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Social Corps

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Author
Mike Adoulin
Happys Happy Hamster Hunting Club
#221 - 2015-02-05 13:39:00 UTC
Oh, and the only guys I have ever heard of that bothered to do Incursions in null was Rooks and Kings. I think they even made a video about it.

Otherwise, I've never seen any null bears do Incursions, mainly because they are afraid of getting hotdropped.

As for missions in null....heeheehee.....that's funny. Make me laugh some more.

Everything in EVE is a trap.

And if it isn't, it's your job to make it a trap...:)

You want to know what immorality in EVE Online looks like? Look no further than Ripard "Jester" Teg.

Chribba is the Chuck Norris of EVE.

Chopper Rollins
hahahlolspycorp
#222 - 2015-02-05 15:16:34 UTC
Mike Adoulin wrote:
...

As for missions in null....heeheehee.....that's funny. Make me laugh some more.


I did L2s in Utopia area in a Thrasher when i was 3 months into the game. Solo. Much more hassle, risk and fun.
I did higher level missions for Serpentis in the same area where DNS lived, got loads of booster bpcs and some pretty good implants.
It wrecked hisec for me. Same thing but it's like watching TV with the sound muted.
The Godfathers probably still do Serp missions in Fountain and they have pilots who always have sets of Serpentis implants on contracts in Jita. I've seen em ninja PVEing combat sites for the faction cruiser and BS hull bpcs.
While not close to Infinity Ziona levels of dank iskage, it's profitable and fun.

Destiny: your stated reason for staying in hisec is because everybody is huddled there scratching up dem crumbs. Corps need to bum rush null, scrabble up all the ore, gas, moon goo and ratting they can. They will probably get richer and will definitely have more fun.
I support anything that relegates highsec to it's proper status. Rookie pond and quiet zone. Don't sneer at the Blue Donut if you're not willing to go be a red spot in it.


Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good.

Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#223 - 2015-02-05 15:22:23 UTC
Chopper Rollins wrote:
Destiny: your stated reason for staying in hisec is because everybody is huddled there scratching up dem crumbs. Corps need to bum rush null, scrabble up all the ore, gas, moon goo and ratting they can. They will probably get richer and will definitely have more fun.
I support anything that relegates highsec to it's proper status. Rookie pond and quiet zone. Don't sneer at the Blue Donut if you're not willing to go be a red spot in it.

Right, I agree, but the issue is that they're not bum-rushing null, and as such, I'm also avoiding null because it's much less profitable for me. It's not me you need to convince, but them.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted

Shailagh
6Six6Six6Six
#224 - 2015-02-05 15:23:25 UTC
Mike Adoulin wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
I think attempting to game the corp creation system to avoid consequences should warrant being temp banned at least.



CCP used consider war dec evasion ( specifically, folding/dropping your corp to get out of it) an exploit and a bannable offense.

Not anymore, unfortunately.


I remember in 2010/2011 this was the case. Yet another Save the Bears Nerf
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#225 - 2015-02-05 22:46:08 UTC
Or you know, it was another emergent game play like Hyperdunking.
You can't have it both ways. If gankers emergent game play is legit use of niche game mechanics, then so is their targets game play legit use of niche game mechanics.
If it's an exploit, then all those ganker techniques are also exploits.
Good for goose, good for gander and all that jazz.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#226 - 2015-02-05 23:54:15 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Or you know, it was another emergent game play like Hyperdunking.


Hyperdunking does not avoid consequences, that's why it's not an exploit despite how hard carebears cried about it.

Dec dodging is used to avoid consequenecs, specifically to bypass the surrender mechanic. It is a textbook exploit.


Quote:

You can't have it both ways.


That's my line. You can't have the benefits of a player corp, specifically the evasion of NPC corp taxes, and have the perfect safety of an NPC corp by using the dec dodge exploit.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

Kaelynne Rose
WTB Somalians
#227 - 2015-02-06 00:53:57 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Or you know, it was another emergent game play like Hyperdunking.


Hyperdunking does not avoid consequences, that's why it's not an exploit despite how hard carebears cried about it.

Dec dodging is used to avoid consequenecs, specifically to bypass the surrender mechanic. It is a textbook exploit.


Quote:

You can't have it both ways.


That's my line. You can't have the benefits of a player corp, specifically the evasion of NPC corp taxes, and have the perfect safety of an NPC corp by using the dec dodge exploit.


Tru dat. Just a few years ago if your bear corp got decced and you folded corp and immediately reopened it a couple times you would get temp banned. Was considered an exploit. Then precious bears kept getting in trouble for it and kept crying and next thing you know.... ccp says its no longer an exploit lol

Right around the time James 315 his holiness started using same then legal tactic to **** off the bears lol
Vector Symian
0 Fear
#228 - 2015-02-06 03:20:39 UTC
Um social corp!?....Scope Corp definitely!

Scope Corp - Best corp Cool
Shailagh
6Six6Six6Six
#229 - 2015-02-06 05:06:51 UTC
Vector Symian wrote:
Um social corp!?....Scope Corp definitely!

Scope Corp - Best corp Cool


Scopies are my favorite npc corp and also the best to scam. Seem to be a ton of people always coming in and out so lots of idiot marks.
Vector Symian
0 Fear
#230 - 2015-02-06 05:11:32 UTC
Shailagh wrote:
Vector Symian wrote:
Um social corp!?....Scope Corp definitely!

Scope Corp - Best corp Cool


Scopies are my favorite npc corp and also the best to scam. Seem to be a ton of people always coming in and out so lots of idiot marks.


We aim to please Blink

and I hope I fall for one of your scams soon Mam

*starts throwing money at her*

TAKE MY MONEY!

o7

Vector
Shailagh
6Six6Six6Six
#231 - 2015-02-06 16:17:23 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Or you know, it was another emergent game play like Hyperdunking.
You can't have it both ways. If gankers emergent game play is legit use of niche game mechanics, then so is their targets game play legit use of niche game mechanics.
If it's an exploit, then all those ganker techniques are also exploits.
Good for goose, good for gander and all that jazz.


I think most gankers/elite highsec pvpers would trade hyperdunking any of the following
fixed wardecs
keeping safari awoxes
consequences for total safety and immunity the typical bear corp has.

Hyperdunking affects only the total afk/logged off player and its gotta be like .0023x10^-315 percentage of hisec indy players that actually die from hyperdunking.

You cant say "lol u guys get to hyperdunk, u dont need anything else/bears can exploit total safety from anything all cuz u get hyperdunking"

We would trade hyperdunking in a heart beat for an actual buff to the pvpers of hisec
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#232 - 2015-02-06 17:22:23 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
You seem upset about null, too bad.

Yes, I'm pretty upset about how boring and inconsequential it is, and how the only pvp to be found in it on a reliable basis amounts to the EVE version of WoW battlegrounds.
I didn't write that. Pfft, misquoting.

While we're there though, perhaps it's "boring" because you "real" PvPers like to live in highsec and shoot industrials without having to commit anything beyond the current ship you fly. Personally, I enjoy null.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#233 - 2015-02-06 17:29:13 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Hyperdunking does not avoid consequences, that's why it's not an exploit despite how hard carebears cried about it.
Sure it does. It ignore the 15 minutes you're supposed to not be able to fly around in ships by using an alt to dump ships for you to board.

Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Dec dodging is used to avoid consequenecs, specifically to bypass the surrender mechanic. It is a textbook exploit.
Wrong on both counts. A wardec is an action taken by another player against you, not a consequence, and it has counters one of which is reforming the corp. If the wardeccer doesn't take that into account, that's their failing.

And no, if it was "textbook" it would still be banned. It's not, so it's not an exploit. Don't get me wrong though, neither is hyperdunking, no matter how much I believe it should be.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Shailagh
6Six6Six6Six
#234 - 2015-02-06 17:57:38 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Hyperdunking does not avoid consequences, that's why it's not an exploit despite how hard carebears cried about it.
Sure it does. It ignore the 15 minutes you're supposed to not be able to fly around in ships by using an alt to dump ships for you to board.

Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Dec dodging is used to avoid consequenecs, specifically to bypass the surrender mechanic. It is a textbook exploit.
Wrong on both counts. A wardec is an action taken by another player against you, not a consequence, and it has counters one of which is reforming the corp. If the wardeccer doesn't take that into account, that's their failing.

And no, if it was "textbook" it would still be banned. It's not, so it's not an exploit. Don't get me wrong though, neither is hyperdunking, no matter how much I believe it should be.


Didnt you play this game a few years ago? Dec dodging by reforming corp was an exploit. Nothing has changed except a ton of bears got tempbanned and cried so ccp deemed it now magically wasnt an exploit.

Its the same exact mechanics to reforming a corp as when it was classified as exploit. If bears just obeyed the law and didnt cry a few years ago and didnt exploit, ccp wouldnt have had to cave in and allow it
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#235 - 2015-02-06 20:50:08 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:

That's my line. You can't have the benefits of a player corp, specifically the evasion of NPC corp taxes, and have the perfect safety of an NPC corp by using the dec dodge exploit.

Bwahahahaha.
Whine some more about something that isn't an exploit. It's also not perfect safety, and nor is it effort free. Also, it's irrelevant to social corps who the current information tells us that they will have to pay NPC corp taxes still.
Kamahl Daikun
State War Academy
Caldari State
#236 - 2015-02-06 21:33:09 UTC
Shailagh wrote:
and even blow you mister peen!!


My sides are now lost in Jove space.

Un-war-deccable corps seems like a bad idea.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#237 - 2015-02-06 23:03:22 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Wrong on both counts. A wardec is an action taken by another player against you, not a consequence,


Heh, nope. You failed to pay attention to the "bypass surrender mechanic" part. That's a big part of what makes it an exploit. You can dissolve a wardec without using the dec dodge exploit, but since the dec dodge exploit is basically free, people don't use the surrender function.

It avoids consequences, and is a textbook example of an exploit, whether CCP permits it or not. The only thing that's up for discussion is whether it's allowed or not, and I'm arguing that it be harshly punished.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

Lupe Meza
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#238 - 2015-02-07 00:03:11 UTC
UberFly wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Because a social corporation option combined with the triviality of avoiding wars is essentially a war-immune corporation with a tax of having to remake it every two days. The only literal drawback is the inability to maintain a POS.

I'm trying to understand this (not being snarky), but it seems you've combined a couple distinctly separate things here.
A social corporation wouldn't need to roll-corps to avoid wars, because they would be un-dec-able. The balance for this is all the same drawbacks of an NPC corp, high tax, no POS. It's function would, from what I can see, only be to allow NPC-corp-style players to group themselves and have common chat and social interaction. So, for example, my hauler-alt could join the "hauler's local 239" social corp, and I chat with other haulers about hauler-y stuff and tanking my freighter. This provides no material benefit to the player, as they had the same things in the NPC corp. It makes it easier to find this new corp though, and find people who might be like you.

The triviality of avoiding wars is only useable/abuseable by regular player corps. Those can have low/no taxes, and no POS to deal with when rolling-corp to avoid a war, or a POS that they can roll. The possible change really has no effect on this either way.


And it also provides a good venue for new players to meetup with people they enjoy playing with and forming a normal corp down the line when they're ready to tackle bigger enterprises with people they've built a relationship with. I think this is a good move as it will give players a taste of the social aspect of this game, without committing to a full blown corp and the following culture and personalities. Some solo players want to do their own thing without the drama and demands that accompany guilds, corps, or whatever mechanic the MMO uses for player alliances.

Again, this is a great way to get new players feet wet, and help them find players with the same game interests, playtimes, etc in an environment that sounds like a good stepping stone to moving on to a player corp or better yet, founding one with like-minded people you played with in the social corp and forming your own identity in the universe. Not to mention within the social corp there will be opportunities for the players to stage content elsewhere in New Eden and daytrip to areas they otherwise wouldn't.

Roaming is suddenly less intimidating if you can get 10 newbs together and don't have to go all in by joining a PVP corp and deploying yourself god knows where, with players you might not even end up liking, before you figure out what you want to do in EVE. And there is A LOT to do in EVE, don't let the Jita Undock fool you. Ship vs Ship is inevitable but hardly all that EVE has to offer, nor the only form of PVP in this PVP game. I see nothing wrong with more tools and supports for new players to get acclimated and maybe hang around a bit longer; this game is terrible solo IMO. If I didn't luck up into a good group of guys within 4 days of playing I would have been gone a long time ago, but here I am year 3. And eager to see what other changes are coming down the pipe.

But naturally, if could possibly lead to one less newbie potentially getting blown to hell by some bored 10 year's t3/pirate ship in High Sec, it is a terrible idea.
Kaelynne Rose
WTB Somalians
#239 - 2015-02-07 01:19:51 UTC
"Be The Villian!"
Scams/Ganks make real headline newpapers
Pure pvp (even market for u whimps) focused game
Meaning death/loss
High risks for high rewards
PvP SANDBOX


I still dony understand why some carebears ever sign up? Let alone sub the second month...
I mean i love me some spaceships and sci-fi, but theres pve ones
And no dude, majority of bears aint "market-pvping" lol. They are "level my raven, make my points/money/isk counter go up and up"

Seriously, gtfo and go play some other mmo, hell half of them dont even socialize so why play ANY mmo? I just dont understand.

Like deciding to go climb Mount Everest, then getting upset and actually flabbergasted that its cold and you cant breathe.
Wtf did you bears expect? Go play a different game.
Syn Shi
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#240 - 2015-02-07 02:11:28 UTC
If shutting the corp down is an exploit I guess leaving a fight is an exploit as well.


I declare war...you have to fight me....because I say so.....wah!!!!!!!!!