Player Features and Ideas Discussion

I just noticed I forgot to disable the drones on my example fit. The 25% did sound suspicious, but I didn't figure out why, I just compared apples to oranges.

I can see that the flight time on the Cruise is long, but part of what I said earlier would already make them faster. I guess a little extra couldn't hurt. I looked at Zkillboard and it seems Barghests are split between Cruise and Rapid Heavy.

If we keep the drf as it is my point about the skills being overpowered stands. At the very least the skills should be nerfed and the base stats bonused to balance it out.

Why does short range large missile have worse application than long range large missile when every other weapon feature better application on the short range/high DPS version?

Because they need it. Missiles have fewer options for boosting tracking than guns (positioning doesn't matter, target painters are limited in effectiveness and range, webs are limited in range except on specialised ships, etc. etc.)

I was about to say it's not rocket science but... oh yeah...

I don't understand why you think a skill needs nerfed on a weapon system that is lackluster. Just because the skills don't match turret skill progressions does not mean that they are broken.

Missiles are a different weapon system, they behave very differently. The skills and how they scale are built around their own uniqueness and there is no need to compare them directly to turret skills.

What needs compared is the effectiveness of missiles to turrets. And as you can see from the feedback so far in this thread, missile users could use more of a buff than a nerf.

If you want to overhaul the system to buff some areas and nerf others in order to fix a broken system that is fine. But make sure it is a broken system to warrant design time for an overhaul not just because it is better at 1 thing vs another system. Not all weapons need to have the same benefits. Variety and being different are good. The weapon system could use a balance pass I agree, but I think existing numbers could easily be tweaked without adding/removing or drastically changing one the skills.

As a missile user, I also think that application modules are sorely needed. Right now there is no way to improve damage application of a larger missile to a smaller target other than skill points. While turret and drone systems do have tracking enhancers. This means that lower skilled pilots can use equipment to offset lack of trained skills, while a missile pilot can only wait to train up their skills. This alone could really bring heavy missiles into a much less niche fitting.

Edit: I know TP and Web are useful, but you have to wait on cycle times or have multiple modules just to switch between targets. And as mentioned web range is ver limited for the average missle boat. Missiles are already the delayed damage system, waiting to get a TP moved to a target can be aggravating and I would prefer the option for a module that enhanced the weapon system outright.

No, there are rigs (rigors, flares) that improve missile performance against smaller hulls. There are modules (stasis webs, target painters) that improve damage application for all ships and weapon types. There is no missile-specific module that improves missile velocity, explosion radius or explosion velocity.

Many of us have been requesting this for the last few years. I'm not necessarily holding my breath at this point...

No, long range missiles need better damage application, because they don't have as many mechanisms as turrets to mitigate that problem. I didn't say anything about torps, please get a clue.

ranges are a bit strong on most missile types really, e.g. HAM's and torps having the same range
light missiles apply too well too smaller sig ships

10% bonuses too missile range is more powerful than similar bonuses on turret ships. e.g. 10% falloff or 10% optimal onyl buffs 50% of there range profile where as the missile bonus applies too the whole range profile.

The problem is that torpedoes are closely tied into Stealth Bombers, so any change you make to torpedo damage application has the potential to create an imbalance. But I agree - there's almost no reason to use torpedoes for the small gain in raw damage since cruise missiles have better damage application and can cover all ranges.

Well, outside of PvE anyway...