EVE General Discussion

I see this response a lot, and not just in this thread but in Crime and Punishment and other places.

Fact is it does happen and quite a bit. But these players just quietly leave and don't hop on these forums and rant, most probably don't even use the forums. So unless they are in your Corp you don't see it happening. I.e. people are still dying of starvation in other places. Just because you don't see it or they dont complain to you, doesn't mean they aren't.
(Not comparing people quitting to starving people, just as a literary illustration).

The problem is the WarDec mechanism, and basically these players are risk averse, or to poor in their ISK (because they playing in free time and don't min/max to make isk or have the time to). They then spend all WarDec docked, then get bored, then quit. Lost Subs for CCP is lost employee pay-checks, thats hurts all of us that are still in the game.

I've seen two HS corp I had alts in effectively die this way. I watched the players leave in frustration, give their stuff away (yes i took some it) and walk away.

HOWEVER, despite all that I don't think non-decable corps, or social corps are the solution. CCP should just fix WarDecs. In the case of those two HS corps both were merc'd out of existence. I personally don't have an issue with Merc Corps, more power to them - make you some isk. But maybe CCP could adjust the system. I.e. Someone posts a corp bounty on something like the market, merc corps bid on it. The Corp getting WD by the Mercs, at least know WHO their enemy is. This then gives them options 1) Merc back (more explosions) 2) Diplo the hiring players/corp 3) Counter bid Merc corp to attack original hiring corp. All of this is more player options and more sandbox than we have now, and more explosion generally.

Don't remove Decs, don't screw merc corps, don't make social corps... just fix the flippen WarDec mechanic, give us more options to deal with decs (beyond surrender, which is kind of stupid imho). I think that will be more effective at reducing player loss from n00bs and HS than just creating new undecable corps.


TL:DR -
1) People really do quit EVE from HS wardec and corp griefs that don't meet CCP definition of grief, but still keep them locked up in station afraid.
2) While you don't care and are happy to see them leave. Lost revenue for CCP means less Devs and game content for those of us still playing. (I.e. we need their money)
3) Fixing WarDecs is a better answer than new undeacable corps.

Meh, we have had new people leave our corp because of wardecs. But the thing is that it was almost always one of these sit in a trade hub loser merc corps. So easy to avoid and not even notice. Yet the new bros just refused to learn, try or do anything. Why? Because they are use to games where it is practically *impossible* to lose anything ever. And that is what they want eve to be.

Sorry but we don't want eve to be just another MMO. There are more than enough of those out there.

And yet this suggestion, despite the fact that 90% of people in this thread have literary made up what they think it is or will be, and has nothing to do with changing wardec mechanisms.

Can you show me those facts?

Are you really talking facts or just your beliefs? Either way can actually be fine because even a belief has to be formed on the basis of observation (unless faith based). So there must be some data to support this statement, either as a fact or as a belief.

As to the comparison with starvation. Aside from seeing it myself, there is a lot of global data I can look up to confirm the truth of the plight of many people in different regions of the World.

So since this comparison was made, where's the comparable data to support the fact that it happens quite a bit?

This is a good thing to start with when one does not have a substantive argument.

What do you think is the problem CCP is trying to fix?

Do you think wardecs need fixing?

Do you think the way to fix wardecs is by introducing a completely new mechanic while simultaneously avoiding any work to fix wardec mechanics?

I don't think they are trying to fix any problem. I *think* they recognize the influence some informal groups such as RVB Ganked and Spectre fleet, or even some Incursion groups for that matter, have had on the game these past few years and they want to accommodate them with in game mechanics akin of what they did with alliance back in the day.

Is a 'non war deckable corp' the solution? If it's the only criteria and definition of what they want to create, then to me the answer is: absolutely not. But if done right and if these social corporations are different enough from normal corporations, then I think they can have a role to play in the eve universe. And being a member of both the RVB Ganked and the Agony Public PVP roam mailing lists, I wouldn't mind these groups being more supported in game as long as I can retain my corp affiliation.

You must have reading comprehension issues. You see, my post pointed out, as do those trailers and ads, that you have a choice to play that way. They don't, in any way shape or form say "this is the only way to play the game".
As you've also pointed out, you are looking at history, and like everything else Eve has evolved (as you have pointed out and yet miraculously failed to grasp). The current advertising and recruitment efforts are different from the past, they are looking for more cooperative players, for they make a more sustainable environment. Things change, suck-it-up buttercup.

Just want to add: the players who do quit on the forums, then get the troll treatment anyway. Some would probably just quit anyway, but if you see a quitting post, most of the replies are: "gief ur stuff!!!" and "good riddance, go back to wow you loser"

The NPSI groups i fly with, this is exactly what it would be like. Very low barrier to entry and quite frankly hard to get kicked from. It is nothing more than a few more in game tools to organize fleets that are not corp centric. ie a place for fits, notices, and not silly limitations on mailing list numbers.