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Post-Hyperion Wormhole Activity

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Adarnof
Anoikis Equilibrium
Honorable Third Party
#1 - 2015-01-23 02:39:28 UTC
Nice to see some chatter about wormholes in the CSM minutes today.

Remember back when Hyperion was being shoved down our throats, Fozzie had a wonderful graph displaying user activities in wormhole space? If I recall correctly (one can confirm this by reading just one page of the still-pinned and active feedback threads) the changes were not well received. I'm well past the point of arguing about them, but frankly I think we're owed some followup statistics showing the effect Hyperion has had.

About a month ago I poked current CSM members regarding statistics and was told they could do nothing, that I had to bother Fozzie. Well consider yourself bothered, sir. I hear you have the stats ready: "CCP Fozzie opened the meeting by showing the CSM some new statistics regarding activity in wormhole space. " (CSM Winter Summit day two minutes, page 2). Are they ready to be shared with the rest of the community? I'd be eager to see if the outcome was as drastic as feared or if we players were willing to adapt from the get-go.

Frankly I'm disappointed we're entering month 6 of this change with no response from CCP. With such notable outrage (remember those mobile depots outside Jita?) warranting the release of the ISD hounds onto our poor subforum, I'd think CCP would be interested in repairing their relation with our niche community. This would be a good first step.
calaretu
Honestly We didnt know
#2 - 2015-01-23 05:32:20 UTC
My only complaint is that those threads havent been unstickied.

~Bringer of happiness

http://collapsedbehind.blogspot.no/
Newt BlackCompany
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#3 - 2015-01-23 07:03:24 UTC
It would be interesting to see those statistics...
corbexx
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2015-01-23 08:32:43 UTC
calaretu wrote:
My only complaint is that those threads havent been unstickied.


i'll see if i can get them unstickied

Corbexx for CSM X - Wormholes still deserve better
corbexx
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2015-01-23 08:35:29 UTC
Adarnof wrote:

About a month ago I poked current CSM members regarding statistics and was told they could do nothing, that I had to bother Fozzie. Well consider yourself bothered, sir. I hear you have the stats ready: "CCP Fozzie opened the meeting by showing the CSM some new statistics regarding activity in wormhole space. " (CSM Winter Summit day two minutes, page 2). Are they ready to be shared with the rest of the community? I'd be eager to see if the outcome was as drastic as feared or if we players were willing to adapt from the get-go.


thing is there are stats and there are STATS, and its something i'm working on since i'd love to get some stuff for everyone to see.

Corbexx for CSM X - Wormholes still deserve better
HoruSeth
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2015-01-23 08:38:04 UTC
corbexx wrote:
Adarnof wrote:

I'd be eager to see if the outcome was as drastic as feared or if we players were willing to adapt from the get-go.


thing is there are stats and there are STATS, and its something i'm working on since i'd love to get some stuff for everyone to see.


So drastic, that you need to work on them? Shocked

On my gravestone will be written: "Died because he used sarcasm in the wrong moment"
Nnezu
Artificial Memories
#7 - 2015-01-23 10:38:06 UTC
Adarnof wrote:
With such notable outrage (remember those mobile depots outside Jita?) warranting the release of the ISD hounds onto our poor subforum, I'd think CCP would be interested in repairing their relation with our niche community. This would be a good first step.


The outrage was from a vocal few, and you're totally forgeting about the people who actually LOVE those changes. And to be fair, the mass of closed threads was not constructive feedback but plain trolling and namecalling.
Papa Django
Materials Harvesting Kombinat
#8 - 2015-01-23 10:41:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Papa Django
Hyperion was a disaster for wormhole activity. We saw nobody in wormholes at that time. The next releases were the best wormholes release, the large anchor rig fixed the issue for collapsing, the pop of nullsec data/relic + the up for blue loots have augmented drastically the low class wormhole activity.

Everything is fine now :)
HTC NecoSino
Suddenly Carebears
Verlate
#9 - 2015-01-23 14:00:44 UTC  |  Edited by: HTC NecoSino
It's harder to camp bears, it's easier to run sites.
The feeling of safety leads to more bears
More bears leads to less need to camp bears
Bears are flying shinier ships than before due to the increased isk being made

As a PvPer who had to take a break shortly before the API was turned off, and came back this past December, I've been having as much fun now as I was from before the changes.
Levina Windstar
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2015-01-23 14:02:43 UTC
What's happening is that there is more explorer in WH = more people scanning = WH have more open connections in them. But you almost never see any sign of life for any PVE activities. Most of the activity is ppl farming Null-sec site from time to time or doing gas untill the sleeper wave spawn.

Like it or hate it, that's what WH is now...

"I can make billions using my mouth ...

... and sometimes when I talk, too" --- Solecist Project
Sith1s Spectre
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2015-01-23 14:28:51 UTC
I would honestly say nowdays there's more activity and ships moving around WH space (from my perspective) than there has been in the past year.

Resident forum troll and fashion consultant
Icarus Able
Refuse.Resist
#12 - 2015-01-23 17:25:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Icarus Able
To be fair. 6 months is the minimum you need to see how good any serious changes are. The first months stats are pointless as its just the old guard whining about change. After that people adapt and you can finally see numbers that matter.

Releasing the stats prematurely might have caused outrage and calls to change it back before any lasting changes could be seen.

This coming from someone that is still against the wormhole mass distance changes.
Adarnof
Anoikis Equilibrium
Honorable Third Party
#13 - 2015-01-24 01:08:08 UTC
corbexx wrote:
thing is there are stats and there are STATS, and its something i'm working on since i'd love to get some stuff for everyone to see.

You're always one step ahead eh? Glad to hear it's being addressed.

Nnezu wrote:
The outrage was from a vocal few, and you're totally forgeting about the people who actually LOVE those changes. And to be fair, the mass of closed threads was not constructive feedback but plain trolling and namecalling.

The bulk of the action on forums and reddit were opposed, so it's a big leap to say that the bulk of people were in favour. There's absolutely no way that can be concluded. Sure some people love it, but they were greatly outnumbered by those opposed.

Papa Django wrote:
Hyperion was a disaster for wormhole activity. We saw nobody in wormholes at that time. The next releases were the best wormholes release, the large anchor rig fixed the issue for collapsing, the pop of nullsec data/relic + the up for blue loots have augmented drastically the low class wormhole activity.

Everything is fine now :)
Indeed the recent patches have renewed interest in wormholes, but this interest was only renewed because it was first lost with Hyperion. The bad changes are still bad, just masked with a few band-aids.

Icarus Able wrote:
To be fair. 6 months is the minimum you need to see how good any serious changes are. The first months stats are pointless as its just the old guard whining about change. After that people adapt and you can finally see numbers that matter.

Releasing the stats prematurely might have caused outrage and calls to change it back before any lasting changes could be seen.

So where do we draw the line of prematurity? If immediately after the changes the population crashed, that is a good enough indication they're bad. It took a mere two months for CCP to declare success of their industry change with some nice graphs on the o7 show yet even at 6 months we can't have a single statistic? Frankly I think the longer we wait the more CCP will simply say "look the population is back to normal" as a result of their most recent patches, instead of showing us the crash a lot of us expect.
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#14 - 2015-01-24 01:31:45 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
Nnezu wrote:
Adarnof wrote:
With such notable outrage (remember those mobile depots outside Jita?) warranting the release of the ISD hounds onto our poor subforum, I'd think CCP would be interested in repairing their relation with our niche community. This would be a good first step.


The outrage was from a vocal few, and you're totally forgeting about the people who actually LOVE those changes. And to be fair, the mass of closed threads was not constructive feedback but plain trolling and namecalling.

Also, threads autolock after 3 months if no one posts in them.

If you want stuff unstickied, put a report in and we'll look into it.

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode

Senior Lead

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department
Erica Dusette
Division 13
#15 - 2015-01-24 03:36:22 UTC
Sith1s Spectre wrote:
I would honestly say nowdays there's more activity and ships moving around WH space (from my perspective) than there has been in the past year.

This, from my perspective too.

Jack Miton > you be nice or you're sleeping on the couch again!

Part-Time Wormhole Pirate ツ Full-Time Supermodel

▷ worмнole dιary + cнaracтer вιoѕ ▷ вσss
Aiyshimin
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#16 - 2015-01-24 09:58:10 UTC
Adarnof wrote:

The bulk of the action on forums and reddit were opposed, so it's a big leap to say that the bulk of people were in favour. There's absolutely no way that can be concluded. Sure some people love it, but they were greatly outnumbered by those opposed.


You just see it this way because you opposed the change as well, and who'd want to admit being a whiny little baby. Even if that's exactly what the whiners were, whining babies who don't even have the spine to come out now and admit that it didn't kill w-space.

Quote:
Indeed the recent patches have renewed interest in wormholes, but this interest was only renewed because it was first lost with Hyperion. The bad changes are still bad, just masked with a few band-aids.


Still the same old song- wh PVP activity died long before Hyperion. The decline started already in 2013, and had nothing to do with Hyperion. Which brought only good changes.

Nothing that would attract PVP groups to w-space, however.
Adarnof
Anoikis Equilibrium
Honorable Third Party
#17 - 2015-01-24 19:35:32 UTC
Aiyshimin wrote:
You just see it this way because you opposed the change as well, and troll troll troll troll troll

And you see it your way because you were in favour. If you can count past 10, here's a lovely for/against summary on everyone's favourite change.

Aiyshimin wrote:
Still the same old song- wh PVP activity died long before Hyperion. The decline started already in 2013, and had nothing to do with Hyperion. Which brought only good changes.

Nothing that would attract PVP groups to w-space, however.

Same old anecdotal evidence. I bet we could prove this one way or another if CCP released some activity statistics. Oh wait, that was the original point of this thread. Carry on, space troll!
Alundil
Rolled Out
#18 - 2015-01-25 18:35:46 UTC
Erica Dusette wrote:
Sith1s Spectre wrote:
I would honestly say nowdays there's more activity and ships moving around WH space (from my perspective) than there has been in the past year.

This, from my perspective too.


I concur

I'm right behind you
Aiyshimin
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#19 - 2015-01-25 21:05:53 UTC
Adarnof wrote:
Aiyshimin wrote:
You just see it this way because you opposed the change as well, and troll troll troll troll troll

And you see it your way because you were in favour. If you can count past 10, here's a lovely for/against summary on everyone's favourite change.

Aiyshimin wrote:
Still the same old song- wh PVP activity died long before Hyperion. The decline started already in 2013, and had nothing to do with Hyperion. Which brought only good changes.

Nothing that would attract PVP groups to w-space, however.

Same old anecdotal evidence. I bet we could prove this one way or another if CCP released some activity statistics. Oh wait, that was the original point of this thread. Carry on, space troll!



Read the CSM minutes mate.
Adoris Nolen
Sama Guild
#20 - 2015-01-25 22:48:58 UTC
Was strongly against the changes & still hate them. The summary of my wh activity nowadays is hauling shortcuts & C5 gas.

Industry pays the bills now.
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