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why do players stay in npc corps?

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Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
#261 - 2015-03-14 12:02:10 UTC
It's the same old story, Emergent gameplay vs Themepark gameplay.

This type of player enjoys safe havens where everything is safe and predictable, so they try to avoid situations that can lead to emergent gameplay scenarios. But even with their efforts, eventually they will face their first unexpected road block created by other players, and then they will quit the game crying about griefing.

The Tears Must Flow
Thorn en Distel
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#262 - 2015-03-14 12:16:05 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Thorn en Distel wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Thorn en Distel wrote:

I just have issues with EVE.


It shows.

This is paranoia on a whole other level, dude. Especially the part where you absolutely refuse to accept any risk that isn't dictated by you in advance. (which condemning other people who do the same)

It would not be a stretch for me to say that EVE is not for you.


I think you're rather confusing things here. This game leaves you a lot of different paths to walk. I chose the NPC corp route, which is perfectly legitimate. It denies you certain options, but also gives you a few others. Just because those are not the options YOU chose, does not mean they are invalid. Or that EVE is not for people who don't do things your way


*Snip* Please refrain from personal attacks. ISD Ezwal.

I was talking about your little rant about how you WILL NOT do all variety of things, etc, etc.


Not doing those things is a valid choice in this game. Again, it's you who are missing the point. This thread is about why people remain in NPC corps, in stead of moving on to player corps. I gave my personal reasons, you are just not willing to accept them.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#263 - 2015-03-14 12:18:56 UTC
Thorn en Distel wrote:

Not doing those things is a valid choice in this game.


You still misunderstand.

Your insistence to not share EVE with anyone you know, based solely on those hideous misconceptions about how the game works, is what I find to be both sad and bewildering.


"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Thorn en Distel
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#264 - 2015-03-14 12:22:21 UTC
Vaju Enki wrote:
It's the same old story, Emergent gameplay vs Themepark gameplay.

This type of player enjoys safe havens where everything is safe and predictable, so they try to avoid situations that can lead to emergent gameplay scenarios. But even with their efforts, eventually they will face their first unexpected road block created by other players, and then they will quit the game crying about griefing.


I don't think this is the case. Personally, I hate themeparks, play them through once and everything after is been-there-done-that boring. I much prefer sandboxes.

I'm also someone who prefers PVP games, some with WAY harsher rulesets than EVE (try permanently losing skills on each death, AND temporarily losing skills untill you pay a hefty price to get them back, AND suffering a debuff on each death AND having to pay to respawn).

And I still stay in an NPC corps.

/shrug
Thorn en Distel
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#265 - 2015-03-14 12:35:35 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Thorn en Distel wrote:

Not doing those things is a valid choice in this game.


You still misunderstand.

Your insistence to not share EVE with anyone you know, based solely on those hideous misconceptions about how the game works, is what I find to be both sad and bewildering.




Lack of reading skills much? I also said some of us DO play this game. We just don't make a corp here.

As to misconceptions... puhlease... don't confuse forum alt with main character age or actual experience with the game. Some of us have been around in EVE since launch. And we actually HAVE seen exactly what happened to a few guilds we know who tried making a corp here. Wardecced on day 1, lost interest in playing within a month. It's so much fun after all if you can't even undock your nooby velator without getting exploded...

Who says we're not sharing by the way... we do tell them exactly what to expect. Which is why most aren't even remotely interested in even trying the game. P
Erin Crawford
#266 - 2015-03-14 14:13:14 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:

Oh, really?

When I still played World of Warcraft with my wife, I once followed someone across the entire game server for 7 consecutive hours, ganking him all the while. My only reason? He pissed me off by taking an herbalism node...



...

Shocked

"Those who talk don’t know. Those who know don’t talk. "
ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#267 - 2015-03-14 15:06:50 UTC
I have removed some rule breaking posts and those quoting them. As always I let some edge cases stay.
Please people, keep it on topic and above all civil!

The Rules:
4. Personal attacks are prohibited.

Commonly known as flaming, personal attacks are posts that are designed to personally berate or insult another forum user. Posts of this nature are not beneficial to the community spirit that CCP promote and as such they will not be tolerated.

ISD Ezwal Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Errata Sum
Doomheim
#268 - 2015-03-14 15:26:30 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
When I still played World of Warcraft with my wife, I once followed someone across the entire game server for 7 consecutive hours, ganking him all the while.


Please point on the doll where the gnome touched you.
Syn Shi
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#269 - 2015-03-14 15:28:42 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Thorn en Distel wrote:

Mate, a lot of the stuff you get away with in EVE will get you insta-banned in any other game.


Oh, really?

When I still played World of Warcraft with my wife, I once followed someone across the entire game server for 7 consecutive hours, ganking him all the while. My only reason? He pissed me off by taking an herbalism node.

When he brought a GM in, the GM laughed and said "PvP happens on PvP servers."

Even in WoW, one of the most legendarily wussy of MMOs, you can PvP freely within the rules.

EVE's rules are simply more broad, with more avenues of attack.


Quote:

You may not consider it to be griefing, hell, the EVE devs may not consider it to be griefing, but you're all in a rather small minority, even for full-on PVP games (which EVE really, really isn't). Which kinda explains the problem with new player retention too.


Yeah, no. You do not get to define your own terms here. Only CCP's definition matters in this context, you can wave whichever dictionary you like at me.

PvP activity in this game, within the rules set by CCP, is not griefing by definition. Whether your attitude agrees or not.



And the definition of sandbox is everyone is allowed to play the way they want.

The End....good, you came around to understand the meaning of sandbox.
Anabella Rella
Gradient
Electus Matari
#270 - 2015-03-14 16:30:39 UTC
Vaju Enki wrote:
It's the same old story, Emergent gameplay vs Themepark gameplay.

This type of player enjoys safe havens where everything is safe and predictable, so they try to avoid situations that can lead to emergent gameplay scenarios. But even with their efforts, eventually they will face their first unexpected road block created by other players, and then they will quit the game crying about griefing.


What a load of bigoted, elitist crap. Even if these horrid generalizations were correct, so what? That's their business. When you pay their sub fees then you get to dictate and judge how someone else plays. Until then, step down from your high mountain and breathe. Seems the thin air up where you are has deprived your brain of oxygen and damaged your critical thinking skills.

When the world is running down, you make the best of what's still around.
Jvpiter
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#271 - 2015-03-14 16:43:41 UTC
Syn Shi wrote:



And the definition of sandbox is everyone is allowed to play the way they want.



This is logically impossible. Everyone cannot be simultaneously allowed to play single player and multiplayer at the same time. One style of gameplay must be secondary to the other.


In EVE, your right to play single player ends when someone decides to shoot you, or .01 ISK you, or insert any PVP action here.


It is as simple as that.


Call me Joe.
Gardav
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#272 - 2015-03-14 18:46:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Gardav
Jvpiter wrote:
Syn Shi wrote:



And the definition of sandbox is everyone is allowed to play the way they want.



This is logically impossible. Everyone cannot be simultaneously allowed to play single player and multiplayer at the same time. One style of gameplay must be secondary to the other.


In EVE, your right to play single player ends when someone decides to shoot you, or .01 ISK you, or insert any PVP action here.


It is as simple as that.




At no time in EVE have I ever played it as a single player game, nor have I ever been confused about that issue. EVE is a multiplayer game in so many ways they can't be counted. After chatting with others in NPC Corps over the years I get the sense that they too realize EVE is a multiplayer as well.

Yet some of us chose to keep our characters in NPC Corps. In a Multiplayer Game. The Original Poster of this thread asked why and some of us have tried to explain why. We don't expect everyone to understand our reasoning.

It's simply a choice we each have made in this Sandbox MMO. The beauty of Sandbox MMOs is that we all are allowed by the Devs to make whatever choices we wish to (within the game rules), and in so doing we are seeing to our own satisfaction as customers better than any Customer Service Rep employed by CCP ever could, not to mention we contribute to the entire game as a whole and thus make it a richer experience for all.

See You In Space.
Orlacc
#273 - 2015-03-14 19:14:27 UTC
Thorn en Distel wrote:
Vaju Enki wrote:
It's the same old story, Emergent gameplay vs Themepark gameplay.

This type of player enjoys safe havens where everything is safe and predictable, so they try to avoid situations that can lead to emergent gameplay scenarios. But even with their efforts, eventually they will face their first unexpected road block created by other players, and then they will quit the game crying about griefing.


I don't think this is the case. Personally, I hate themeparks, play them through once and everything after is been-there-done-that boring. I much prefer sandboxes.

I'm also someone who prefers PVP games, some with WAY harsher rulesets than EVE (try permanently losing skills on each death, AND temporarily losing skills untill you pay a hefty price to get them back, AND suffering a debuff on each death AND having to pay to respawn).

And I still stay in an NPC corps.

/shrug



Which elf games do this? Permanent skill loss?

"Measure Twice, Cut Once."
Syn Shi
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#274 - 2015-03-14 19:57:57 UTC
Jvpiter wrote:
Syn Shi wrote:



And the definition of sandbox is everyone is allowed to play the way they want.



This is logically impossible. Everyone cannot be simultaneously allowed to play single player and multiplayer at the same time. One style of gameplay must be secondary to the other.


In EVE, your right to play single player ends when someone decides to shoot you, or .01 ISK you, or insert any PVP action here.


It is as simple as that.





Moving goal posts and Alice in Wonderland logic.

E for effort.
Prince Kobol
#275 - 2015-03-14 20:03:30 UTC
I will throw my own two pence in.

NPC Corps are one of many things CCP has gotten badly wrong and failed to correct it until it has become almost impossible to do anything with.

For me NPC corps should of only ever of been something that a player stayed in short while whilst searching for another corp or when taking time out.

Yes I agree that war decs are complete rubbish and need to be completely scrapped and started over again but it will never happen.

The thing is this topic has come up time and time again and the truth of the matter nothing will ever change because CCP will never nerf NPC corps or do awsy with war decs whilst the PCU continues on its downwards curve and they are losing subs so get used to it.
MiSANTHR0PE
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#276 - 2015-03-14 20:10:51 UTC
Orlacc wrote:
Thorn en Distel wrote:
Vaju Enki wrote:
It's the same old story, Emergent gameplay vs Themepark gameplay.

This type of player enjoys safe havens where everything is safe and predictable, so they try to avoid situations that can lead to emergent gameplay scenarios. But even with their efforts, eventually they will face their first unexpected road block created by other players, and then they will quit the game crying about griefing.


I don't think this is the case. Personally, I hate themeparks, play them through once and everything after is been-there-done-that boring. I much prefer sandboxes.

I'm also someone who prefers PVP games, some with WAY harsher rulesets than EVE (try permanently losing skills on each death, AND temporarily losing skills untill you pay a hefty price to get them back, AND suffering a debuff on each death AND having to pay to respawn).

And I still stay in an NPC corps.

/shrug



Which elf games do this? Permanent skill loss?


Haven & Hearth


My main lived in npc corp for around a year, now in a one man band corp, for no other reason than I'm not too sociable, slightly introvert and can be a little shy, I did try two player corps and enjoyed the fleets and playing with others, but not so much the social side, most corps expect you to be chatty on coms etc, which i understand, but its just not for me, it tires me out.
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#277 - 2015-03-14 20:59:40 UTC
Syn Shi wrote:
Jvpiter wrote:
Syn Shi wrote:

And the definition of sandbox is everyone is allowed to play the way they want.

This is logically impossible. Everyone cannot be simultaneously allowed to play single player and multiplayer at the same time. One style of gameplay must be secondary to the other.

In EVE, your right to play single player ends when someone decides to shoot you, or .01 ISK you, or insert any PVP action here.

It is as simple as that.

Moving goal posts and Alice in Wonderland logic.

E for effort.

I don't think he's moved the goalposts at all.

I also don't think the definition of sandbox is that everyone is allowed to play the way they want.

It's more commonly defined as placing minimal limitations on players, so they have freedom to choose how and when to do things. It might seem the same as what you wrote, but it isn't.

None of us are allowed to play the way we want all the time. Interaction with other players making their choices leading to conflict (not just shooting, but conflict in choices) is going to make someone change what they are doing.

I think that is what Jvpiter was saying. Sandbox yes. Everyone allowed to play the way they want, impossible.
Caladin Brood
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#278 - 2015-03-14 21:02:01 UTC
why? ok case in point, i decided to try a new char out an joined a brand new corp, social blah de blah

boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec

make of it as you will, but to put it simply, to retain new players this needs to stop
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#279 - 2015-03-14 21:29:56 UTC
Caladin Brood wrote:
why? ok case in point, i decided to try a new char out an joined a brand new corp, social blah de blah

boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec
boom wardec

make of it as you will, but to put it simply, to retain new players this needs to stop

Sorry you had 10 wardecs like that, but they aren't that bad.

If you are in the right Corp, they are easily managed and everyone continues to have fun.

Wardecs aren't something to be scared of or ticked off about. The worst that happens is a lost ship and pod, both of which are expendable tools in this game anyway. But that can mostly be avoided in a good Corp.
Caladin Brood
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#280 - 2015-03-14 21:38:53 UTC
They dont bother me as i dont bother about isk or killboards, it is just a prime example of how a new player who does not know anything is introduced to eve, luckily for me it was a alt an not a actually "new player" experience, if it was a new player experience i'd a just lol'd an been thankfull for the trial