89 - 2015-03-18 17:27:43 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:


A better plan would be to cut the fatigue cap by 2/3rds and compensate for that by tripling the reactivation timer. At the height of my reaching the cap I had 30 days of fatigue and a 2 day reactivation timer, if CCP did it like I describe, I'd have had 10 days of fatigue and a 6 day timer. I think the jump reactivation timer is a better curb to power projection abuse in the 1st place.


ignoring weather or not this would fix anything it certanly would hurt blops that with the range boost managed to come out of this in just about an equal place as before so long as you put a bit of effort in making sure your fatigue timer doesn't exceed 5hrs


your idea also just punishes people who currently can manage their fatigue, just so you can ignore it and not have to worry about it getting to high


CCp made adjustments for blops on the 1st go around, they could do the same thing again..

As I said in my post before this one, I will be able to functionally ignore it in a few days anyways as I have multiple accounts. That's not the point, the point is actually a philosophical one: A game should have balance (and the jump mechanics changes were their to balance force projection), but without actually punishing people for having fun.

I've never suicide ganked anyone (nothing wrong with it, it's within the game rules, just not my cup of tea) but hot damn the penalties for suicide ganking don't feel near as harsh as the penalty for one night of too many drunken jumps while yelling wee at the top of my lungs at 3 in the morning, while naked.

Yea, I put that image in your heads. And you like it.
Bobbyd
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#90 - 2015-03-19 07:03:30 UTC
After reading all the posts in this tread. it gives a clear view that there are divided ideas about jump fatigue,

Just to clear up on a few points, its my opinion that travelling from one side of the map to the other in a few minutes is a bad thing.

CCP tackled this by;
1) Increasing the fuel used by jump drives making it more expensive. we now have to consider if its cost effective to move via jump drive.

2) Shortening most jump drives to 5 Ly

3) Removed death cloning so have to burn there gate to gate with cynos one after the other.

4) Added a jump cool down timer.

5) Adding a fatigue timer that increases exponentially.

the first four measures do reduce forced projection of large capital fleets with no major draw back to game play,

The fifth measure in my opinion is overkill.

Iv'e read a few posts from people supporting jump fatigue. for those people please ask your self do you support the fatigue timer or the outcome of the patch which added four measures to combat fast travel?

And if it is the actual fatigue timer, does it fill you with joy when you use a jump drive to see that timer go up and you now cannot use your jump drive again, or do you like the fact that it is hindering other players from using their jump drives to ruin your day?

For the low sec guys out there that say they can use caps more now, removing fatigue would not change this, between the first four measures I listed here it will still take a considerable amount of time to mobilize a cap fleet, move cynos, wait out jump cool down timers, to mess with your dread/carrier/super fleet and almost certainly long enough to wait out siege timers.

Please think beyond the current issues of Null Sec and capital blobs, after those have been resolved I fear we will be left with a mechanic that will limit game play and or content for the whole community.

Also I will add for those that have hate towards Alliances/Coalitions that hold massive amounts of unused Sov and to many blues, Believe it or not most of their leaderships like the current set up as it gives capital heavy entities almost no opposition to there capital fleets and complete dominance of areas around there staging systems. enemy capital fleets are to far away to worry about and gives them almost absolute power in their jump ranges. ( again just my view that I have experienced first hand)

Criticism is welcomed but please keep it clean and constructive,

Stay classy guys.
Sigras
Conglomo
#91 - 2015-03-19 07:31:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Sigras
Bobbyd wrote:
Iv'e read a few posts from people supporting jump fatigue. for those people please ask your self do you support the fatigue timer or the outcome of the patch which added four measures to combat fast travel?

And if it is the actual fatigue timer, does it fill you with joy when you use a jump drive to see that timer go up and you now cannot use your jump drive again, or do you like the fact that it is hindering other players from using their jump drives to ruin your day?

Is waiting 2-3 months for a level 5 skill to finish training particularly fun? not really, but is it good for the game? even necessary? Absolutely otherwise the player base would have no sense of progression...
Bobbyd wrote:
For the low sec guys out there that say they can use caps more now, removing fatigue would not change this, between the first four measures I listed here it will still take a considerable amount of time to mobilize a cap fleet, move cynos, wait out jump cool down timers, to mess with your dread/carrier/super fleet and almost certainly long enough to wait out siege timers.

I call BS here. I was in a small 500 man alliance and we had several dozen cyno alts ready to take us anywhere within 30 LY in minutes. I have 5 dedicated cyno alts myself! With cap ships being able to use gates, we could be even more strategic about that and our reach would probably have been around the same...

Now consider goonswarm or N3 and the massive number of alts they would have... They would have no problem showing up half way across the map in 20 minutes with 100 supercaps. For cap ships, crossing New Eden should be a time measured in DAYS not hours.
Bobbyd wrote:
Also I will add for those that have hate towards Alliances/Coalitions that hold massive amounts of unused Sov and to many blues, Believe it or not most of their leaderships like the current set up as it gives capital heavy entities almost no opposition to there capital fleets and complete dominance of areas around there staging systems. enemy capital fleets are to far away to worry about and gives them almost absolute power in their jump ranges. ( again just my view that I have experienced first hand)

This is exactly why we need to wait for all the changes to be released to see how the meta shakes out before making any major knee-jerk reactions because your favorite playstyle got nerfed for the sake of the game.
Samillian
Angry Mustellid
#92 - 2015-03-19 08:57:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Samillian
Bobbyd wrote:
For the low sec guys out there that say they can use caps more now, removing fatigue would not change this, between the first four measures I listed here it will still take a considerable amount of time to mobilize a cap fleet, move cynos, wait out jump cool down timers, to mess with your dread/carrier/super fleet and almost certainly long enough to wait out siege timers.


I was recently in an engagement that had 25+ carriers on field for nearly an hour, without the Pheobe changes that particular party would have been unthinkable for either side. Your proposal to remove Jump Fatigue would mean our little party and incidents like it would almost certainly be gate crashed by larger entities who no longer had to worry about the long term consequences of their actions only deal with short term logistical problems which they have more than proved themselves capable of.

Just about everybody I know likes being able to actually do interesting stuff which was impossible prior to these changes and while moving is now a proper pain I'm happy to accept that in return for the much improved quality of life in LowSec.

NBSI shall be the whole of the Law
Bobbyd
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#93 - 2015-03-19 09:08:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Bobbyd
Sigras wrote:
I call BS here. I was in a small 500 man alliance and we had several dozen cyno alts ready to take us anywhere within 30 LY in minutes. I have 5 dedicated cyno alts myself! With cap ships being able to use gates, we could be even more strategic about that and our reach would probably have been around the same...

Now consider goonswarm or N3 and the massive number of alts they would have... They would have no problem showing up half way across the map in 20 minutes with 100 supercaps. For cap ships, crossing New Eden should be a time measured in DAYS not hours.


This is clearly not the case, even if you had many cynos alts ready each 5ly jump you would have to wait out a cool down timer,

If the cool down timer was a hard set number like 10 minutes it would take a minimum of 5 cynos to get 30 ly like in your example, and that's 50 minutes of cool down timers, allow for server ticks and fleet co-ordination you are looking at over an hour to travel 30 ly, that is if you had the cynos in place which in most cases you will not!
This trip would cost somewhere in the ball park of 20mill ISK for one direction and after the engagement you would have the same travel time home. this turns into a 60 ly round trip and a 3 hour OP costing 40m ISK per ship.

more likely to be the case you will have to burn cynos to where you need them and that said jump chain would take hours.

Currently you can travel 30 ly in 5 hours if you wait each hour for the fatigue timer to run out assuming you have no fatigue to start with, or if you jump as soon as your cool down timer runs out you will end up with enough fatigue that you can get used to 26 days of jump fatigue limiting you to 1 jump per day.

Keep in mind the old carrier jump range was over 20 ly and is now 5 ly.

Now lets talk one side of the map to the other, that's about 100 lys.
That would take you a ballpark of 22-25 cynos at 10 min per jump would mean a minimum of 3 and a half hours of just cool down timers amusing you sat at the keyboard the whole time jumping as soon as you could. add in the time to move cyno alts, keeping mind you no longer can death clone cyno alts, so this means jumping many stargates in null sec and low sec to set up the chain.
StupidMonkeyBeSpankinIt
Illicit Expo
#94 - 2015-03-20 22:38:54 UTC
IDK, my .02, jump fatigue sucks. It totally kills my game play. Running multiple capital capable accounts, it is now frustrating as ever, to move around. I may have a particular play style, I wonder if anyone else has said anything from the perspective I am coming from. I know I have not said anything, I did not know this was coming up for change at the time, I have real life to deal with as well... I come back and all **** is breaking loose. Why is Eve changing SO much, its so unfamiliar now. I was so nice to log on and mine, explore, find some low sec pirates to chase, or sit and ship spin... I feel, now its frustrating, Ive put more investment in the game, over the last five years, I have seen so much change in Eve and I wonder why it all had to happen anyway. I get that things need to be improved, and CCP wants to improve their "product" but, at the expense of making Eve unattractive, or far more a pain in the ass than worth dealing with... won't you loose game players? Aren't you concerned at all, for the solo'rs or the nomads? Just for example, jumping what used to be a one JD jump, is now four... and with that four jumps, I have to wait 15 days before I can jump back...

To be honest, I want my ******* money back, Im pretty upset about it ( as upset as one will get about a stupid ass video game) and simply, Im looking for another game to play now. I feel raped. thank you ccp, for taking and changing stuff so rapidly, so much, drastically killing it for those invested, yet taking their time, and sticking to them selves... IDK if anyone else feels this way, I really dont care if you dont like my attitude about it, Im not really mad, im just bent... tbh, cause you know, I really love Eve... and I love playing it so much I ignore my gf for hours, and call in sick to work every month, just to stay home and play Eve... I feel like Eve is a huge part of my life, my interest, Space travel and exploration, science and geeky ****, ya know? You all know... you all are here playing it too... I get that there is a need maybe, to control what the big fish are doing in Capitals...

so along with my gripe, I provide a few suggestions?

for fleets with multiple capitals, provide a jump fatigue... or
for reduce the timer, and give back the range to the ships... or
knock down the fatigue timer and allow a skill to reduce the effects, and put a cap on the accumulated fatigue time one must wait before they can jump... or
perhaps, allow single capital ships to roam free, or with little effect with a fast recovery... or
provide a booster or implant, or drug one can take to reduce the effects of the fatigue... or something to get the solo capital pilot back in the game.



BravoPrime
Garoun Investment Bank
#95 - 2015-03-20 23:31:58 UTC
Adapt and overcome bra!
Sigras
Conglomo
#96 - 2015-03-21 02:31:16 UTC
StupidMonkeyBeSpankinIt wrote:
IDK, my .02, jump fatigue sucks. It totally kills my game play. Running multiple capital capable accounts, it is now frustrating as ever, to move around. I may have a particular play style, I wonder if anyone else has said anything from the perspective I am coming from. I know I have not said anything, I did not know this was coming up for change at the time, I have real life to deal with as well... I come back and all **** is breaking loose. Why is Eve changing SO much, its so unfamiliar now. I was so nice to log on and mine, explore, find some low sec pirates to chase, or sit and ship spin... I feel, now its frustrating, Ive put more investment in the game, over the last five years, I have seen so much change in Eve and I wonder why it all had to happen anyway. I get that things need to be improved, and CCP wants to improve their "product" but, at the expense of making Eve unattractive, or far more a pain in the ass than worth dealing with... won't you loose game players? Aren't you concerned at all, for the solo'rs or the nomads? Just for example, jumping what used to be a one JD jump, is now four... and with that four jumps, I have to wait 15 days before I can jump back...

To be honest, I want my ******* money back, Im pretty upset about it ( as upset as one will get about a stupid ass video game) and simply, Im looking for another game to play now. I feel raped. thank you ccp, for taking and changing stuff so rapidly, so much, drastically killing it for those invested, yet taking their time, and sticking to them selves... IDK if anyone else feels this way, I really dont care if you dont like my attitude about it, Im not really mad, im just bent... tbh, cause you know, I really love Eve... and I love playing it so much I ignore my gf for hours, and call in sick to work every month, just to stay home and play Eve... I feel like Eve is a huge part of my life, my interest, Space travel and exploration, science and geeky ****, ya know? You all know... you all are here playing it too... I get that there is a need maybe, to control what the big fish are doing in Capitals...

so along with my gripe, I provide a few suggestions?

for fleets with multiple capitals, provide a jump fatigue... or
for reduce the timer, and give back the range to the ships... or
knock down the fatigue timer and allow a skill to reduce the effects, and put a cap on the accumulated fatigue time one must wait before they can jump... or
perhaps, allow single capital ships to roam free, or with little effect with a fast recovery... or
provide a booster or implant, or drug one can take to reduce the effects of the fatigue... or something to get the solo capital pilot back in the game.

TL;DR
"I was using something completely broken to make myself and my corp overpowered, and CCP nerfed it which upsets me."

I know I'm being a bit sarcastic here, but honestly, back in the day you could AOE Doomsday through an open cyno from several systems away! There were plenty of people who used (I would say abused) that mechanic, and dedicated tons of time to their remote cyno doomsday defense.

Then CCP changed it and there was much wailing and gnashing of teeth, but it made the game better. Honestly, I would rather deal with CCP's mentality than EA's where they make a game and leave it broken until it dies.

You were using a game element that made you more powerful than you should have been. It got fixed. Sit down shut up and Cool deal with it Cool
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#97 - 2015-03-21 03:54:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Alvatore DiMarco
Bobbyd wrote:
CCP tackled this by;
1) Increasing the fuel used by jump drives making it more expensive. we now have to consider if its cost effective to move via jump drive.

2) Shortening most jump drives to 5 Ly

3) Removed death cloning so have to burn there gate to gate with cynos one after the other.

4) Added a jump cool down timer.

5) Adding a fatigue timer that increases exponentially.

the first four measures do reduce forced projection of large capital fleets with no major draw back to game play,

The fifth measure in my opinion is overkill.

Iv'e read a few posts from people supporting jump fatigue. for those people please ask your self do you support the fatigue timer or the outcome of the patch which added four measures to combat fast travel?

And if it is the actual fatigue timer, does it fill you with joy when you use a jump drive to see that timer go up and you now cannot use your jump drive again, or do you like the fact that it is hindering other players from using their jump drives to ruin your day?
Alright then, let's begin.

1) This is exactly the point.

2) I see nothing wrong with this, as it effectively increases the size of the galaxy

3) Good.

4) When you consider a device like a Jump Drive, it's not unreasonable that it should need to flush coolant through its system or go through some other post-jump self-check/self-maintenance before returning to operational status.

5) Good thinking on CCP's part. If it was simply additive instead of exponential, the timer would increase pretty slowly and people would just brute-force their way through it without really caring about the accumulation.

I support both the changes to combat/noncombat fast travel and the timer. Not because someone is prevented from ruining my day but because it puts extreme pressure on the mega-empires to crack and break into smaller factions as they starve for targets and turn on themselves in a desperate hunger for things to kill. It also makes geography important since now where you live has a direct correlation to how much pew you get; living in deep blue null or remote areas is now undesirable unless you're absolutely a nullbear who wants to spend all day PvEing and shoving daisies into your exhaust port.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#98 - 2015-03-21 05:04:56 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:


As I said in my post before this one, I will be able to functionally ignore it in a few days anyways as I have multiple accounts. That's not the point, the point is actually a philosophical one: A game should have balance (and the jump mechanics changes were their to balance force projection), but without actually punishing people for having fun.



Translation : I already have a way to get around the limitation the game put on jump drive/bridge but they should be made less harsh anyway because :reasons:.
Tycho VI
Horde Armada
Pandemic Horde
#99 - 2015-03-21 05:49:26 UTC
yeah i think that the fatigue accumulated when using a jump bridge should be on a different scale then using a capital jump drive.
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#100 - 2015-03-21 07:56:59 UTC
Tycho VI wrote:
yeah i think that the fatigue accumulated when using a jump bridge should be on a different scale then using a capital jump drive.


Then I'll just send my jump-drive-equipped ship through the jump bridge network as far as I can instead of using the jump drive. Thus is the travel nerf counter-nerfed.

No.