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Take Control of Forum Whining | New Toggle in Tiamat

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Author
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
R I O T
#1 - 2015-02-18 14:00:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Destiny Corrupted
TLDR: personal incredulity at the way that CCP chose to advertise the awoxing restrictions in the latest release, plus a contest with an ISK prize, because why not.

I don't make threads often, but something happened today which made me unable to let it go. A friend linked this to me, while laughing uncontrollably. I stared at it for a while in incredulity, but then the sad truth hit me: this is the logical conclusion for which this game was destined all along. It's simply unable to exist in its originally-promised state, due to the continued pushback of the wallet-wielding majority. Not as a for-profit project, at least.

But that's irrelevant here. I've come to terms that "friendly fire" no longer has a place in this warm, friendly universe. Just like I've come to terms that a lot of other game mechanics soon won't have a place here either. EVE is evolving. Into what, I don't know, but obviously something different from what we've been playing and talking about all these years. Herzog Wolfhammer stated in one of the recent threads that "there will be a "second age" as opposed to the game dying from the changes, which I agree with. I don't think that even a flat-out removal of pvp from EVE (or at least high-sec) would truly destroy the game at this point. Yes, it will suck if this game becomes something that I'll no longer enjoy playing, but if humans can recover from natural disasters and deaths of loved ones, I'm sure I'll get over it. For now, I'm still here, as there are enough core concepts still intact to keep me interested.

Still, it really got to me how CCP went about advertising this recent change to high-sec aggression rules. They could have said "a rebalance of high-sec aggression laws" or "changes to CONCORD response rules" or something along those lines. Instead, they specifically used the wording of "taking control of friendly fire." As if "friendly fire" was this major oversight that somehow slipped through the cracks for the past twelve years, and they've just now realized how much it was hurting players, and how letting players turn it off is a revolutionary new gameplay addition that's bound to take EVE to new heights of success.

Note how the banner makes it seem as if the "feature" being presented is something without which accomplishing the intended effects is downright impossible. Like "friendly fire" wasn't something you could already control with diligence in recruitment, proper corporate policies, et cetera. It makes me feel like they're targeting this advertisement not at people who are interested in seeing this game progress from a balance standpoint, but at people who are inherently offended by the very concept of "friendly fire," because they're obviously employing the term with a very negative connotation attached to it.

And to me, after years of various blogs, press releases, and forum quips from the developers themselves about the inherently unfair and violent nature of this game, that feels downright dishonest. But more importantly, it makes me consider various other feature removals that CCP can pass off as content additions, while creating colorful marketing propaganda that obviously targets a very specific, very coveted player demographic. So, let's consider some examples. And no, I'm not going to focus them entirely on the high-sec pvp aspect of things, but I'll sure as hell start with them:

(Inability to steal from other players' cans/wrecks and board others' ships in space)
"TAKE CONTROL OF YOUR ASSETS! NEW TOGGLE IN [EXPANSION]"

(Inability to declare wars on player corporations and alliances)
"TAKE CONTROL OF CORPORATE SECURITY! NEW TOGGLE IN [EXPANSION]"

(Inability to mine in a belt someone else is mining in, or shoot rats in a complex someone else is running)
"TAKE CONTROL OF YOUR INDUSTRIAL OPERATIONS! NEW TOGGLE IN [EXPANSION]"

(Inability to accept a trade or contract that's not within 90% of its market value)
"TAKE CONTROL OF BUSINESS REPUTABILITY! NEW TOGGLE IN [EXPANSION]"

(Inability to use a locator agent on someone unless they're mutual contacts with you)
"TAKE CONTROL OF YOUR PRIVACY! NEW TOGGLE IN [EXPANSION]"

Notice how all of these already have existing player-driven solutions.

Actually, let's make it interesting. Make photoshops of similar parodies of the banner ad (be original with the text, don't just copy my examples above), and I'll give the best submission a billion ISK. The only rule is that it has to do something with any in-game mechanics, and not something stupid like "taking control of your forum tears" or other similar meta crap.

Edit: Please note that the 1b prize is only for a picture. I might reward clever text versions, but not nearly as highly.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted

Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2015-02-18 14:08:27 UTC

PLEX PRICES THROUGH THE ROOF

Des, you may be at risk of taking CCP banner advertising too seriously.

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.

Seven Koskanaiken
Shadow Legions.
WE FORM BL0B
#3 - 2015-02-18 14:09:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Seven Koskanaiken
I think this is less to do with a philosophical change within CCP, and more to do with the fact expansions are now so thin on content that a new checkbox warrants its own banner ad.
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
R I O T
#4 - 2015-02-18 14:12:52 UTC
Sibyyl wrote:
Des, you may be at risk of taking CCP banner advertising too seriously.

Actually, it's meant to be a more humorous thread than anything else. Darkly humorous, maybe, but still. It's not like I'm actually sad at this point. I genuinely was about 2-3 years ago, but now I'm more or less aware of what's happening. What I feel is more akin to...pity. Similar to the feeling I had when I watched Mitt Romney campaign for presidency.

Seven Koskanaiken wrote:
I think this is less to do with a philosophical change within CCP, and more to do with the fact expansions are now so thin on content that a new check now warrants its own banner ad.

I wouldn't be so sure. Marketing is pretty crazy.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#5 - 2015-02-18 14:13:31 UTC
Seven Koskanaiken wrote:
I think this is less to do with a philosophical change within CCP, and more to do with the fact expansions are now so thin on content that a new checkbox warrants its own banner ad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DaOgZwk9rN8


Still waiting on a checkbox box.
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2015-02-18 16:34:28 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
TLDR: covert whining about anti-awox flag

To many words, not enough content.

On the flip side, pre-Tiamat basicly you could control CONCORD aggression by joining a corp and opening fire while in highsec, without consequences. Weird, I know. Easy to abuse, you betcha.

On to the future, just means the lazy have to uninstall since they cannot evolve.
-CONCORD will still attack in highsec, plan accordingly with what you are able to lose
-Can try harder to lull people to low or WH space instead of a quickie invite and wanking off to that killmail
--Means develop those social skills, not F1 key reflex action when the corp invite is confirmed cause you think highsec is Counter strike with ships

Game hasn't changed, you just didn't evolved and whine cause its to easy doing the same old WoW kiddie tricks cause you lack the attention span and patience to do anything else but corp hop looking for targets. Certainly doesn't help player retention, as far as "sandbox" is for "spais" and "asset theft" pretty sure CCP was thinking more of evolving world through consistent and non-ending combat content, not stagnant blue circles like null and driving away people who got bored after griding up billions of isk after a few months only to suddenly lose it (who wants to grind more, again? not exactly a player retaining ability with its static mission and mining shitcontent)....was boring the first time, the combat was fun, but the grind to maintain the combat....yeah, that is what kills the fun and guys who whine that is fun to destroy others ability to just maintain the ability to play the game....didn't think very deeply.

bolded note: think hard....awox and taking assets, causing mistrust, in a video game, where there is consequences to actions but boring developer content...EVE would of been better off as a Planet side type game with ships and no idk grind, no asset theft, ect if you think about it. Combat is fun, the isk and asset grind, not so much.
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
R I O T
#7 - 2015-02-18 16:46:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Destiny Corrupted
Aqriue wrote:
bolded note: think hard....awox and taking assets, causing mistrust, in a video game, where there is consequences to actions but boring developer content...EVE would of been better off as a Planet side type game with ships and no idk grind, no asset theft, ect if you think about it. Combat is fun, the isk and asset grind, not so much.

That's an interesting perspective. However, don't you think that if this was the case, then EVE would be too much like already-existing games on the market? Even in terms of just space-themed games, if you want to narrow the selection down to a single genre, there's plenty to choose from. There's a whole bunch of space-combat games on Steam, and none of them do particularly well. As far as having a Planetside 2 type of game, I think it would be fun too, but I doubt there's anyone who can pull off something like that with current technology, or we'd have it by now. I mean with actual aiming and thousands of people at the same time. Or are you simply talking about a version of EVE in which ships are free? That actually sounds pretty boring, considering how dull EVE combat is. If not for the economy, this game would be entirely terrible.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted

2Sonas1Cup
#8 - 2015-02-18 16:56:11 UTC  |  Edited by: 2Sonas1Cup
Why plexes will keep going up in price:

People buy plexes
Ccp buy plexes off them
There's less plexes
Price goes up
More People buy more plexes
Etc etc etc

Ccp just keeps the market with a certain controlled quantity enough to create demand.
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#9 - 2015-02-18 17:15:11 UTC
(highsec moved to separate server)
SAY HELLO TO TRAMMELSEC!

All jumps between Trammelsec and Feluccasec will now require you to log out completely and log back into the appropriate server.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?

La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#10 - 2015-02-18 17:26:48 UTC
Aqriue wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
TLDR: covert whining about anti-awox flag



Yepp you got *that* right.
Well not soo covert...Roll

Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."

Ned Thomas
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#11 - 2015-02-18 17:27:19 UTC
(CCP begins selling designer jewelry)
TAKE CONTROL OF WIFE AGGRO!
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
R I O T
#12 - 2015-02-18 17:30:02 UTC
La Rynx wrote:
Aqriue wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
TLDR: covert whining about anti-awox flag



Yepp you got *that* right.
Well not soo covert...Roll

I fully expected these sorts of posts. If my skin wasn't thick enough for them, I wouldn't have made the thread.

To be quite fair, I was against the change, but never whined about it. I'm saving the whining for when they add this toggle to wars.

Ned Thomas wrote:
(CCP begins selling designer jewelry)
TAKE CONTROL OF WIFE AGGRO!

Has to deal with in-game mechanics, as far as the contest goes. Otherwise, somewhat humorous.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted

Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#13 - 2015-02-18 17:34:21 UTC
TAKE CONTROL OF HUNGER, PLEX4BACON COMING IN MICHAELANGELO

PLEX4BACON, the long awaited and much requested feature will finally be hitting Tranquility with our Michaelangelo release!
Also, were abandoning titans, gods and other names and going with Ninja Turtles now.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?

La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#14 - 2015-02-18 17:37:22 UTC  |  Edited by: La Rynx
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
La Rynx wrote:
Aqriue wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
TLDR: covert whining about anti-awox flag



Yepp you got *that* right.
Well not soo covert...Roll

I fully expected these sorts of posts. If my skin wasn't thick enough for them, I wouldn't have made the thread.

To be quite fair, I was against the change, but never whined about it. I'm saving the whining for when they add this toggle to wars.

This is so a miniscule change, that i really ask my self what kind of players would insist on the old version.
In fact EvE got not easier, it got harder. It is harder to awox now and those ppl are crying, as if the EvE would die.
The wannabe awoxxers are risk averse and accuse their victims to be risk-averse. If there would not be so much whining, it would be funny.

Sorry that goes for the thread to.

Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."

Ned Thomas
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#15 - 2015-02-18 17:40:09 UTC
(CCP introduces a new toggle where the player had to use a breathalyzer before undocking)
TAKE CONTROL OF DRUNK FLYING!

(Using a Data Analyzer on a character using Sansha related implants gives the chance to take over that character for a bit)
TAKE CONTROL OF OTHER PEOPLE!

(The Mittani goes up for sale in the character bazzar)
TAKE CONTROL OF GOONSWARM!

EDIT: Sorry, I'll stop now.
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Doomheim
#16 - 2015-02-18 17:42:43 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
TLDR: personal incredulity at the way that CCP chose to advertise the awoxing restrictions in the latest release, plus a contest with an ISK prize, because why not.

I don't make threads often, but something happened today which made me unable to let it go. A friend linked this to me, while laughing uncontrollably. I stared at it for a while in incredulity, but then the sad truth hit me: this is the logical conclusion for which this game was destined all along. It's simply unable to exist in its originally-promised state, due to the continued pushback of the wallet-wielding majority. Not as a for-profit project, at least.
...

Prophets warned us ages ago that mechanics nerfs are tearing down EvE's core of non-consensual conflict, in pursuit of a quick-fix to retaining moar subs (instead of the right way, being better new player education and expectation-levelling...).

Sadly, all the new vegan paper-pants wearing pansies who drive hybrids are swarming into EvE online, and want it to become WoW or Trammel. What's frightening is no one is pushing back anymore.

F






La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#17 - 2015-02-18 17:47:44 UTC
the OPs post in CP End of the Awoxer proof, that this is a whine thread.

Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."

Quanah Comanche
#18 - 2015-02-18 18:09:10 UTC
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
TLDR: personal incredulity at the way that CCP chose to advertise the awoxing restrictions in the latest release, plus a contest with an ISK prize, because why not.

I don't make threads often, but something happened today which made me unable to let it go. A friend linked this to me, while laughing uncontrollably. I stared at it for a while in incredulity, but then the sad truth hit me: this is the logical conclusion for which this game was destined all along. It's simply unable to exist in its originally-promised state, due to the continued pushback of the wallet-wielding majority. Not as a for-profit project, at least.
...

Prophets warned us ages ago that mechanics nerfs are tearing down EvE's core of non-consensual conflict, in pursuit of a quick-fix to retaining moar subs (instead of the right way, being better new player education and expectation-levelling...).

Sadly, all the new vegan paper-pants wearing pansies who drive hybrids are swarming into EvE online, and want it to become WoW or Trammel. What's frightening is no one is pushing back anymore.

F









They are just leaving.
UberFly
Metallurgy Incorporated
#19 - 2015-02-18 18:19:25 UTC
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:

Sadly, all the new vegan paper-pants wearing pansies who drive hybrids are swarming into EvE online, and want it to become WoW or Trammel. What's frightening is no one is pushing back anymore.
F

We've been over those Trammel numbers and it certainly looks like it was pretty good for UO, kept it running for several years with a subscriber peak 3 years after Trammel.

Lots of people don't like non-consensual PVP, UO catered to that group and reaped the rewards for years. It worked for them, just because a loud minority of gank-bears didn't like it doesn't make it a bad thing. Will Eve go that way? Who knows vOv, but I'll still be here, flying spaceships.

truth-in-advertising: I made those posts with Aredontis, sold him shortly after and bought UberFly.
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
R I O T
#20 - 2015-02-18 18:24:20 UTC
UberFly wrote:
We've been over those Trammel numbers and it certainly looks like it was pretty good for UO, kept it running for several years with a subscriber peak 3 years after Trammel.

Lots of people don't like non-consensual PVP, UO catered to that group and reaped the rewards for years. It worked for them, just because a loud minority of gank-bears didn't like it doesn't make it a bad thing.

This will always be the case though, for any game ever made. This argument is akin to saying that a game such as EVE shouldn't exist at all, because the logical conclusion is to always cater to the carebear-oriented players. So niche products literally shouldn't exist because it's always wise to cater to the majority.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted

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