These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Intergalactic Summit

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Unidentified Structures Uncloaked, Sightings of "Drifters"

Author
Captain Davison
Malachi Keep Detachments
#81 - 2015-02-18 14:39:24 UTC
Nauplius wrote:
Until proven otherwise, I declare the Drifters guilty. Guilty of the same crimes as the Jove, of whom they are surely some foul offshoot. Guilty of transhumanism. Guilty of the treachery of Vak'Atioth. The penalty for these crimes is death. There are to be no peaceful overtures, no attempts at communication. Only killing, the killing rendered unto all those who stand against a holy and righteous God. Amen. Amarr Victor.


*Clears throat.* You DO realize that by default a capsuleer--such as yourself--is transhuman, right? Therefore your first target should be yourself. Heck, technically all of human civilization is 'transhuman,' given that we all augment ourselves with tools to exheed what we would be naturally capable of.

Then again, that might explain why the amarr are such nutters.
Nauplius
Hoi Andrapodistai
#82 - 2015-02-18 14:42:02 UTC
Gwen Ikiryo wrote:
Nauplius wrote:
Until proven otherwise, I declare the Drifters guilty. Guilty of the same crimes as the Jove, of whom they are surely some foul offshoot. Guilty of transhumanism. Guilty of the treachery of Vak'Atioth. The penalty for these crimes is death. There are to be no peaceful overtures, no attempts at communication. Only killing, the killing rendered unto all those who stand against a holy and righteous God. Amen. Amarr Victor.


I'd encourage you wholeheartedly to go and try to deliver justice to them, Nauplius!

By the way, this sort of puts somewhat of a damper on your notion of all the Jove being dead.


God has destroyed the Jove Directorate. These Drifters are either the shattered remnant of that civilization or a holdover from an earlier Jove civilization. In either case, they are guilty.
per
Terpene Conglomerate
#83 - 2015-02-18 15:00:19 UTC
hi fellow capsuleers,

i wonder about one thing, WHO and WHERE get these informations:
http://pasteboard.co/1daIi8nC.png

is CONCORD administrator of this info database? if yes, where did they take this info from?

we noticed this info is freely available when we met one drifter "guy" Tyrannos Strategos,
he killed one of our guys without any warning while he was sitting in unarmed ship
we tried to contact this drifter guy so he could explain his actions but he wasnt responding to any kind of our communication, either he wasnt able to communicate with us or more likely he wasnt interested in any sort of communication
we then decided to take him out to save other capsuleers that might have been traveling around

theres more info from the online database
http://pasteboard.co/1dbo3xBZ.png
Aelisha
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#84 - 2015-02-18 15:06:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Aelisha
We are reliant on neocomm for all data but that we generate from our own observations, so one might assume that CONCORD has kept us on a need to know basis. Now that the cat is out of the bag, that needs is now and so we know.

Sorry to hear about your colleague. Did you at least manage to destroy the vessel responsible?

CEO of the Achura-Waschi Exchange

Intaki Reborn

Independent Capsuleer

Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#85 - 2015-02-18 15:27:08 UTC
Celestia Via wrote:
This is an interesting discussion. I am sure it has been done before, but I am fairly new to all this so here goes:

Same caveat for me, sort of. Only for me it comes from my brain being maybe a bit scrambled. So far, my intellectual knowledge seems reliable-ish, so....

Apologies if some of this turns out to be, I don't know. Dream-data or something.

Quote:
What we call "Sleepers" could actually not be related to humanity directly. It is my belief that the sleepers are some form of evolved AI, invented by humans (the Talocan?). In the same way we see rogue drones today evolving basic intelligence, being kept in check only by our own activtites. We have evidence that the Talocan at somepoint faced serious hardship or even extinction. I urge you to imagine what would happen if humanity was suddenly extinct from known space? The rogue drones would be unhindered to colonize all known space and evolve into something much more advanced and frightening than what they are now.


This is an old and longstanding theory. It's been around since the Sleepers first appeared.

Quote:
This is what I believe took place in ancient time inside the Anoikis. The Sleepers are nothing but AI, created to serve an ancient races purpuse. In the absence of their masters, they could have developed free will, advanced science and technology to their own liking or both. They may now have their own agenda or still serve as guardians to a long lost people's heritage.


The Sleepers' behavior does not suggest free will; that would probably have mandated the counter-invasion the original Synenose Accord feared from Anoikis.

It never came.

The Sleepers, Circadians excepted, continue to function as they have since they were first discovered: as tomb guardians.

Quote:
All this can be linked to current events. We have seen stasis facilities inside Anoikis. What if its the Talocans that lie in stasis, guarded by their faithful creations? Now, imagine if someone, unnamed here but easy to guess, tried to interfere with the stasis facilities and their contents? I would find this good reason for the Sleepers to rise and retaliate against such an invasive event.


Ha-- funny, I was just researching this.

It happened, years ago. Federation officials revealed at the advent of the clone soldiers that their implants are Sleeper salvage.

The implications are pretty clear. Sleeper drones would have no need for implants, but the people in those stasis facilities probably do. It's easily forgotten that we knew of the Sleepers before we ever reached Anoikis; I believe their ruins are found in Minmatar space, as well.

As Ancients go, they were particularly known for their implant technology. The Talocan are a separate civilization, and were very active in Caldari space. A lot of advanced Caldari shield technology-- the bits we don't really understand yet-- comes from them.

Um ... an important thing about the Talocan:

Their structures also appear in Anoikis, if I remember. They are architecturally distinct from Sleeper structures, with or without stasis facilities. Many of them broadcast a quarantine warning. No such warnings appear around Sleeper structures.

The lack of independent Talocan combat units was thought to possibly imply a war-- that the Talocan had been overrun by Sleeper drones. There was even a theory, for a while, that the Kyonoke pathogen might even have been a Sleeper invention created to wipe out the Talocan. I don't know if that was ever put to bed.

Quote:
We should not rush to categorize Drifters as Jovian. There are similarities, granted, but nothing is unrelated and there could be explanations. The Jovians could actually be the descendants of the surviving Talocan for that matter. Nothing exists to indicate this, but it could very well be true, after all we are all only human.


One interesting thing about the Jove is that they hit a chaotic patch where they lost track of themselves for a bit-- lost track of their genome, certainly. It's when the Jovian Disease appeared, if I remember.

What if they lost track of some of their populations, as well? Colonists or exiled factions, budding off and spreading out?
Captain Davison
Malachi Keep Detachments
#86 - 2015-02-18 15:48:26 UTC
Nauplius wrote:
[quote=Gwen Ikiryo]

God has destroyed the Jove Directorate. These Drifters are either the shattered remnant of that civilization or a holdover from an earlier Jove civilization. In either case, they are guilty.


THAT, remains to be seen. More likely they just shut the door in your face because they got tired of listening to you.
Foley Aberas Jones
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#87 - 2015-02-18 15:55:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Foley Aberas Jones
I wonder what would happen if i covered one of their structures in Remote explosives......



Welp, I guess i am about to purchase 6 million units of explosives and try....
Celestia Via
Kill'em all. Let Bob sort'em out.
Ushra'Khan
#88 - 2015-02-18 16:29:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Celestia Via
Quote:
The lack of independent Talocan combat units was thought to possibly imply a war-- that the Talocan had been overrun by Sleeper drones. There was even a theory, for a while, that the Kyonoke pathogen might even have been a Sleeper invention created to wipe out the Talocan. I don't know if that was ever put to bed.


This has been the dominant theory. However, my personal survey of all the locations led me to believe that there was not an actual war between the two. The Talocan ruins are just that - ruins. They seem to be more ancient than the Sleeper ones. It somehow feels like the two were not actually synchronous. Even if they were, there is no actual evidence of a war - it would have to be largely one sided. Nothing sort of a genocide. Even so, there are still contradictions. If there was hostility, why would sleepers keep the Talocan structures around, and even add to them, build around them and not simply ignore or wipe them out?

My viewpoint is that those two cultures perhaps never coexisted (the Talocan could be already absent when the Sleepers arrived) or that they had found some common ground, some form of mutual cooperation.

"We marched for days and nights, under sun, in the rain. Our minds and bodies ached for rest, but in our hearts there was nothing but the fight."

Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#89 - 2015-02-18 16:29:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Soldarius
per wrote:
hi fellow capsuleers,

i wonder about one thing, WHO and WHERE get these informations:
http://pasteboard.co/1daIi8nC.png

is CONCORD administrator of this info database? if yes, where did they take this info from?

we noticed this info is freely available when we met one drifter "guy" Tyrannos Strategos,
he killed one of our guys without any warning while he was sitting in unarmed ship
we tried to contact this drifter guy so he could explain his actions but he wasnt responding to any kind of our communication, either he wasnt able to communicate with us or more likely he wasnt interested in any sort of communication
we then decided to take him out to save other capsuleers that might have been traveling around

theres more info from the online database
http://pasteboard.co/1dbo3xBZ.png


This information is all released by CONCORD, and a lot can be gleaned from it. Basically, it means that Vigilant Tyrannos is an enclave (corp) belonging to the Drifter faction (alliance). Their HQ is an office in Jove space. But they do not own the station, nor any other station. Since settled systems are incremented only if the corp owns the station, they have 0 settled systems.

I think one of the more important tidbits of information within that corporate information screen is that they "operate under a single command structure represented by an enclave level organization".

If I remember my political science courses correctly, historically the jovians refered to the various segments of their socio-political structure as "enclaves", with different enclaves operating more or less autonomously, though in a generally coordinated manner for the betterment of their society.

Then I recalled the rather conspicuous site in Anoikis named "Ruins of Enclave Cohort 27"; conspicuous by its name and frequency in low-end C2 w-space systems.

Quote:
Entirely void of any signs of life, this small pocket of deadspace echoes a story told all over the vast stretches of the unknown regions; the demise of the ancient Sleeper race. Information portals – offering the only data that is decipherable – refer to the area as “Enclave Cohort 27”, identifying the two enclaves amongst many other Sleeper settlements. One enclave has clearly been disconnected from its power supply, whilst the other has succumbed to the same solemn fate for some other, unknown cause.


I also did a database search on the term "cohort". The results were a bit surprising and led me in some interesting directions.

I would surmise that an "Enclave Cohort" could be a enclave emergency response team of some kind. Or it could have been an educational institution. Or more menacingly, a military unit. In any case, they would have been people connected by societal similarities and a common task.

In any case, with only a single-word similarity and possibly a point of origin for a tenuous link, the only conclusion I can reach as of yet is that Vigilant Tyrannos are a semi-independent enclave of the Drifters operating more or less on their own, but for the advancement and/or protection of their society.

Given their obvious and already demonstrated military capabilities I think the latter is more likely than the former. It is only too bad that the attributes available do not include a member count. Because with at least 27 of the enclave cohorts, I am left wondering what the other 26 specialized in?

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY

Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#90 - 2015-02-18 16:32:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Aria Jenneth
Celestia Via wrote:
My viewpoint is that those two cultures perhaps never coexisted (the Talocan could be already absent when the Sleepers arrived) or that they had found some common ground, some form of mutual cooperation.

It's also possible that the Sleepers were to the Talocan in Anoikis what we are to the Sleepers.

That is, either home invaders or tomb robbers, with some ambiguity about exactly which.
Che Biko
Alexylva Paradox
#91 - 2015-02-18 16:42:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Che Biko
I noticed the AAN article describes the structures being around 160km from end to end. I measured one in Merolles yesterday, and it was around 195 km, give or take 500 meters.

Also attempted entry at what I figured would be the most suitable points to do so, but a forcefield similar to anti-collision shielding prevented this. In one of the spots where this happened, I was actually inside the "doorway", so to speak, only to be stopped there. This is similar to stations docking areas, so its possible that that point could indeed be used for ships that are cleared to enter it.

I was not attacked, though.
Jaret Victorian
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#92 - 2015-02-18 18:53:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Jaret Victorian
Copying the report here as it seems like we are consolidating all our discoveries in this thread.

Expedition Report
Uncolaked Unidentified Structure Song
System Eystur


Following Mr. Mintor's report about strange signals that Unidentified Structures make, we sent out a team to record and analyze these strange waves.

We managed to pick up two long samples of what appears to be some sort of "song" and a strange beeping near an Unidentified Structure in Eystur.

Sample one. Unidentified Structure "Song" in Eystur.
Sample two. Unidentified Structure "Signals" is Eystur.

Addendum №1

Eran Mintor wrote:

Another thing I noted while visiting these sites is the sound. When close to the structure there seems to be a lot of high-pitched white noise that makes it hard to pick out, but when you get some distance you can hear a distinct sound repeating itself, like some kind of message. Its low-pitch reminds me of a foghorn, but it has a pattern similar to Morse code with another sound at intervals like a muffled telephone ring.
Makoto Priano
Kirkinen-Arataka Transhuman Zenith Consulting Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#93 - 2015-02-18 19:20:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Makoto Priano
Now, while I still think poking advanced-technology battleships is a bad idea, I did decide to take a stick to some of the structures. As expected, the various Sleeper structures surrounding the unidentified wormhole in Ruvas, Caldari space, were impenetrable when fired upon.

Secondly, can verify the soundscape Victorian and Mintor have identified. I'm hearing it also, provided my camera drones are far enough from my ship to prevent it from being washed-out by engine noise.

Thirdly, it looks like there's a regular flare at the base of the spines on these Vigilant Tyrannos battleships; presumably, this is power going to the spines for purposes of their navigation field.

Lastly, I noticed that this wormhole was over 20 AU from the nearest planet, and elevated from the system's plane, much as one would expect from a constellation or region stargate. I wonder if this is universal? These wormholes could easily be using a very advanced form of stargate technology to open navigable wormholes.

Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries: exploring the edge of the known, advancing the state of the art. Would you like to know more?

Yoshitaka Moromuo
Burning Skies
Apocalypse Now.
#94 - 2015-02-18 21:38:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Yoshitaka Moromuo
If the structures are invulnerable, that unfortunately rules out any real response in terms of a show of force. More subtle means may be necessary to address those structures.

Were all identifiable structures fired upon? The Tew wormhole had two structures with nine individually identifiable components.
Eran Mintor
Metropolis Commercial Consortium
#95 - 2015-02-18 22:24:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Eran Mintor
Soldarius wrote:
per wrote:
hi fellow capsuleers,

i wonder about one thing, WHO and WHERE get these informations:
http://pasteboard.co/1daIi8nC.png

is CONCORD administrator of this info database? if yes, where did they take this info from?

we noticed this info is freely available when we met one drifter "guy" Tyrannos Strategos,
he killed one of our guys without any warning while he was sitting in unarmed ship
we tried to contact this drifter guy so he could explain his actions but he wasnt responding to any kind of our communication, either he wasnt able to communicate with us or more likely he wasnt interested in any sort of communication
we then decided to take him out to save other capsuleers that might have been traveling around

theres more info from the online database
http://pasteboard.co/1dbo3xBZ.png


This information is all released by CONCORD, and a lot can be gleaned from it. Basically, it means that Vigilant Tyrannos is an enclave (corp) belonging to the Drifter faction (alliance). Their HQ is an office in Jove space. But they do not own the station, nor any other station. Since settled systems are incremented only if the corp owns the station, they have 0 settled systems.

I think one of the more important tidbits of information within that corporate information screen is that they "operate under a single command structure represented by an enclave level organization".

If I remember my political science courses correctly, historically the jovians refered to the various segments of their socio-political structure as "enclaves", with different enclaves operating more or less autonomously, though in a generally coordinated manner for the betterment of their society.

Then I recalled the rather conspicuous site in Anoikis named "Ruins of Enclave Cohort 27"; conspicuous by its name and frequency in low-end C2 w-space systems.

Quote:
Entirely void of any signs of life, this small pocket of deadspace echoes a story told all over the vast stretches of the unknown regions; the demise of the ancient Sleeper race. Information portals – offering the only data that is decipherable – refer to the area as “Enclave Cohort 27”, identifying the two enclaves amongst many other Sleeper settlements. One enclave has clearly been disconnected from its power supply, whilst the other has succumbed to the same solemn fate for some other, unknown cause.


I also did a database search on the term "cohort". The results were a bit surprising and led me in some interesting directions.

I would surmise that an "Enclave Cohort" could be a enclave emergency response team of some kind. Or it could have been an educational institution. Or more menacingly, a military unit. In any case, they would have been people connected by societal similarities and a common task.

In any case, with only a single-word similarity and possibly a point of origin for a tenuous link, the only conclusion I can reach as of yet is that Vigilant Tyrannos are a semi-independent enclave of the Drifters operating more or less on their own, but for the advancement and/or protection of their society.

Given their obvious and already demonstrated military capabilities I think the latter is more likely than the former. It is only too bad that the attributes available do not include a member count. Because with at least 27 of the enclave cohorts, I am left wondering what the other 26 specialized in?


I had a similar though different interpretation of the word "Cohort", though I do feel these sites need to be looked into further. Cohort is a term in taxonomy with taxonomy being "the science of defining groups of biological organisms on the basis of shared characteristics and giving names to those groups."

cohort (noun; Latin cohors, enclosure): In older classifications, indefinite taxonomic groups ranked above a superorder, between class and order, or related families.

Class and order are groups in taxonomy that define how plants and other animals are different from each other, with cohorts being a subsection as listed above.

These groups go from top to bottom, where species being the most specific and domain the most inclusive and broad. Humans are the only of their species but can also be compared to all other mammal species. Mammalia is a group of animal within the Phylum "Chordata".

The word Cohort in that perspective now takes on an entirely different meaning. If we assume Enclave Cohort 27 was not just a Sleeper Enclave, but a different section of a species named Cohort #27, we would want to believe that all the Sleepers were not only acting independently of each other, as Enclave suggests, but also doing enough bioengineering on themselves to become biologically separate species.

I'm by no means an expert in taxonomy so I would do some research yourself, as I will be doing later when I get the time. However it seems to match and be further reinforced by the public database information pointed out by per earlier.

-Eran
Malissa Hehir
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#96 - 2015-02-18 22:36:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Malissa Hehir
I was anchored about 6,500 meters away from one of the huge structures. I saw one of there vessels. It was 134 KM away. It didn't lock on but in the blink of an eye it went inside the structure. No aggression towards me yet.... Correction. It just appeared to go inside. It actually warped to a near by wormhole. I guessing they could be scouts for an invasion of some sort.
Malissa Hehir
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#97 - 2015-02-18 22:41:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Malissa Hehir
Sleeper now approaching in Agtver. They seem to arrive at intervals, one at a time.
Jaret Victorian
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#98 - 2015-02-18 22:49:43 UTC
Malissa Hehir wrote:
Sleeper now approaching in Agtver. They seem to arrive at intervals, one at a time.

Their behavior hd already been documented, look here if you are interested.
Captain Davison
Malachi Keep Detachments
#99 - 2015-02-19 04:16:19 UTC
Jaret Victorian wrote:
Copying the report here as it seems like we are consolidating all our discoveries in this thread.

Expedition Report
Uncolaked Unidentified Structure Song
System Eystur


Following Mr. Mintor's report about strange signals that Unidentified Structures make, we sent out a team to record and analyze these strange waves.

We managed to pick up two long samples of what appears to be some sort of "song" and a strange beeping near an Unidentified Structure in Eystur.

Sample one. Unidentified Structure "Song" in Eystur.
Sample two. Unidentified Structure "Signals" is Eystur.

Addendum №1

Eran Mintor wrote:

Another thing I noted while visiting these sites is the sound. When close to the structure there seems to be a lot of high-pitched white noise that makes it hard to pick out, but when you get some distance you can hear a distinct sound repeating itself, like some kind of message. Its low-pitch reminds me of a foghorn, but it has a pattern similar to Morse code with another sound at intervals like a muffled telephone ring.


It might be futile, but I believe there may be ways to see if pictures might be encoded in the audio. I've heard of that being used in certain primitive areas, or for situations that prevent a full digital uplink.
Morgan Wulver
SAYR Reserve Guard
SAYR Galactic
#100 - 2015-02-19 06:26:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Morgan Wulver
A minor report from the field... Though I'm hard pressed to call it a formal report so much as fool-hearty attempt by myself and my colleage to elicit a noteworthy response from these Drifters. Going off the work of several independent capsuleers operating across the cluster we have managed to locate one of these structures that has appeared in the Akora system. After laying siege to a small flight of seeker drones over an extended period of time I was incapable of forcing conflict with these drifters to aid in the defense of the spire.

I'm certain there are plenty out there who are capable of adequately explaining the behavior and tactics of these drones from a scientific perspective rather than what small sliver of behavior I was able to observe at close range, but I'm certain I experienced a substantial amount of harmonic radio chatter from these craft. The tune was unsettling at best and was more than enough to scare one of my yeomen into terminating his contract on board my vessel the moment we pulled into dock to rearm and regroup for a second attack on the structure.

I've arrived at the conclusion that even after the destruction of several of these vanguard drones whatever forces are capable of scrambling these advanced battleships simply refuse to see a small groups of capsuleers as a significant threat. We're treated like ants at a roadside picnic, and are hardly bothered when we occasionally lash out in force. Therefore, I hope to organize a much more substantial assault on the spire with the aid of several coordinated battlecruisers to lay down continuous fire on any and all units deploying from the structure.

With the help of three or four Drakes we could easily create a large enough display to merit the deployment of a drifter craft into Akura. When such a response arrives, it's my goal that such a dedicate task force may prove themselves capable of temporarily distracting the craft long enough for a single frigate to perform a close-range scan or deploy a camera drone into the anomalies that they are capable of generating. If the tactic worked against Sansha's nation, I see little reason why it wouldn't work now under similar circumstances and similar technology. To reiterate, the goal if this project is not to succeed in combat against these craft. Frankly, I don't believe a single ship on the market has a hope of standing toe to toe with this technology. We only aim to force a response and repel such retaliation long enough for a research craft to perform a detailed analysis, then make a hasty retreat to the safety of the nearby CreoDron supply factory.

I will keep you updated on the progress of our endeavor. In the mean time, I would advise against travel into the Akora system unless absolutely necessary.

Kirjuun! Uakan! Teknikiara! Kanpai kameitsamuu! Ra ra ra!