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Dev blog: Politics by Other Means: Sovereignty Phase Two

First post First post First post
Author
FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#2061 - 2015-03-05 04:04:38 UTC
Mr Omniblivion wrote:
Gevlon Goblin wrote:
The problem with the Entosis trolling isn't that it cannot be countered. It can. The famous "trollceptor" can all be countered by a Rifter with a T1 Entosis link orbiting the structure at 5 km, freezing the timer.

The problem is that countering Entosis trolling is so boring gameplay that you'll wish you'd still be grinding stations in Drakes. Either a mobile group needs to run up and down in the region whacking moles, or every system needs to have guards who just do nothing (or mine/rat at the keyboard) for 4 hours and respond to the ping. If they fail, everyone yell at them because 2 days later 10 nodes needs to be captured. If they win every time, they spent 4 hours of their lives at the keyboard with a handful of trivial killmails.

Again: 4 hours of focused gameplay and practically no result. At least you could watch TV between reloads with the Drake.

The attacker should commit something worth killing, so the defenders - if did their job well - go home with a nice killboard.


It happened. A Gevlon post that I actually agree with.

I think I've just won Eve.


When you find people who typically despise each other agreeing, that's a sign that they are probably right.

Eve has consequences - but not in this system. When the attacker brings a gang of almost-uncatchable interceptors and the defender responds with brick-tanked T1 cruisers, the system is stupid. That is what most of Rise and Fozzie's changes have lead to as they have trashed most doctrines that have to commit to a fight in favor of the runaway or throwaway meta. Yes, it is good cheap fun for the newbies, but it's a kick in the balls to an eight year vet who likes to use the capitals and Supercapitals he has trained for and ground out through hours of work.

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

Ereilian
Doomheim
#2062 - 2015-03-05 04:05:16 UTC
Okay, someone correct me if I am incorrect, but TCU/IHUB's will still require online times of 8 hours and will STILL require bashing until they come online. True/False?
Lena Lazair
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#2063 - 2015-03-05 04:06:23 UTC
Mr Omniblivion wrote:
Lena Lazair wrote:
Provi will be far safer than it's ever been under this new system.


I agree 100% please implement these changes as-is so that we can all save freeport Provi


I detect sarcasm. But please tell me how this 200-man inty fleet is actually going to even START the timer on any structure in Provi? An area of space where CVA members flying brick-tacked armor subcaps will happily sit at 0 with a defensive E-link for 4 hours a day and then RP later in the forums about how they defended the glorious holy empire from heathen invaders?

An area of space where people actually, like... mine. For realz. And run ALL the anomalies, even the crap ones. Their industry and military indexes across the region are non-zero! Your inty fleet will need 20 to 30 minutes to E-link a single structure almost anywhere, which will be defended by 10 CVA RP diehards in spider-tanked Mallers who can absolutely out-RP you in local chat the entire time.

I'm pretty sure provi residents won't be the first to break under this scenario.
OldWolf69
Militaris Industries
Northern Coalition.
#2064 - 2015-03-05 04:13:20 UTC  |  Edited by: OldWolf69
Harrasment favouring changes won't change null. No matter how many idiots would love this, or how many other idiots hypocritical advocate for this. This happened when they introduced the spaceaids. Where are now all the working class heroes telling everyone how amazing and wonderfull it will be? Also spliting the game in precise timezones would lead to time-zone based alliances. Wich is absolutely bullcrap, and would deny totally the spirit of the game.
There's absolutely no incentive for conflict in null besides resources. Wich at the moment are pretty lacking, after all the nerfs and "balances". Of couse, CCP can kill the game there by just making the space imposible to use decently. Probably they will do it too. Just because a "genius" there pretends THIS will bring people down. Or at least that's what we should believe. But i suspect this will be coupled with another low priced plex sale for "new alts". Cheap efficient **** done with untrained chars and low investment thing. Oh shure, there will be a lot of geniuses telling there's a lot of small conflict in null. Stop the bullcrap, it's not. It is a lot of small harassment in null. Just that. Want conflict? Make people fight. Is actually sooooo easy. Safe pvp killed all the fun.
We might think CCP is after pvp. Have a good look. They not. Is just about bussines and as few work they can get. And, for god's sake, i can understand this: it's a game just for US. For them, is a bussines. It has nothing to do with how awesome it is, because it is not anymore. It has nothing to do with how balanced or fair it is, because it's not. It has to do only with sales. They don't give a empty f*** about the playerbase's opinion, except it sells plex. Wake up, lol.Lol There's absolutely no reason CCP would want a populated nullsec, if this does not sell enough plex.
Lena Lazair
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#2065 - 2015-03-05 04:17:55 UTC
FT Diomedes wrote:
Eve has consequences - but not in this system. When the attacker brings a gang of almost-uncatchable interceptors and the defender responds with brick-tanked T1 cruisers, the system is stupid.


This will only be happening when the attacker has no intention of doing anything. Which is fine, but they'll get bored of it once they've flipped all remote sov no one cares about and everything else they try to flip is always defended by locals in T1 cruisers. When these roaming inty gangs become totally ineffective and no longer flip anything because everything left is actually actively defended by locals; when they never get into ANY engagements because no one cares about their presence; when they are basically blue-balling themselves on a daily basis; how often do you think people will continue to sign up for those fleets?

Sure, they'll never disappear entirely, and they serve the important role of carrion birds in cleaning out the dead sov of null. But other than the initial feast gorging on dead sov no one gives a crap about, it'll become nothing but the occasional background noise.

The process of actually taking and HOLDING sov from an organized defender is no easier than before, and requires a considerable commitment of pilots and time. Brave won't be doing anything to NA. renters in 200 man inty fleets; they would need to dedicate actual meaningful subcap fleets to a prolonged warfront if they wanted to actually claim any of that space for real.
OldWolf69
Militaris Industries
Northern Coalition.
#2066 - 2015-03-05 04:24:10 UTC
Lena Lazair wrote:
FT Diomedes wrote:
Eve has consequences - but not in this system. When the attacker brings a gang of almost-uncatchable interceptors and the defender responds with brick-tanked T1 cruisers, the system is stupid.


This will only be happening when the attacker has no intention of doing anything. Which is fine, but they'll get bored of it once they've flipped all remote sov no one cares about and everything else they try to flip is always defended by locals in T1 cruisers. When these roaming inty gangs become totally ineffective and no longer flip anything because everything left is actually actively defended by locals; when they never get into ANY engagements because no one cares about their presence; when they are basically blue-balling themselves on a daily basis; how often do you think people will continue to sign up for those fleets?

Sure, they'll never disappear entirely, and they serve the important role of carrion birds in cleaning out the dead sov of null. But other than the initial feast gorging on dead sov no one gives a crap about, it'll become nothing but the occasional background noise.

The process of actually taking and HOLDING sov from an organized defender is no easier than before, and requires a considerable commitment of pilots and time. Brave won't be doing anything to NA. renters in 200 man inty fleets; they would need to dedicate actual meaningful subcap fleets to a prolonged warfront if they wanted to actually claim any of that space for real.

NOONE will want to take space lol. Everybody will just want to destroy other's sov. That's all. Will be fun for like 2 weeks. Ok, after that what?
Vigilanta
S0utherN Comfort
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#2067 - 2015-03-05 04:29:10 UTC
Aryth wrote:
Devi Loches wrote:
Eli Apol wrote:
Violent Morgana wrote:
So I have gang of 20 ceptors, fit for extreme speed (20km/s for example and 150km locking range) and t2 Entosis Link. Who/What can stop my gang from reinforcing the whole region? The module needs to either disable any prop mods or make the ship stationary like siege does. That will give you the fights you are trying to force.

Also whats up with this prime time? Should we only have USTZ alliance, EUTZ alliance etc in huge blocks focused on very specific 4hour window in time?

20 (or fewer) Kitsunes.

So thats 2bil in intys countered by 400mil in ewar frigs.


So far this seems like the only reasonable counter to the trollceptors I've seen. It keeps the risks of defense roughly equal to that of the attackers. (Not the insanely expensive interceptors mentioned above, just the basic interceptors that would be common. Interceptor fleets vs ewar fleets.)


The main issue is not the ISK vs ISK. It is the huge imbalance of afk cloaking attacker time vs defender vigilance. Because the system quickly spirals into massive consequences with minimal time investment on the part of attackers it will result in a horribly lopsided mechanic.

For example, lets say blackops/reavers park 20-50 dudes afk cloaking in a region and their only goal is to flip/kill things the moment people aren't looking. So your choice as a defender is to have hyper vigilance every day during your period across all assets or suffer massive consequences. I doubt how many people realize how bad IHuBs are to deal with.

The only investment on an attackers part is an alt and some brief attention spans when they feel like watching. The investment on the defenders part is a period of hyper vigilance across every system they own. Multiply this by the attackers being able to do this across all of null at random and you see the problem. If you tell people they can lock dudes out of their capital with a single real fight then lawl. Why would anyone store any amount of material in a null station. Move to NPC null or a lowsec border system.

This is going to heavily incentivize ice-bergging again. The timers basically need to preserve 2-3 fights before huge consequences (freeport) and have a FAR bigger bonus to high indexes. A 5/5 index system should take at least 1 hour if not 2. At least until someone fixes freaking industry indexes god.


Well written sir, you basically said what many other would not in this thread, its not like a ceptor or other small ship with an entosis module is going to be facing active defense every moment of the 4 or more hour window depending on the final version. This is why SBUS were put in to dominion sov, to give the defender a chance to get ready to fight over the initial reinforcement timer. SBUS were actually extreme succesful with this with many fights and hot drops occuring over SBU control. I personally think that under the new system the SBU should continue to play a role in making a system vulnerable with a few noteable changes. 1. reduce online time from 3 hours to 30minutes or an hour. reduce the hitpoints on the sbu by about a 1/3. This encoragers active attacker defence but does not leave the defender open to being attacked whenever "just because". (i would also suggest a cost rebalance on the materials required to build an SBU to match.

Of the many bad things about dominion the SBU mechanic was not one of them. bring sbus into the new system to decide system vulnerability, reduce SBU cost (aim should be 50-70 mil per), reduce online timers and hitpoints to match.

I also agree with your statement in reguard to the stations, with one timer deciding freeport mode or not it extremely decentralizes staging in a conquerable station which really should be the case, purely because of how easy it becomes in freeport mode to get yourself and your assets stuck in said station. I and i suspect many others would support the command node mechanics + 2 timers of 24-48 hours instead of 1 timer and freeport mode.

Would be interested to hear your thoughts on this aryth
Terraniel Aurelius
Space Wizards.
Tactical Narcotics Team
#2068 - 2015-03-05 04:29:18 UTC
Benny Ohu wrote:
Terraniel Aurelius wrote:
Also, what is the point of having the command nodes show up anywhere within the constellation? Shouldn't they be limited to the sov that is being attacked? I mean, it makes sense if a single entity holds the constellation, but if it's just a single system held by an alliance/corp, then it seems arbitrarily tedious to have to run around all over the place to defend your sov. Sort of like fighting a war in a different country to defend your borders.

the stated goals are to split fights for the sake of tactical interest and to avoid them being tidi-ed to tedium. the constellation thing's weird but maybe it was seen as a necessity to achieve those goals?


I get the splitting fights idea, but I'm assuming you won't have 500 people trying to move into a single system for their sov. Not like it really matters. We who have several hundreds of pvp people in our alliances will still be able to maintain the space that we want/need against any unorganized rabble. Organized rabble on the other hand, probably already have sov and can't leave it undefended to come and attack our sov.

I feel like what is needed is some sort of border system, where the more sov you have, the weaker your borders are, and more defenders are required. Right now it's pretty much impossible to stop a hostile cyno-capable force from getting behind your lines with even a modicum of effort, so you have to control everything to the choke points. I don't think we want to control all that space, but I feel like we have to, to maintain supply routes and keep any potential threats from establishing a foothold. Once inside a region, there are essentially no more choke points with cyno-bridging entities.
Optimist Bob
Perkone
Caldari State
#2069 - 2015-03-05 04:30:31 UTC
Eli Apol wrote:
Optimist Bob wrote:
Might I respectfully suggest that CCP consider one small change.
That rather than reinforcing with an Entosis module incrementally, an attacker must have his Entosis module on the sovereignty unit being attacked for the full timer.
Thus, any form of LOL reinforcing may be reverse trolled by simply waiting until the timer has nearly expired before decloaking a Falcon, jamming the aggressor and resetting the entire process.
Thus, an attacker must be committed to the conquest, or run the risk of being trolled himself.

Maybe too harsh to have it fully reset each time but also it backs up my prior suggestion for marauders to be the uber entosis ships with ewar immunity but no time penalty :)


I agree. In retrospect, a full reset might be harsh. Perhaps as well as the time delay after re-lock, a percentage increase in the time needed to complete the action based on Entosis time already inflicted would serve.
The idea of someone adding a minute, then coming back an hour later and adding another minute seems absurd.
Although, if someone were to leave while halfway through damaging a station service, my understanding is that the defender could re-establish it back to full again. So maybe this is a moot point.
Lena Lazair
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#2070 - 2015-03-05 04:34:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Lena Lazair
OldWolf69 wrote:
NOONE will want to take space lol. Everybody will just want to destroy other's sov. That's all. Will be fun for like 2 weeks. Ok, after that what?


No one wants to take anyone's space now, either.

2 weeks of fun and a daily system of sov harassment (to which you will soon have to start committing fleets slightly more scary than roaming inty gangs if you want to accomplish any actual harassment) is better than absolute stagnation. More importantly, we'll then have a sov system that no longer serves as its own deterrent to sov conflict.

Obviously CCP still needs to address the issues of nullsec life, industrial/mining attractiveness, player density limits with regard to anoms being primary income sources, etc. But NO amount of tweaks to these incentives will accomplish anything as long as structure grinds remain the deterrent to sov warfare and supercaps remain the deterrent to structure grinds.

This is completely ignoring the number of short and medium term conflicts that will arise from small groups no longer needing to pay for supercap fleet leases. They can put their own name on the map, simplify their PI ownership, grab a couple of moons, save money by not paying rent, etc. There are a lot of immediate incentives to drive conflict once the structure grind deterrent is removed. The cost required to take and hold sov you already live in, which no one else really wants to own, and which you will already need to defend locally on a daily basis, is going to go down drastically. The economics behind the current balance of power/rentals is going to shift radically.

But yeah, long term health still depends on CCP addressing all the other nullsec issues. Luckily their dev blog said as much.
Vigilanta
S0utherN Comfort
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#2071 - 2015-03-05 04:36:00 UTC
Querns wrote:
Believe it or not, when I describe the interceptor's potential prowess in the new system, I'm not using it as a shield to protect I and mine's way of life. Believe me when I say that Goonswarm Federation's ability to optimize any game system precludes any fantasies you might have about our future. After all, they do listen to me. I am careful to avoid this, as it's way too easy to tear down and be used against me.

Think of what I say in more apolitical terms. Having an agenda simply isn't necessary when my point doesn't require it.


In fact I think it could be said as the mechanics are currently presented goonswarm and the CFC as a whole would be at the greatest advantage due to the numbers at there disposal, and the number of fc's they have willing to engage in les than enjoyable activities. So hats off to our goon cousins for honestly viewing the proposed new mechnics without much bias.

Anyone who imagines these mechancis as written will be a gunshot to CFc knee is delusional, no alliance is better at leveraging numbers and # of timers to their advantage. As organized as n3 can sometimes be, they are even better in this reguard. As someone who has had region commander access briefly i can tell you that organizationally they are miles ahead of the rest of us.
Vigilanta
S0utherN Comfort
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#2072 - 2015-03-05 04:41:45 UTC
Gorgof Intake wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Eli Apol wrote:
Mostlyharmlesss wrote:
No, that's the point. We're not going to provide any content to whatever alliance holds the space. We're going to take their sov with an interceptor fleet because we dictate the battles and they will be unable to catch all of us. Which is essentially almost like Dominion sov where n+1 always wins.

You can't dictate a battle when you're all in ships that do <100 dps. Sure you can cyno some caps in to one or two systems at a time, maybe even try moving them through gates to assist in multiple command point fights but when you're dedicating your numbers into essentially useless combat hulls you won't be able to hold a grid to complete your RFs or captures without bringing in reinforcements in far more killable ships.


We can torch half of the south in less than an hour with said ships under these changes. We dont even need to fire a shot.



Where are you people getting these numbers from? Your arguments are based on a wild assumption someone made on the first page that you could fit this module to a ceptor, of which i can find absolutely none, nada, zip, nothing offical as to what the fitting requirments would be.

After a 100page threadnaught im sure the Devs get it. Fitting these on ceptors will be a bad idea and totally OP. Give Fozzie and Rise and the rest of the Dev team dealing with Sov and ship balancing a little credit.


I have watched CCP mess up 1 sov system change and countless other revamps, they honestly have not earned that credit. If anything they have earned exactly what they are getting, which is players speaking out and voicing there concerns. If it was there intention form the beginning the devblog would have said, something like "these modules will have a high enough fitting requirement to make them impracticable or impossible to fit on xx sized hulls". I will grant that it may have been an oversight while dealing with the larger issue of sov and the mechanics behind it, but it was the first thing i thought of when i read the blog as well.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#2073 - 2015-03-05 04:42:11 UTC
Vigilanta wrote:
Querns wrote:
Believe it or not, when I describe the interceptor's potential prowess in the new system, I'm not using it as a shield to protect I and mine's way of life. Believe me when I say that Goonswarm Federation's ability to optimize any game system precludes any fantasies you might have about our future. After all, they do listen to me. I am careful to avoid this, as it's way too easy to tear down and be used against me.

Think of what I say in more apolitical terms. Having an agenda simply isn't necessary when my point doesn't require it.


In fact I think it could be said as the mechanics are currently presented goonswarm and the CFC as a whole would be at the greatest advantage due to the numbers at there disposal, and the number of fc's they have willing to engage in les than enjoyable activities. So hats off to our goon cousins for honestly viewing the proposed new mechnics without much bias.

Anyone who imagines these mechancis as written will be a gunshot to CFc knee is delusional, no alliance is better at leveraging numbers and # of timers to their advantage. As organized as n3 can sometimes be, they are even better in this reguard. As someone who has had region commander access briefly i can tell you that organizationally they are miles ahead of the rest of us.

Oh DARKNESS., I remember seeing you when we were in ladyscarlet's rental space recently as part of the group that doesn't exist.

How about those sov ehp nerfs, huh. Made making timers so much easier.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

El'Grimm
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2074 - 2015-03-05 04:46:39 UTC
Lena Lazair wrote:
Mostlyharmlesss wrote:
If the changes goes through like they are now, I'm unironically going to take a 200 man interceptor fleet to Provi and reinforce the entire region in 4 hours.


Provi is the group that will benefit the most from this change.

The E-link world is a world where you don't need caps/supercaps to take and hold unattractive sov. You don't even need to win most of your PvP engagements to take and hold unattractive sov. The only requirement to take and hold unattractive sov is to be the only group that wants to live in that particular unattractive sov. The only people that seem to want to live in provi is provi. And they are pretty much the definition of a group of people actually living in their space on a daily basis.

The only thing that has kept provi alive this long is that no one took it from them and then made them pay rent, because everyone has a bit of a soft spot for provi and it wasn't worth the risk of accidentally starting a real war with someone important. Post E-links, provi will be forever protected by the fact that their space is simply worthless, and you can no longer force ANYone to pay rent for space your alliance is close to/living in.

Provi will be far safer than it's ever been under this new system.


Well Your wrong.
Current mechanics dictate that structures are the target, said structures need huge resources to combat, and any coalition that comes to provi trying to engage those targets not only has to fight us, but EVERY enemy they have acquired, looking to kill them and the assets they bring. Our ability to make everyone who has come to provi bleed isk, combined with the literal billions and billions of hp's of structures to affect our region is what has saved us. Space quality is irrelevant for griefing and trolling. If the enemy comes is cheap assed, or simply no fun to engage ships, no-one is gonna want to help you.

I said this in a previous post, yes by the new proposed mechanics we are in theory one of the strongest regions in all of eve for this proposed expansion, our entire coalition is pretty much crammed into one region, and our industry on that chart floating around is the best index in all of new eden (lol yeah ours is 1, everyone else is 0). But I see virtually no actual benefit from this, larger than us entities will simply N+1 us, and smaller entities will troll us so badly it will make the game ****, as we chase trolls who ping timers for a chase. Our new players will get farmed by better players who ping timers, and old players who have dedicated the game time to building up the region are already starting to quit as this change shows them that they are unwanted in this game.

This expansion does so much to encourage small skirmish and harassment warfare (shock horror something fozzie was known for as a player). But how it improves the game of thousands of sov bloc players, who don't want some ****** skirmish no depth pvp, in this format just begs the question of how ccp can possibly think this is an improvement.

The cost and time of being a sov holder, compared to the cost and time of attacking someone who has sov with this new system is going to make what is already a vacant wasteland for most of null even worse. Even the big bloc industrialists, I bet, will be looking at this and going.. yeah screw null industry, the risk of loosing everything because of a few ****** days just isn't worth it.

This rolls out in june apparently, if it rolls as it is, the 4th of July weekend will open up every flaw it has, it'll expose the TZ blatant flaws, losses to the superblocs proving a point, will likely cause the largest unsub ever, small alliances thinking this is gonna be easy will loose hundreds of pretty ships, so there disappointment will add to the mix too.

So yeah provi probably is better suited than many to deal with this... and I still say it suck balls.
OldWolf69
Militaris Industries
Northern Coalition.
#2075 - 2015-03-05 04:47:34 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
Lena Lazair wrote:
OldWolf69 wrote:
NOONE will want to take space lol. Everybody will just want to destroy other's sov. That's all. Will be fun for like 2 weeks. Ok, after that what?


No one wants to take anyone's space now, either.

2 weeks of fun and a daily system of sov harassment (to which you will soon have to start committing fleets slightly more scary than roaming inty gangs if you want to accomplish any actual harassment) is better than absolute stagnation. More importantly, we'll then have a sov system that no longer serves as its own deterrent to sov conflict.

Obviously CCP still needs to address the issues of nullsec life, industrial/mining attractiveness, player density limits with regard to anoms being primary income sources, etc. But NO amount of tweaks to these incentives will accomplish anything as long as structure grinds remain the deterrent to sov warfare and supercaps remain the deterrent to structure grinds.

This is completely ignoring the number of short and medium term conflicts that will arise from small groups no longer needing to pay for supercap fleet leases. They can put their own name on the map, simplify their PI ownership, grab a couple of moons, save money by not paying rent, etc. There are a lot of immediate incentives to drive conflict once the structure grind deterrent is removed. The cost required to take and hold sov you already live in, which no one else really wants to own, and which you will already need to defend locally on a daily basis, is going to go down drastically. The economics behind the current balance of power/rentals is going to shift radically.

But yeah, long term health still depends on CCP addressing all the other nullsec issues. Luckily their dev blog said as much.

Is it just me, or are you trying to tell me that renters will take space? Hiseccers will come to null? Last time i heard this Greyscale moved jobs.

*Snip* Please refrain from personal attacks. ISD Ezwal.
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2076 - 2015-03-05 04:53:18 UTC
the sargent wrote:
It's funny, everyone tells CCP they want a occupancy based SOV system. When CCP comes up with a system that takes the basic concept of "occupancy" and uses it as a mechanic everyone start whining about how it will ruin everything. Seriously guys calm down if it doesn't work out guess what? it will be fixed in a couple of months because of the shorter release schedule. Give the system a chance first before going "IT'S THE END!"

I mean seriously every time CCP changes something to do will null sec its "the end of null sec as we know it," and yes that is true but just because it's the end of one system doesn't mean the new system is going to be complete trash.

Damn, sorry for the minor wall of text.

CCP has a long history of breaking stuff and walking away from it. Not sure where you get this faith that they will fix it after the fact.

I also don't see how "occupancy" is given all that much more than lip service in this blog.

Want to talk? Join Cara's channel in game: House Forelli

Vigilanta
S0utherN Comfort
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#2077 - 2015-03-05 04:54:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Vigilanta
Quote:

Oh DARKNESS., I remember seeing you when we were in ladyscarlet's rental space recently as part of the group that doesn't exist.

How about those sov ehp nerfs, huh. Made making timers so much easier.


I actually liked the EHP nerfs, I thought they made timers and conquest easier for small groups without , giving to much additional benefit to large groups. The EHP nerfs if anything were one of the better changes CCP has made in the last year. I think more small iteration like EHP changes on sov structures coupled with mechanics shakeups to spread out fighting (i.e. the command nodes) is the way to go. Much easier to see how well mechanics work when you add them in a few at a time and with the new release cadence much more feasable to spend several releases building or modfying a sov system. The current revamp attempt is reminiscent of the jesus feature days where CCP is throwing a hail mary and hoping it sticks.

EDIT: There is some stuff in here that I really really like that i think adds to nullsec conquest and gameplay, but it is mixed in with equal parts horrid and bad. the concept of command nodes across constellations = good. The bad being harped on pretty well so i wont go into detail. But the key here is that only in the last year have we even started to see iteration on dominion, which was promised on its launch (and never happend). Even what we see here couples key points of dominion (ihubs, tcus ect) in with the new system, the vulnerability period and how vulnerability is decided along with the entosis module are the key points of contention.
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support
Goonswarm Federation
#2078 - 2015-03-05 05:14:26 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
*Snip* Please refrain from using profanity. ISD Ezwal.

if you had said ishtars or tengus i might believe it

even then a group that can contest one beacon is going to have trouble contesting the 242 simultaneous timers that the other interceptors are making

75 stations + 2 * 84 systems btw
Gevlin
Pirates of the Caribbean.
Phantom Horde
#2079 - 2015-03-05 05:21:21 UTC
I know some people hated the grind of damaging and repairing. I actually enjoyed it. Bringing my big ship to spend 15 mins repairing or shooting something.

I did not have much fun when in the CFC we would simply blob caps, then jump out. The thrill of being one of only a few dreads or triage carriers either destroying or repairing something while you had people set up as scouts was enjoyable. Sorta like mining but with other tools. Yup you guessed it I am mainly a miner.

Someday I will have the time to play. For now it is mining afk in High sec. In Cheap ships

Yeoman18
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2080 - 2015-03-05 05:23:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Yeoman18
I feel as though a few tweaks to your proposal would allow you to accomplish your goals while eliminating the easy griefing.

1. Reduce the range of the T2 capture mod to 50km. That puts the all potential ships trying to capture in range of bonused range webs/points, but still allows for kiting with faster ships if specialized defense ships to counter are not brought.

2. Limit Entosis modules to cruisers or larger. I'm really not a fan of the idea of frigates/destroyers capturing sov. However, my other points would still cover the main problems with using frigates/destroyers if the entosis module was not limited to cruiser or larger.

3. Allow TCU's to be deployed close to POSes. This will allow defenders to create a decent defense against smaller fleets for their sov at all times without a presence. A reasonably set up fleet can overcome any pos defense, but sending individuals or groups of 2 or 3 to grief many systems would not be viable. This also gives the defenders an advantage when defending against small/medium fleets. I also wouldn't be opposed to allocating more PG/CPU to POSes to allow for better defenses.

4. Remove the 4 hour vulnerable window. This alienates alternate timezones and discourages multi-timezone alliances. I understand the point of this window but it won't translate well in the game. Players who cannot login during the vulnerability time will never get to see a defense fleet. If you must, allow defenders to choose an 8 hour window where it's invulnerable. This would still provide ample opportunity for all to attack/defend any sov while giving the defenders the benefit of protecting their most vulnerable time.


I really do like the ideas behind your proposed changes, but they need tweaking. I believe my modifications listed above would help accomplish your listed goals without making sov defense a daily 4 hour chase fest.. I hope you read and consider this post. Thank you for your time.

A 5 year eve player,
Yeoman18