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The cost of Navy Faction Modules

Author
Boozbaz
Securitech Industries
#1 - 2015-02-26 04:18:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Boozbaz
Just going with current Hek prices for convenience

Republic Fleet 10MN Microwarpdrive:

10MN Microwarpdrive I (280,000)
128 x "Imperial Navy Major Insignia " (180,000,000)
211 x " Imperial Navy Colonel Insignia I " (25,531,000)

205,811,000 total cost


Republic Fleet 100MN Microwarpdrive:

100MN Microwarpdrive I (1,000,000)
7 x "Imperial Navy Colonel Insignia I " (847,000)
21 x "Imperial Navy General Insignia I " (538,000)
33 x "Imperial Navy General Insignia II " (33,000,000)

35,130,000 total cost


.... wait why is the 100mn version cheaper than the 10mn version? (A: Imperial Navy Major Insignia is worth 1.4 million each, and the 10mn verison requires 128 of them!)

Also, check this out

Gistum A-Type 10MN Microwarpdrive - on the market for 190,000,000 right now. compare that to the 205,811,000 for the republic fleet version, which has worse performance.

Gist A-Type 100MN Microwarpdrive - on the market for 135,000,000 .... compare that to the 35,130,000 cost of republic fleet version. Now THAT makes sense.

Why would I ever pay 128 Major Insignia for a 10mn microwarp drive when I can buy the best deadspace one for even cheaper?!?!

*edit* I forgot to include the flat ISK cost for each module in the LP store. 24 million for the 100mn version and 18 million for the 10mn one.
Baali Tekitsu
AQUILA INC
Verge of Collapse
#2 - 2015-02-26 07:55:17 UTC
Supply and demand

RATE LIKE SUBSCRIBE

erg cz
Federal Jegerouns
#3 - 2015-02-26 08:30:20 UTC
Simple - you get 5 pieces of faction modules for that price (blueprint). Instead of one dead space module. Balanced, IMHO.
Boozbaz
Securitech Industries
#4 - 2015-02-26 09:11:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Boozbaz
erg cz wrote:
Simple - you get 5 pieces of faction modules for that price (blueprint). Instead of one dead space module. Balanced, IMHO.



The prices above are for individual modules, not 5 run blue print copies.
Boozbaz
Securitech Industries
#5 - 2015-02-26 09:16:53 UTC
Baali Tekitsu wrote:
Supply and demand



Please elaborate.
Shilalasar
Dead Sky Inc.
#6 - 2015-02-26 09:27:28 UTC
Supply of DED modules is pretty constant while for LP shop items you decide whether or not to produce them.
On the demand side DED 100mns go on supers and ratting BS, so supply can be short there.
Also look what else you can buy for those specific factiontags instead of gettting a 5 sales per month item. And how many of those tags are being sold on the market and how nice a handful of people have that market cornered.
Silverbackyererse
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#7 - 2015-02-26 11:36:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Silverbackyererse
Boozbaz wrote:
Baali Tekitsu wrote:
Supply and demand



Please elaborate.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply_and_demand LolLolLol

Seriously though......

The tags are the major pricing factor on the store items and not the LP.
The supply of many of the tag types, I'd guess, comes from mostly L5 low sec missions and is not particularly high.

EDIT - As already mentioned I think, certain tag types are in huge demand for more useful faction store items.
Boozbaz
Securitech Industries
#8 - 2015-02-26 15:08:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Boozbaz
Shilalasar wrote:
Supply of DED modules is pretty constant while for LP shop items you decide whether or not to produce them.
On the demand side DED 100mns go on supers and ratting BS, so supply can be short there.
Also look what else you can buy for those specific factiontags instead of gettting a 5 sales per month item. And how many of those tags are being sold on the market and how nice a handful of people have that market cornered.


I think this is the best answer.

I saw that only one person was selling the tags in Hek. After I checke out deve-central.com, I see that 1 - 1.5 million is actually the market value for those tags all over highsec. Which goes to your other point; the tags are likely used in some high demand items. Either that or they're just really rare. I'm going to look around and find out what other item(s) they're used for, and how many of them are required for each one.

I'm not trying to convert my LP and tags into ISK. I'm looking to actually buy fittings and ships for myself, which is disappointing because the microwarp drive is the single most impactful fitting if I went with a faction one instead of T2. My conclusion is that since the fleet issue 10mn MWD costs more than the best deadspace one, the fleet issue MWD might as well not exist!

With that said... I think CCP needs to reduce the number of these tags are that are needed for this particular item. I'm assuming that the general intention of the loyalty points market was for people with loyalty points to buy faction fittings for themselves. No one's going to buy the republic fleet 10mn microwarpdrive with the exorbitant amount of highly valued tags that it requires.
erg cz
Federal Jegerouns
#9 - 2015-02-26 15:20:23 UTC
Boozbaz wrote:
erg cz wrote:
Simple - you get 5 pieces of faction modules for that price (blueprint). Instead of one dead space module. Balanced, IMHO.



The prices above are for individual modules, not 5 run blue print copies.


Why buy individual modules? This: https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/lpstore/ can help you out to understand the difference between price of individual modules and BPC.
Phig Neutron
Starbreaker and Sons
#10 - 2015-02-26 15:27:14 UTC
Boozbaz wrote:
.... wait why is the 100mn version cheaper than the 10mn version? (A: Imperial Navy Major Insignia is worth 1.4 million each, and the 10mn verison requires 128 of them!)


Think about it. The 100MN module requires that 54 times, somebody went through the trouble of looting relatively high-value "general" tags because they though it was worth the effort for the money. The 10MN module, by contrast, requires 339 lootings of relatively low-value tags. You are depending on more people doing more work for less pay per effort. So obviously it happens less, and whoever goes through the trouble of actually collecting these tags is going to sell them for as much as they can get.
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#11 - 2015-02-26 16:39:35 UTC
I suggest you boycott purchasing 10MN MWD's until those damn NPCs drop their demands to a more reasonable level. Greedy bastards.
Rinai Vero
Blades of Liberty
#12 - 2015-02-26 18:14:59 UTC
Figuring out the tag nonsense on the LP Store has always been more trouble than its worth for me. Too many different Ranks, then they add levels of ranks to that. Some tags drop in FW Missions, some drop in FW Plex. It doesn't seem like there's any rhyme or reason behind the number or levels of tags required for different items.

CCP could really improve the accessibility of the LP store / market by streamlining and eliminating some of the chaff.

What they need to do is split everything into four categories, with four ranks of tags.

Here's my rough draft:

Novice Items: In the 10,000 LP range and below. Buy with one type of tag found only in Novice plexes and Lvl 1 FW Missions

Small Items: In the 10,000 - 50,000 LP range. Buy with one type of tag found only in Small plexes and Lvl 2 FW Missions.

Medium Items: In the 50,000 - 100,000 LP range. Buy with one type of tag found only in Medium plexes and Lvl 3 FW Missions.

Large Items: In the 100,000 LP range and above. Buy with one type of tag found only in Large plexes and Lvl 4 FW Missions.
Boozbaz
Securitech Industries
#13 - 2015-02-26 22:24:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Boozbaz
Rinai Vero wrote:
Figuring out the tag nonsense on the LP Store has always been more trouble than its worth for me. Too many different Ranks, then they add levels of ranks to that. Some tags drop in FW Missions, some drop in FW Plex. It doesn't seem like there's any rhyme or reason behind the number or levels of tags required for different items.

CCP could really improve the accessibility of the LP store / market by streamlining and eliminating some of the chaff.

What they need to do is split everything into four categories, with four ranks of tags.

Here's my rough draft:

Novice Items: In the 10,000 LP range and below. Buy with one type of tag found only in Novice plexes and Lvl 1 FW Missions

Small Items: In the 10,000 - 50,000 LP range. Buy with one type of tag found only in Small plexes and Lvl 2 FW Missions.

Medium Items: In the 50,000 - 100,000 LP range. Buy with one type of tag found only in Medium plexes and Lvl 3 FW Missions.

Large Items: In the 100,000 LP range and above. Buy with one type of tag found only in Large plexes and Lvl 4 FW Missions.


This is a great idea.

Where were you when I was voting for CSM?

*edit* the only thing I would suggest is that it takes more than just 1 dog tag.
Rinai Vero
Blades of Liberty
#14 - 2015-02-26 23:01:44 UTC
Hah, no CSM for me thanks. And ya, I'd definitely make sure different value items require different numbers of tags.
exiik Shardani
Imperial Spacedrill and Logistics
#15 - 2015-02-27 08:14:03 UTC
many things in LP shops are totally out.

some faction modules needs re-balance as well as all LP shops prices need re-balance too

sry for my English :-(

Quattras Peione
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#16 - 2015-03-02 06:48:53 UTC
A lot of the supply-and-demand issue in those costs is how those particular items fit in the current meta.

Gameplay currently favors cruisers, which use the 10mn prop mods. These move in volume, sales are guaranteed, prices are high. The 100mn, meanwhile, is meant for battleship-size vessels, who don't see nearly as much usage currently. Volume, movement, and therefore prices, are lower.

Dr. Quattras Alvar Peione

No, I'm not that kind of doctor.

Tsobai Hashimoto
State War Academy
Caldari State
#17 - 2015-03-09 18:15:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Tsobai Hashimoto
Rinai Vero wrote:
Figuring out the tag nonsense on the LP Store has always been more trouble than its worth for me. Too many different Ranks, then they add levels of ranks to that. Some tags drop in FW Missions, some drop in FW Plex. It doesn't seem like there's any rhyme or reason behind the number or levels of tags required for different items.

CCP could really improve the accessibility of the LP store / market by streamlining and eliminating some of the chaff.

What they need to do is split everything into four categories, with four ranks of tags.

Here's my rough draft:

Novice Items: In the 10,000 LP range and below. Buy with one type of tag found only in Novice plexes and Lvl 1 FW Missions

Small Items: In the 10,000 - 50,000 LP range. Buy with one type of tag found only in Small plexes and Lvl 2 FW Missions.

Medium Items: In the 50,000 - 100,000 LP range. Buy with one type of tag found only in Medium plexes and Lvl 3 FW Missions.

Large Items: In the 100,000 LP range and above. Buy with one type of tag found only in Large plexes and Lvl 4 FW Missions.



I like this but would simple it even farther. Tags are turned in for points. (Insert name here) and are spent just like LP points along with LPs

A pvt 1 is 1 point. A commander gen whatever is 500 points and everything in between .

So your 10mn MWD might need the LPs plus 25k tag points while the 100mn MWD would need 75k tag points

It gives a base price to all tags and balances it out....over time it would come down to each tag point would be worth x amount of tisk moving for each faction on supply and demand for that factions items
Master Sergeant MacRobert
Red Sky Morning
The Amarr Militia.
#18 - 2015-03-09 18:26:37 UTC
Tsobai Hashimoto wrote:
Rinai Vero wrote:
Figuring out the tag nonsense on the LP Store has always been more trouble than its worth for me. Too many different Ranks, then they add levels of ranks to that. Some tags drop in FW Missions, some drop in FW Plex. It doesn't seem like there's any rhyme or reason behind the number or levels of tags required for different items.

CCP could really improve the accessibility of the LP store / market by streamlining and eliminating some of the chaff.

What they need to do is split everything into four categories, with four ranks of tags.

Here's my rough draft:

Novice Items: In the 10,000 LP range and below. Buy with one type of tag found only in Novice plexes and Lvl 1 FW Missions

Small Items: In the 10,000 - 50,000 LP range. Buy with one type of tag found only in Small plexes and Lvl 2 FW Missions.

Medium Items: In the 50,000 - 100,000 LP range. Buy with one type of tag found only in Medium plexes and Lvl 3 FW Missions.

Large Items: In the 100,000 LP range and above. Buy with one type of tag found only in Large plexes and Lvl 4 FW Missions.



I like this but would simple it even farther. Tags are turned in for points. (Insert name here) and are spent just like LP points along with LPs

A pvt 1 is 1 point. A commander gen whatever is 500 points and everything in between .

So your 10mn MWD might need the LPs plus 25k tag points while the 100mn MWD would need 75k tag points

It gives a base price to all tags and balances it out....over time it would come down to each tag point would be worth x amount of tisk moving for each faction on supply and demand for that factions items


Like the idea on first glance

"Remedy this situation or you shall live out the rest of your life in a pain amplifier"

Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#19 - 2015-03-09 18:43:46 UTC
The best place to get these tags are in a FW mission. However, no one in their right mind is going to farm those tags.

2nd best place to get those tags is hisec mission running. Specifically farming those faction missions and harvesting the tags. Very time consuming and not to mention running those missions kills your faction standing towards that faction.

Need to reduce the number of tags needed or just do away with the negative standings impact for doing those hisec missions.
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
#20 - 2015-03-09 21:05:45 UTC
The relative rarity of the tags is the driver here. Unless it's changed since I last checked (which was, admittedly, several years back), the tags for the 10MN units are more likely to drop in level 3 missions, while the tags for 100MN units are more likely to drop in level 4 missions. Since far more people do level 4s than level 3s, there are far more tags from level 4s on the market. With far more supply on the market, prices drop a lot.

I use Republic Fleet ABs on some of my battleship fits, and I've noticed the same discrepancy there with their 100MN and 10MN units as well.

Relatively Notorious By Association

My Many Misadventures

I predicted FAUXs

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