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Ewar Capital ships missing!

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Rowells
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2015-02-08 20:34:06 UTC
Thinking a little further into it, giving dreads capital neuts (scaling against subcaps similar to Titan guns) would be neat. You would then have your carriers for fleet support and your dreads for full on capital killing efficiency; in addition to current capabilities.
Victoria Ramsay
Doomheim
#22 - 2015-02-08 21:15:35 UTC
....can you imagine how overpowered an ewar cap would be though? You can already completely **** up a fleet that has capitals by using a scorpion or a bhaalgorn. Jam out their logi and the fleet goes poof.

It could be interesting - but it would need to be thought out very very carefully and tested sufficiently to make sure it's well balanced first.....
Kabark
Schilden
#23 - 2015-02-08 22:04:27 UTC
Victoria Ramsay wrote:
....can you imagine how overpowered an ewar cap would be though? You can already completely **** up a fleet that has capitals by using a scorpion or a bhaalgorn. Jam out their logi and the fleet goes poof.

It could be interesting - but it would need to be thought out very very carefully and tested sufficiently to make sure it's well balanced first.....

I agree this would be very OP. First off, an ECM scorp or widow can devastate an enemy fleet as is until it is destroyed. Secondly, I only see this working for carriers as supers and dreads are immune to ewar (siege). And carriers already have an ewar option, ecm drones x10-15 works pretty damn well. I call them my "chaff and flares."
Lugh Crow-Slave
#24 - 2015-02-08 23:38:00 UTC
Utility support is a job left to sub caps not capitals



capitals are set up to need a sub cap support fleet and be helpless on their own

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#25 - 2015-02-08 23:57:32 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Utility support is a job left to sub caps not capitals



capitals are set up to need a sub cap support fleet and be helpless on their own


Wut?

"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP
d0cTeR9
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#26 - 2015-02-09 00:12:18 UTC
Orchid Fury wrote:
capitals and supercapitals are the worst addition to the game in an attempt to deal with the wrong design issue of massive ehp on ships and structures.
if at all capitals, besides freigthers, should be removed from the game.


Noped. Don't knock 'em cuz you can't fly 'em and cuz they keep killing your ****** little t1 cruiser.

Been around since the beginning.
Anthar Thebess
#27 - 2015-02-09 08:05:42 UTC
We have scorpion, lets use this hull.

What we need is stuff that can affect capitals , especially carriers and mother ships.
Sieged dreads already have multiple drawbacks, Titan cannot defend itself well, even 100 titans on grid is easy target for subcapitals.

Only carriers and mother ships are here the issue.

When there is group of them they can:
- have infinite cap pool thanks to remote energy transfers
- have unbreakable tank thanks to remote reps ( yes you can kill every thing, simply eve nodes are not strong enough to sustain so many ships on grid , and TIDI makes dread doctrines not efficient )
- instantly refit to any situation ( because capitals use subcapital hards, smartbombs, neuts they can easily use their fleet hangar to hold fits for any possible doctrines)
- hold enough drones in the dron bay to replace almost any amount of lost drones.

Yes we can talk about capital level Ewar, but eve is different , or at lease it was this until carriers proved that they are excluded from this rule.

In eve you don't need bigger ship to win, you need to use just your head.
For example :
- someone get lazers - you bring neuts
- someone bring arty guns - you bring tracking distruptors or dampers
- somoene bring missile ships - you bring smartbomb fire wall

Because of this Scorpion should get higslot Ewar modules that will effectively disturb energy transfer range , drone control range , and remote repair range of a carrier or mothership if at the same time this or any other module could affect the ability to refit on filed - slowcats could be finally putted in the place of support fleet , not universal , and "i win" button doctrine.

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Janeway84
Insane's Asylum
#28 - 2015-02-09 08:52:22 UTC
The solution is simple!

Make pirate capitals with ewar bonuses so we can neut and ecm ect. but only t1 caps not supers.
Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#29 - 2015-02-09 12:13:42 UTC
Personally i really up for a dread guristas ewar carrier.

That's gonna be a nasty. With electronics superiority perfect drone damage application but with only one remote repair bonus something like range or duration of rr.

"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP
Ben Ishikela
#30 - 2015-02-09 15:42:58 UTC
Anthar Thebess wrote:
We have scorpion, lets use this hull.

What we need is stuff that can affect capitals , especially carriers and mother ships.
Sieged dreads already have multiple drawbacks, Titan cannot defend itself well, even 100 titans on grid is easy target for subcapitals.
(...)
Only carriers and mother ships are here the issue.
(...)
Yes we can talk about capital level Ewar, but eve is different , or at lease it was this until carriers proved that they are excluded from this rule.
(...)
In eve you don't need bigger ship to win, you need to use just your head.
(...)
Because of this Scorpion should get higslot Ewar modules that will effectively disturb energy transfer range , drone control range , and remote repair range of a carrier or mothership if at the same time this or any other module could affect the ability to refit on filed - slowcats could be finally putted in the place of support fleet , not universal , and "i win" button doctrine.

+1 for more Ewar in Highslots
+1 for Ewar as conter towards capitals
+1 for ewar affecting dronecontrolrange
+1 for more disablers
+1 for Battleship versatility xD
-1 for scorpion only
+4

Ideas are like Seeds. I'd chop fullgrown trees to start a fire.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#31 - 2015-02-09 15:54:36 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Tracking disruptor bonus on a capitalStraight


Do we get bonused capital class remote tracking computer at the same time?
Kabark
Schilden
#32 - 2015-02-09 16:51:07 UTC
Ben Ishikela wrote:
Anthar Thebess wrote:
We have scorpion, lets use this hull.

What we need is stuff that can affect capitals , especially carriers and mother ships.
Sieged dreads already have multiple drawbacks, Titan cannot defend itself well, even 100 titans on grid is easy target for subcapitals.
(...)
Only carriers and mother ships are here the issue.
(...)
Yes we can talk about capital level Ewar, but eve is different , or at lease it was this until carriers proved that they are excluded from this rule.
(...)
In eve you don't need bigger ship to win, you need to use just your head.
(...)
Because of this Scorpion should get higslot Ewar modules that will effectively disturb energy transfer range , drone control range , and remote repair range of a carrier or mothership if at the same time this or any other module could affect the ability to refit on filed - slowcats could be finally putted in the place of support fleet , not universal , and "i win" button doctrine.

+1 for more Ewar in Highslots
+1 for Ewar as conter towards capitals
+1 for ewar affecting dronecontrolrange
+1 for more disablers
+1 for Battleship versatility xD
-1 for scorpion only
+4
Now this is something interesting. EWar that hampers Exfer and RR would be a great battlefield multiplier. Disrupting drone control range reduction could be a script with sensor dampeners? I like this idea but all races should have a ship with dedicated bonuses to such modules. Not just the scorp.
Diospora
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#33 - 2015-02-12 03:00:27 UTC
Kabark wrote:
Victoria Ramsay wrote:
....can you imagine how overpowered an ewar cap would be though? You can already completely **** up a fleet that has capitals by using a scorpion or a bhaalgorn. Jam out their logi and the fleet goes poof.

It could be interesting - but it would need to be thought out very very carefully and tested sufficiently to make sure it's well balanced first.....

I agree this would be very OP. First off, an ECM scorp or widow can devastate an enemy fleet as is until it is destroyed. Secondly, I only see this working for carriers as supers and dreads are immune to ewar (siege). And carriers already have an ewar option, ecm drones x10-15 works pretty damn well. I call them my "chaff and flares."



Of course it would be OP if a battleship hull could do EWAR on capital class ships. This is why (I think) that the OP suggested that there be capital class EWAR ships specifically. That way there is some risk in deploying them to the field. Sure, that capital EWAR ship can mess things up in terms of reducing a fleets effectiveness, blocking bonuses etc. and also being able to EWAR ships that are immune to EWAR but it's also a risk to them in that they have to field a capital class ship that is easily identified and because it's so big, a giant magnet for guns and for dying. Which then brings it down to a risk/reward calculation, do you go after the EWAR cap ship? or do you go after the DPS first?

I still think it's a fantastic idea.

Enabling this kind of ability on any hull less than a capital sized hull defeats the purpose because there must be a risk involved with being able to field something that is potentially as powerful as this could be. i.e. You shouldn't be able to EWAR ships that were previously immune just by spending 200m on a hull. You need to buy a cap to do it.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#34 - 2015-02-12 07:41:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Daichi Yamato
Rowells wrote:
Thinking a little further into it, giving dreads capital neuts (scaling against subcaps similar to Titan guns) would be neat. You would then have your carriers for fleet support and your dreads for full on capital killing efficiency; in addition to current capabilities.


just cannot be used on subcaps.

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Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#35 - 2015-02-12 08:45:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Reaver Glitterstim
I was thinking a while back of having a mini-capital dedicated to pointing and jamming capital and supercapital ships. It would have tank and maneuverability somewhere between a battleship and carrier, so that dreadnoughts can shoot it down but not so easily. It would be a HEAVY heavy interdictor, and in addition to pointing supercapitals, it could use jamming modules specially designed to be effective against capital ships.

Capital neutralizers and nosferatus is also an excellent idea.

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