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Balancing Amarr BS/large lasers
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Whittorical Quandary
Amarrian Infinity
#41 - 2015-03-16 23:25:36 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
Interesting bit of information: not all battleships (from other races) can equip their largest long-range weapons with a stiff tank AND utility... not without using some fitting mods and/or downgrading other systems.
Some examples:
- the Maelstorm fitting a full rack of 1400mm artys leave no extra PG for any other mod.
- the Megathron has some CPU issues when you try to fit it with 425mm rails with tank and utility.
- the Dominix does not have the CPU or PG to fit full rack of 425mm railguns with a tank and utility.

Another bit of information: with long range weapons you generally have to make TRADEOFFS in other aspects to make them work properly. This is intentional. Because range is a huge advantage.


However, can't the T1 Raven fit everything?

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elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#42 - 2015-03-17 01:00:28 UTC
Xequecal wrote:
afkalt wrote:
These are the things you trade when you start hitting out to these, 200+ ranges. I never said it was smart.


Sniping past 150km is worthless as you can be probed down and warped to.


Xequecal dear,
don't you miss the old days when sniping to 200km was a thing?

There is a old video from that time on youtube where a 'large fleet' was fighting each other from across the grid - 100 rail-Megas on one side and beam 100 Apocs on the other.

And for everyone who doesn't know, that was a really big thing back in 2005/6.

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This is the law of ship progression!

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elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#43 - 2015-03-17 01:01:25 UTC
Whittorical Quandary wrote:
ShahFluffers wrote:
Interesting bit of information: not all battleships (from other races) can equip their largest long-range weapons with a stiff tank AND utility... not without using some fitting mods and/or downgrading other systems.
Some examples:
- the Maelstorm fitting a full rack of 1400mm artys leave no extra PG for any other mod.
- the Megathron has some CPU issues when you try to fit it with 425mm rails with tank and utility.
- the Dominix does not have the CPU or PG to fit full rack of 425mm railguns with a tank and utility.

Another bit of information: with long range weapons you generally have to make TRADEOFFS in other aspects to make them work properly. This is intentional. Because range is a huge advantage.


However, can't the T1 Raven fit everything?


Missiles are not guns. Yet when you fit torpedo launchers you have to do the very same tradeoffs.

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This is the law of ship progression!

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Tusker Crazinski
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#44 - 2015-03-17 02:32:03 UTC
elitatwo wrote:
Xequecal wrote:
afkalt wrote:
These are the things you trade when you start hitting out to these, 200+ ranges. I never said it was smart.


Sniping past 150km is worthless as you can be probed down and warped to.


Xequecal dear,
don't you miss the old days when sniping to 200km was a thing?
yes as matter in fact
Lienzo
Amanuensis
#45 - 2015-03-17 03:48:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Lienzo
I honestly don't remember if Tachs ever got their fitting requirements tweaked at any point, but I do remember that in ye olden days, lasers had naturally higher damage than other weapon systems. This was the reason why Amarr ships all had laser cap use reduction bonuses instead of damage bonuses. Traditionally, of all the damage mods, lasers users got the most stick based on the increased RoF penalty.

It could all just be a forgotten balance holdover.
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#46 - 2015-03-17 09:26:26 UTC
Xequecal wrote:
afkalt wrote:
These are the things you trade when you start hitting out to these, 200+ ranges. I never said it was smart.


Sniping past 150km is worthless as you can be probed down and warped to.


I know - point is the problem with Tachs ain't the fitting. You can make an acceptable sniper for with it, it's just that such a meta is worthless.

If it wasn't, the tank compromises are fine, because range tank.
Tusker Crazinski
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#47 - 2015-03-17 11:49:08 UTC
Lienzo wrote:
I honestly don't remember if Tachs ever got their fitting requirements tweaked at any point, but I do remember that in ye olden days, lasers had naturally higher damage than other weapon systems. This was the reason why Amarr ships all had laser cap use reduction bonuses instead of damage bonuses. Traditionally, of all the damage mods, lasers users got the most stick based on the increased RoF penalty.

It could all just be a forgotten balance holdover.


back then sniper battleships actually had little to no tank, maybe some resist mods to make reps stick better, but other than that it was all Stabs, Sinks, TEs, TCs and Sebos, oh my.... and before my time in the game there were no stacking penalties.......you could fit as much heat sinks or gyro stabs as your CPU would allow.
Uriam Khanid
New Machinarium Corporation
#48 - 2015-03-20 01:13:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Uriam Khanid
guys, tachyons is not a problem. The line of ship is MAIN problem.
Try to fit Abaddon and Apoc's with hybrids and projectives. You will get excelent platforms, for Abaddon you even get a huge tank.
Now, how many from you use Armageddon Navy Issue? How many will try to use him again?
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#49 - 2015-03-20 03:04:09 UTC
Uriam Khanid wrote:
guys, tachyons is not a problem. The line of ship is MAIN problem.
Try to fit Abaddon and Apoc's with hybrids and projectives. You will get excelent platforms, for Abaddon you even get a huge tank.
Now, how many from you use Armageddon Navy Issue? How many will try to use him again?


Pretty sure this means it is in fact the guns that are the problem, not the ships.

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