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Best tank a talos can get
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Sokniw
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1 - 2011-11-30 04:23:02 UTC
Ok so im trying to see what the best EHP i can get on a talos, in game i seemed to get 40k ehp 750 dps with my resists at 80/70/70/80.

My goal is to turn one of these new ships into an incursion dps ship. I just feel with the dps output they would be viable, i know they dont have a massive tank but they don't have a massive sig radius like bs's either thats why bs's aim to have such high EHP.

logi's only need a 50k EHP why cant this fine tunes lean mean dps machine? unless that whole 120 sig radius difference really matters that much?

thoughts opinions, other choice is to try to get an oracle with at least 50-70k EHP.
Goose99
#2 - 2011-11-30 04:27:35 UTC
Sokniw wrote:
Ok so im trying to see what the best EHP i can get on a talos, in game i seemed to get 40k ehp 750 dps with my resists at 80/70/70/80.

My goal is to turn one of these new ships into an incursion dps ship. I just feel with the dps output they would be viable, i know they dont have a massive tank but they don't have a massive sig radius like bs's either thats why bs's aim to have such high EHP.

logi's only need a 50k EHP why cant this fine tunes lean mean dps machine? unless that whole 120 sig radius difference really matters that much?

thoughts opinions, other choice is to try to get an oracle with at least 50-70k EHP.


It suffers from lack of slots. Dmg mods and TEs (yes, they give crap tracking, but blasters need the range) take lows. TCs and webs take mids. Decent fleets won't take fits that don't have at least 2-3 dmg mods, 2-3 TCs/TEs, and 1-2 webs. Whether armor or shield tank, there just aren't enough slots to go around.
Cedo Nulli
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#3 - 2011-11-30 04:34:26 UTC
Your going to be fielding a battleship weaponsystem to counter mostly frigate based enemy. Why not just field a battleship with the proper tank and utilities (webs,TCs,TPs,drones) ?

Just because its new dont make it a winner in every scenario im afraid ...
Sokniw
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#4 - 2011-11-30 04:34:37 UTC
Goose99 wrote:
Sokniw wrote:
Ok so im trying to see what the best EHP i can get on a talos, in game i seemed to get 40k ehp 750 dps with my resists at 80/70/70/80.

My goal is to turn one of these new ships into an incursion dps ship. I just feel with the dps output they would be viable, i know they dont have a massive tank but they don't have a massive sig radius like bs's either thats why bs's aim to have such high EHP.

logi's only need a 50k EHP why cant this fine tunes lean mean dps machine? unless that whole 120 sig radius difference really matters that much?

thoughts opinions, other choice is to try to get an oracle with at least 50-70k EHP.


It suffers from lack of slots. Dmg mods and TEs (yes, they give crap tracking, but blasters need the range) take lows. TCs and webs take mids. Decent fleets won't take fits that don't have at least 2-3 dmg mods, 2-3 TCs/TEs, and 1-2 webs. Whether armor or shield tank, there just aren't enough slots to go around.


i had my hopes up and i still believe in the that maybe it would be able to do it, but its the only thing i was excited for was like OMG a bc that can dish out bs dmg, first thing that came to my head was INCURSIONS! but i like how at one point they said the talos was going to be the mini vindi, hardly lol.

i hear an oracle has some possibilty with how many lows it has. maybe there is hope! maybe just maybe.
I likegirls
Lost Puppy Relocation Services
Sorority
#5 - 2011-11-30 04:36:36 UTC
Just use a damn bs. They use battleship weapons. There is almost no reason to carebear with any of the tier 3 battle cruisers.
Sokniw
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#6 - 2011-11-30 04:41:34 UTC
I likegirls wrote:
Just use a damn bs. They use battleship weapons. There is almost no reason to carebear with any of the tier 3 battle cruisers.


cause it would be fun, it would be interesting, dont you like to change things up try something new, like i want to run incursions i usually just use my oneiros and logi, but i decided i wanted to do some dips, but what are my choices, a tech3 cruiser, or vindi or alike ship, but i got a navy mega and went that route i know its not the best option but until i train to use a proteus or something i guess.

i just thought it would be cool thats all. guess ill get back on the bandwagon and not be different.... or try something different cause i guess like in real life different gets rejected too..
Sephiroth Clone VII
Brothers of Tyr
Goonswarm Federation
#7 - 2011-11-30 05:56:40 UTC
I can see a huge use of these for getting a BS guns in a much more maneuverable ship at, half the cost of a BS for fleets targeting BS or larger targets. Below that sized targets, yea other tier bcs would be better, duhhh.

Though.... having skills in BC means you can cross use any race, and apply skills you have for them for a platform for large guns

But... if you thinking of carebearing in ship, why you buffer tanking or maxing hp, you got to active tank. you got to compare dps with how much you can tank per second, thats what really counts.
Roosterton
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#8 - 2011-11-30 06:07:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Roosterton
[Talos, New Setup 3]
Damage Control II
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II

Large Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II
10MN Afterburner II

Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L

Medium Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer II

Hobgoblin II x5

70%-77% resists across the board, well over 1000 DPS with CN AM before heat, not too expensive for the average incursion runner. Realistically you'd probably be using Null, though, so more like 850-950 DPS.

@ The people saying it isn't worth it - the Talos is one of only three ships capable of fitting a full rack of 8 large blasters. The Hyperion doesn't get a tracking bonus, which is great for VG's, and the Vindicator costs far more than this. Additionally, this is a BC, with BC scanres. I can think of plenty of reasons why this is useful.

EDIT: This also works decently with an Oracle.


[Oracle, New Setup 1]
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Adaptive Nano Plating II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Damage Control II

Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
10MN Afterburner II

Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L

Medium Anti-Explosive Pump II
Medium Anti-Kinetic Pump II
Medium Anti-Thermic Pump I

70-73% resists, 850 DPS with a 20km optimal.

Tornado's also viable, I'd probably prefer an Oracle or Talos though:

[Tornado, New Setup 4]
Damage Control II
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Tracking Enhancer II

Large Shield Extender II
Photon Scattering Field II
Heat Dissipation Field II
Invulnerability Field II
10MN Afterburner II

800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L

Medium Anti-Kinetic Screen Reinforcer I
Medium Anti-Explosive Screen Reinforcer I

70-75% resists, 815 DPS with 47km falloff.

I'd probably post a Naga as well, but meh, my EFT for Nagas is outdated.
Allaera
Kalmincon
#9 - 2011-11-30 06:07:19 UTC
OP, 164k is possible (pyfa, all V's) but you don't really want to do that.....you really don't.
Songbird
#10 - 2011-11-30 10:39:09 UTC
Don't need AB for incursions - I'd say put TC or maybe sebo
Fronkfurter McSheebleton
Horse Feathers
CAStabouts
#11 - 2011-11-30 11:20:26 UTC
Roosterton wrote:
@ The people saying it isn't worth it - the Talos is one of only three ships capable of fitting a full rack of 8 large blasters. The Hyperion doesn't get a tracking bonus, which is great for VG's, and the Vindicator costs far more than this. Additionally, this is a BC, with BC scanres. I can think of plenty of reasons why this is useful..

Hype, Rokh, Vindi, Naga, Talos....that's 5...

Kronos also effectively fits 8, making 6 ships total that can fit 8, out of 10 with a bonus to large hybrids...that's over half.

A standard megathron or hype will apply more dps than this thing due to having three damage AND range mods. Hype can even fit a web, and isn't affected too badly by the lack of tracking bonus because it typically fits a TC in incursions.

thhief ghabmoef
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#12 - 2011-11-30 14:44:50 UTC
Sokniw wrote:
Ok so im trying to see what the best EHP i can get on a talos, in game i seemed to get 40k ehp 750 dps with my resists at 80/70/70/80.

My goal is to turn one of these new ships into an incursion dps ship.


Buy Hyperion

Shield fit it

Full lows dmg mods

=

Better DPS

Better Tank

Better overall

Bad choice if you pick Talos for that job, I'd not even bother targeting you for logistics on your paper thin thing.
Now the Oracle on the other hand...
Sokniw
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#13 - 2011-12-01 01:43:52 UTC
Roosterton wrote:
[Talos, New Setup 3]
Damage Control II
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II

Large Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II
10MN Afterburner II

Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L

Medium Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer II

Hobgoblin II x5

70%-77% resists across the board, well over 1000 DPS with CN AM before heat, not too expensive for the average incursion runner. Realistically you'd probably be using Null, though, so more like 850-950 DPS.

@ The people saying it isn't worth it - the Talos is one of only three ships capable of fitting a full rack of 8 large blasters. The Hyperion doesn't get a tracking bonus, which is great for VG's, and the Vindicator costs far more than this. Additionally, this is a BC, with BC scanres. I can think of plenty of reasons why this is useful.


your shield talos has no tank still, like maybe 30k i can get 47k on the talos armor tanking and still have 800dps.


Flurk Hellbron
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#14 - 2011-12-01 02:11:41 UTC
M1A1 Abrams Tank.
Eliane Harper
Lai Dai Counterintelligence
#15 - 2011-12-01 02:58:55 UTC
I'd rather have 1300+ DPS with 29k EHP for the Talos than 40k EHP with 750DPS. I already have a Hurricane that puts out 800DPS with about 80k EHP. I think people need to wake up to the fact that these are meant to be glass cannons. If you want more tank, get a Brutix.
Eliane Harper
Lai Dai Counterintelligence
#16 - 2011-12-01 03:01:01 UTC
Sokniw wrote:


your shield talos has no tank still, like maybe 30k i can get 47k on the talos armor tanking and still have 800dps.


I wouldn't fit a shield Talos the way he did but nonetheless, the main reason why you would go shield is for DPS and for a signicant boost in speed, which with blaster range, you're going to need.
Sokniw
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#17 - 2011-12-02 02:42:38 UTC
Eliane Harper wrote:
Sokniw wrote:


your shield talos has no tank still, like maybe 30k i can get 47k on the talos armor tanking and still have 800dps.


I wouldn't fit a shield Talos the way he did but nonetheless, the main reason why you would go shield is for DPS and for a signicant boost in speed, which with blaster range, you're going to need.


yeah but i shoulda stated that the whole point to get a tank on this is to run incurisons, i know i know that i could get a bs and same guns more tank more dps.. but see those fits are already out there i dont want to know what ships can do what im trying to make the talos usable in the situation
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#18 - 2011-12-02 03:46:20 UTC
[Talos, New Setup 2]
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II

Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron

Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Ion Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Ion Blaster Cannon II, Null L

Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Anti-Explosive Pump I


Hobgoblin II x5

I'm seeing 69K EHP, 65.6% lowest resist (Exp). 1069 DPS at 4.5+13 and 872 @ 11+16. It may be a tiny bit unfair to claim Neutron ranges with 2 Ions.

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
Sokniw
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#19 - 2011-12-02 03:52:53 UTC
Liang Nuren wrote:
[Talos, New Setup 2]
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II

Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron

Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Ion Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Ion Blaster Cannon II, Null L

Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Anti-Explosive Pump I


Hobgoblin II x5

I'm seeing 69K EHP, 65.6% lowest resist (Exp). 1069 DPS at 4.5+13 and 872 @ 11+16. It may be a tiny bit unfair to claim Neutron ranges with 2 Ions.

-Liang


no way you are seeing 69k ehp with that...i had 2 faction enams on my talos and only got to 47 ehp... if you got 70k ehp and 1000dps than that ship right there is the new incursion runner. minus your mid mods.
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#20 - 2011-12-02 04:03:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Liang Nuren
Sokniw wrote:
Liang Nuren wrote:
[Talos, New Setup 2]
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II

Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron

Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Ion Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Ion Blaster Cannon II, Null L

Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Anti-Explosive Pump I


Hobgoblin II x5

I'm seeing 69K EHP, 65.6% lowest resist (Exp). 1069 DPS at 4.5+13 and 872 @ 11+16. It may be a tiny bit unfair to claim Neutron ranges with 2 Ions.

-Liang


no way you are seeing 69k ehp with that...i had 2 faction enams on my talos and only got to 47 ehp... if you got 70k ehp and 1000dps than that ship right there is the new incursion runner. minus your mid mods.



Slave set and gang bonuses. You guys don't do Incursions without bonuses do you? -_-

-Liang

Ed: If you're willing to splurge on faction mods instead of one time implants, you can probably make it a lot better.

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
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