Player Features and Ideas Discussion

I know that harpies are not using med rails.
This is just example how you can see if the some combination is not broken.

Harpy fleet have range , dps ...but they are dying. Sometimes whole fleets are gone in the matter of minutes.
THIS IS EVE.
You shoot something to do 'BOOM' , just to minutes later meet the same fate.

Like you see i also pointed that eagles need some work.

As for rail gun stabber - interesting.
Still, remember - hybrids :
- do only kin/Thermal damage
- use power to shoot

If you see hybrid fleet , you can tank it easily.
You can try neut some enemy ships to totally negate their damage.

In case of projectiles - you can easily choose damage type, guns don't use energy, and those guns have high amount of alpha.

This nerf is too high!

The tengu is the only rail ship that has seen widespread use recently, and it was nowhere near the ishtar, nor was it getting out of hand.

A nerf was needed, but not that much. And the other ships defnitely didn't need to see so much damage reduction.

Meanwhile, the Ishtar which has triple the use AND selectable tracking AND selectable damage AND higher alpha AND the ability to separate their firing point from their position, meaning they can still blap you even if you catch them.. Yet they only losses 17% of its DPS (Sentry dps x1,25 vs x1,5). Why do you hate Caldari so much? Have you seen the anemic DPS of tengus? They are used mainly because they are resilient, not because they are overpowered.

In addition to that, railgun ships don't have drones. AT ALL. Apart from the moa which is a fake rail ship since it doesn't have any range bonuses. Therefore the DPS is even thinner.

What I'd do would be to increase cap consumption of medium rails, increase their tracking and reduce their optimal by the same amount. Therefore resulting in less DPS if you want to keep range equivalent, and same DPS at point blank, point blank DPS being less than overpowered with rails given the ratio tracking vs dps.

What do you think?

Seems entirely fair to me. Med rails are too close to blasters in DPS right now tbh.

Same

I am utterly biased, not even trying to hide that, but are there actually numbers on ships like Moas and Eagles being overused by anyone but us? Is the number of ships we kill and lose maybe influencing your impression of them being overused? We emptied Amarr of medium Railguns when we deceided for them, so I am not pulling that out of thin air.

Note: I am not talking about T3s, but while you want to nerf the Railgu and the Rail-Proteus, you hit the Caldari T1 and T2 cruisers pretty hard (and Gallente cruisers are anything but overusing med rails). Please consider that in weighting your impression of overused.

On thr plus side im now cap stable

Agreed.

This change is also a stealth buff to rail ships in the form in decreased capacitor usage.

As for BNI's usage of Moas and Eagles, its only common sense. The ship progression is Moa >> Eagle >> Tengu. While you don't have to train for an Eagle to get into a Tengu, the Eagle is simply the cheaper but less capable version. So any alliance without the finances to regularly replace more expensive ships will choose something more within their means. I've advocated Eagles/Tengus since HACs and Med Rails were rebalanced, and couldn't be happier that BNI chose them for a fleet doctrine.

There's no capacitor buff, but it's a funny joke.
You can already manage your guns to get the same cap use as after this nerf.

After looking at your comparisons with beams and blaster,
railgun damage seems really a bit high. At the same time Moas and Eagles are not OP. One conclusion would be that blasters and beams don't do enough damage, but it seems quite wrong.

On a different note, this may allow artillery to make a come back.
Railguns get range, Arties goes for alpha.

After the change, what is the dps comparison between arties and railguns ?

I am a long-time railgun enthusiast (since well before the changes in 2013), and I support this change. The combination of good DPS and excellent projection available to medium rails was a bit much.

Plus...less cap usage. \o/

But I don't see anybody complaining about the dual 150mm rails being over powered. Is there a way CCP could be a bit more refined with the rail nerf and look at which combination of ships and rails are putting out the most damage?