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Covert Cyno in Highsec

Author
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat
Snuffed Out
#41 - 2015-03-04 15:05:29 UTC
Alexa Stryker wrote:
Stalence wrote:
Bump.

Please make this happen. I don't think it would be game breaking in anyways and may even fix a lot of the complaints people have about high sec war decs.



Can you clarify why covert cyno in high sec would fix some of the high sec war dec complaints please.
I'm just interested of in the reasons and insights.


Can your not undock from station because wardeccers have you camped in? we have just the solution for you.

Call 1800-blops-drops-4-u

maybe a new profession huh wardeccer blop drops, pay as you go 1 off service :)

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

jurgen b
Papal Zouaves
#42 - 2015-03-04 15:10:55 UTC
Kestral Anneto wrote:
your kidding right? that would be to much like common sense, after all its a COVERT cyno, designed not to be detected, ofc it can be blocked, to protect the highsec carebears.
On a serious note, i've always wondered why you cant light it in highsec, it would give us a way of actually smuggling stuff, and as someone said before, its not exactly cheap, plus it promotes teamwork as it requires two people, and if not teamwork, its requires an alt, which is more money for CCP, everyone wins.




why more moneyzzz from alts, we all have already many alts, we just use the same alts we use already now to do something aside fast and go back to what we already been doing with them Cool
Agent Known
Perkone
Caldari State
#43 - 2015-03-04 15:14:50 UTC
If covert cynos were allowed in high-sec, we'd quickly get people complaining about being dropped by a neutral alt while they were flying around in something that can't escape fast enough. Not that you should be flying a BS unguarded when you're under a wardec anyway. I mean, you wouldn't do that in low/null either.
Alexa Stryker
Council of Stellar Erections
#44 - 2015-03-04 15:23:09 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
Alexa Stryker wrote:
Stalence wrote:
Bump.

Please make this happen. I don't think it would be game breaking in anyways and may even fix a lot of the complaints people have about high sec war decs.



Can you clarify why covert cyno in high sec would fix some of the high sec war dec complaints please.
I'm just interested of in the reasons and insights.


Can your not undock from station because wardeccers have you camped in? we have just the solution for you.

Call 1800-blops-drops-4-u

maybe a new profession huh wardeccer blop drops, pay as you go 1 off service :)


Interesting... But the wardecers can still dock though.

A Family that incest together, stays together

Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat
Snuffed Out
#45 - 2015-03-04 15:24:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Lan Wang
Alexa Stryker wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
Alexa Stryker wrote:
Stalence wrote:
Bump.

Please make this happen. I don't think it would be game breaking in anyways and may even fix a lot of the complaints people have about high sec war decs.



Can you clarify why covert cyno in high sec would fix some of the high sec war dec complaints please.
I'm just interested of in the reasons and insights.


Can your not undock from station because wardeccers have you camped in? we have just the solution for you.

Call 1800-blops-drops-4-u

maybe a new profession huh wardeccer blop drops, pay as you go 1 off service :)


Interesting... But the wardecers can still dock though.


then the blops have fulfilled there purpose and the client can undock and get to safety. only real flaw is the assist on war because the blops would need to also be at war with the wardeccers

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

Alexa Stryker
Council of Stellar Erections
#46 - 2015-03-04 15:28:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Alexa Stryker
Lan Wang wrote:
Alexa Stryker wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
Alexa Stryker wrote:
Stalence wrote:
Bump.

Please make this happen. I don't think it would be game breaking in anyways and may even fix a lot of the complaints people have about high sec war decs.



Can you clarify why covert cyno in high sec would fix some of the high sec war dec complaints please.
I'm just interested of in the reasons and insights.


Can your not undock from station because wardeccers have you camped in? we have just the solution for you.

Call 1800-blops-drops-4-u

maybe a new profession huh wardeccer blop drops, pay as you go 1 off service :)


Interesting... But the wardecers can still dock though.


then the blops have fulfilled there purpose and the client can undock and get to safety. only real flaw is the assist on war because the blops would need to also be at war with the wardeccers


We need a temporary war dec system for war dec assistance

Edit: I meant a temporary war dec assistance system..where you can temporarily assist someone on his war dec... for an hour or two

A Family that incest together, stays together

Jane Shapperd
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#47 - 2015-03-04 16:47:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Jane Shapperd
Arden Elenduil wrote:
and you couldn't do this before in a blockade runner anyhow?
I mean, it's not like they have unscannable cargo holds....oh wait



i got my blockade runner ganked twice and it was empty main reason cause they cant scan it but they know it may have something expenssive

you may wonder how i got ganked : insta lock loki to prevent me from clock and then got pointed by vexor with long bossted point , engaged sentries and bam

also currently u cant bridge directly to high which mean you would bridge to low and take the gate to high
and you could get smart bombed as u land on the gate so there is risk , and after that u will jump a number of high sec jumps to reach ur desto so there is still risk
Vyl Vit
#48 - 2015-03-04 17:23:09 UTC
Alexei Stryker wrote:

Pok Nibin wrote:
What would be the point? Is there a logical reason to subvert high sec into homogenious sec to make a handful of players who think they're game designing geniuses happy?

Your reasoning is not logical at all.

Maybe CCP Falcon could enlighten us? Aliens maybe?

I love empty accusations. Pok's point makes perfect sense to me. Perhaps you can enlighten us as to why it is "not logical at all." I'd hate to think you're intellectually dishonest and dismissive of people deserving of respect.

Paradise is like where you are right now, only much, much better.

Serene Repose
#49 - 2015-03-04 17:24:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Serene Repose
While we're letting gankers use covert cynos in hi sec, why don't we get rid of that pesky training time as well so I can insta-learn all these skills out here in front of me? These game mechanics are intentionally designed to hamper my
play style!

We must accommodate the idiocracy.

Alexa Stryker
Council of Stellar Erections
#50 - 2015-03-04 17:47:42 UTC
Vyl Vit wrote:
Alexei Stryker wrote:

Pok Nibin wrote:
What would be the point? Is there a logical reason to subvert high sec into homogenious sec to make a handful of players who think they're game designing geniuses happy?

Your reasoning is not logical at all.

Maybe CCP Falcon could enlighten us? Aliens maybe?

I love empty accusations. Pok's point makes perfect sense to me. Perhaps you can enlighten us as to why it is "not logical at all." I'd hate to think you're intellectually dishonest and dismissive of people deserving of respect.


He is answering a question with a question and accusing people of thinking they are game design geniuses.

A Family that incest together, stays together

Alexa Stryker
Council of Stellar Erections
#51 - 2015-03-04 17:49:37 UTC
Serene Repose wrote:
While we're letting gankers use covert cynos in hi sec, why don't we get rid of that pesky training time as well so I can insta-learn all these skills out here in front of me? These game mechanics are intentionally designed to hamper my
play style!


I haven't seen any gankers using bombers or recons to gank.

A Family that incest together, stays together

Tiberian Deci
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#52 - 2015-03-04 17:59:40 UTC
I would love to drop on Marmite camping the Jita undock. dem ~kbstats~ would go down quick.

In all seriousness though I think covert cynos in HS would be good. You probably won't suicide gank in anything that can take a covert cyno, it would open up new tactics fighting hs griefers, and would still keep capitals out.
Sisohiv
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#53 - 2015-03-04 19:28:12 UTC
Alexa Stryker wrote:
Jane Shapperd wrote:
i see 2 reasons why covert cyno isnt allowed in high

1- too many neutrals : you will have no idea when to safe up if you are in a war dec .
as anyone can hot drop you .

2 - safety in moving expensive loots : you could use a covert industral to move a **** ton of plexes safely .

undock warp to instant undock warp , warp to black op in a safe spot or a tower .

get bridged . warp to instant dock and dock .

you moved a **** ton of isk with less than 0.00000000001% risk.


Sounds very logical...


Of course if I was moving a '**** ton of plexes' in a blockade runner you wouldn't know it anyway. They are immune to cargo scanners, they warp cloaked and only get ganked using spy meta. The truth is, there is no reason to have covert cyno's in HS because there is no reason not to.
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat
Snuffed Out
#54 - 2015-03-04 19:51:57 UTC
Jane Shapperd wrote:
i see 2 reasons why covert cyno isnt allowed in high

1- too many neutrals : you will have no idea when to safe up if you are in a war dec .
as anyone can hot drop you .

2 - safety in moving expensive loots : you could use a covert industral to move a **** ton of plexes safely .

undock warp to instant undock warp , warp to black op in a safe spot or a tower .

get bridged . warp to instant dock and dock .

you moved a **** ton of isk with less than 0.00000000001% risk.


and what risk are presented to gankers when they gank a freighter with no defences? there is no risk for a ganker bumping a freighter off a gate with a neutral bumper then usin throw-away ships to kill it then collect all the loot, so gankers make **** ton of isk with 0.000000001% risk

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

Sisohiv
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#55 - 2015-03-04 20:14:51 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
Jane Shapperd wrote:
i see 2 reasons why covert cyno isnt allowed in high

1- too many neutrals : you will have no idea when to safe up if you are in a war dec .
as anyone can hot drop you .

2 - safety in moving expensive loots : you could use a covert industral to move a **** ton of plexes safely .

undock warp to instant undock warp , warp to black op in a safe spot or a tower .

get bridged . warp to instant dock and dock .

you moved a **** ton of isk with less than 0.00000000001% risk.


and what risk are presented to gankers when they gank a freighter with no defences? there is no risk for a ganker bumping a freighter off a gate with a neutral bumper then usin throw-away ships to kill it then collect all the loot, so gankers make **** ton of isk with 0.000000001% risk


In addition, they scanned his cargo 4 jumps earlier so they know exactly how much hull to invest in the venture and make gains, they knew with 100% certainty he would be passing through the Uedama cow pasture because it's impossible not to. If people only knew just how screwed they really were when making that run, it would never get used.
Jane Shapperd
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#56 - 2015-03-04 20:18:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Jane Shapperd
Sisohiv wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
Jane Shapperd wrote:
i see 2 reasons why covert cyno isnt allowed in high

1- too many neutrals : you will have no idea when to safe up if you are in a war dec .
as anyone can hot drop you .

2 - safety in moving expensive loots : you could use a covert industral to move a **** ton of plexes safely .

undock warp to instant undock warp , warp to black op in a safe spot or a tower .

get bridged . warp to instant dock and dock .

you moved a **** ton of isk with less than 0.00000000001% risk.


and what risk are presented to gankers when they gank a freighter with no defences? there is no risk for a ganker bumping a freighter off a gate with a neutral bumper then usin throw-away ships to kill it then collect all the loot, so gankers make **** ton of isk with 0.000000001% risk


In addition, they scanned his cargo 4 jumps earlier so they know exactly how much hull to invest in the venture and make gains, they knew with 100% certainty he would be passing through the Uedama cow pasture because it's impossible not to. If people only knew just how screwed they really were when making that run, it would never get used.


i am against the idea of using covert cynos in high sec to escape ganks, if u want ur ship safe find a different route don't go trhu ganking systems .

after all u are the one who is moving ur expensive **** not them
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat
Snuffed Out
#57 - 2015-03-04 20:25:13 UTC
i mean it doesnt matter what the cyno is for you cant base an argument to say people can move isk with 0 risk where the other party has 0 risk to make the isk, scanning a ship is not risk and investing 300mil to gain 5bil is not risk either, a freighter has more risks involved but isnt avoiding a system just the same as using a cyno to skip the system?

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*

Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#58 - 2015-03-04 20:35:44 UTC
Jane Shapperd wrote:
Sisohiv wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
Jane Shapperd wrote:
i see 2 reasons why covert cyno isnt allowed in high

1- too many neutrals : you will have no idea when to safe up if you are in a war dec .
as anyone can hot drop you .

2 - safety in moving expensive loots : you could use a covert industral to move a **** ton of plexes safely .

undock warp to instant undock warp , warp to black op in a safe spot or a tower .

get bridged . warp to instant dock and dock .

you moved a **** ton of isk with less than 0.00000000001% risk.


and what risk are presented to gankers when they gank a freighter with no defences? there is no risk for a ganker bumping a freighter off a gate with a neutral bumper then usin throw-away ships to kill it then collect all the loot, so gankers make **** ton of isk with 0.000000001% risk


In addition, they scanned his cargo 4 jumps earlier so they know exactly how much hull to invest in the venture and make gains, they knew with 100% certainty he would be passing through the Uedama cow pasture because it's impossible not to. If people only knew just how screwed they really were when making that run, it would never get used.


i am against the idea of using covert cynos in high sec to escape ganks, if u want ur ship safe find a different route don't go trhu ganking systems .

after all u are the one who is moving ur expensive **** not them



Nothing wrong with using them to escape ganks in nullsec though?

Most of the people hunting in highsec are there for the same reason as their prey: it's too easy to get ganked and the hunters who claim that highseccers are all about doing everything in safety, are actually hunting in safety.
I saw a mission agro fu ganker Stratios fit last night. Just over 1 billion ISK. He shot the wrong thing and got Concorded and someone posted the link. If that's what the "hurf blurf highsec is not safe!" crowd is flying these days, then let's really talk about who is really at risk and who is avoiding it.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

Jane Shapperd
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#59 - 2015-03-04 20:38:48 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
i mean it doesnt matter what the cyno is for you cant base an argument to say people can move isk with 0 risk where the other party has 0 risk to make the isk, scanning a ship is not risk and investing 300mil to gain 5bil is not risk either, a freighter has more risks involved but isnt avoiding a system just the same as using a cyno to skip the system?


the first point is true i cant make that argument but that's an issue with the ganking system , not the covert cynos .

using a covert cyno isn't like a skipping system because u could skip multiple system at once via covert cyno while avoiding system will force you to take a longer route .
Sisohiv
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#60 - 2015-03-05 05:21:14 UTC
Jane Shapperd wrote:
Sisohiv wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
Jane Shapperd wrote:
i see 2 reasons why covert cyno isnt allowed in high

1- too many neutrals : you will have no idea when to safe up if you are in a war dec .
as anyone can hot drop you .

2 - safety in moving expensive loots : you could use a covert industral to move a **** ton of plexes safely .

undock warp to instant undock warp , warp to black op in a safe spot or a tower .

get bridged . warp to instant dock and dock .

you moved a **** ton of isk with less than 0.00000000001% risk.


and what risk are presented to gankers when they gank a freighter with no defences? there is no risk for a ganker bumping a freighter off a gate with a neutral bumper then usin throw-away ships to kill it then collect all the loot, so gankers make **** ton of isk with 0.000000001% risk


In addition, they scanned his cargo 4 jumps earlier so they know exactly how much hull to invest in the venture and make gains, they knew with 100% certainty he would be passing through the Uedama cow pasture because it's impossible not to. If people only knew just how screwed they really were when making that run, it would never get used.


i am against the idea of using covert cynos in high sec to escape ganks, if u want ur ship safe find a different route don't go trhu ganking systems .

after all u are the one who is moving ur expensive **** not them


In case you missed it or ignored it.

100% certainty he would be passing through the Uedama cow pasture because it's impossible not to.