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Remove training bonus implants

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Joe Risalo
State War Academy
Caldari State
#21 - 2014-12-23 16:41:38 UTC
Lord Parallax wrote:
Joe Risalo wrote:



IMO, attributes and anything effecting them need to be completely removed from the game.
All players should be able to train at the same rate regardless of security level, isk generation, and/or how many implants you can afford through PLEX.




I like the way the SP training is now.
If you want a homogenized mmo where everybody can go from noob to pro in a week and no one has any special advantage go play Warcraft.

I like eve b/c it actually has a nice structure in place to allow people that have been playing for 6 months or 6 years to be on a higher level of gameplay than someone that started last week.

If you want to kill EVE do what WoW did, start making it noob friendly and taking the veteran advanatages away from them.





Uhhh.... You must be confused.
Allowing for players to farm for isk and purchase implants that boost training is more in line with WoW Exp grinding than what I suggested.
Lord Parallax
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#22 - 2014-12-23 17:35:21 UTC
NO I am not confused, by removing the attributes or impants all together will do exactly what blizzard did with Warcraft, remove any advantage from the player. much like weapon skills with them.

in the past you had to go manually level the skill that related to the weapon, that gave people an advantage, then it was removed making everyone have the same skill level per weapon regardless.
Then they removed the profession bonuses making professions basically useless, rebalanced racial traits. so everyone is now on a somewhat even playing field with no special incentives to play any race over the other.
This ultimately resulted in millions of players quitting the game b/c it took away the fun they had.


This is essentially what you are suggesting, take away any incentives or bonuses from skill training so everyone is on a level field.
This then negates the time spent for those that have gotten the +5's or special sets of implants so the day 1 rookie will be able to train just as fast as the 6 year old veteran.

If eve starts removing advantages a player has from playing the game longer than someone else it essentially removes some of the fun they have from that advantage.

Sure it would be nice to have quicker training or a more balanced training ,but look at the players that have spent the time gained the isk to get the implants and then they become obsolete b/c people wanted to have their rookie take less time to get built up.


IN a simple sentence and an ancient word of advice. IF IT AINT BROKE DONT FIX IT.
Joe Risalo
State War Academy
Caldari State
#23 - 2014-12-23 17:49:32 UTC
Lord Parallax wrote:
NO I am not confused, by removing the attributes or impants all together will do exactly what blizzard did with Warcraft, remove any advantage from the player. much like weapon skills with them.

in the past you had to go manually level the skill that related to the weapon, that gave people an advantage, then it was removed making everyone have the same skill level per weapon regardless.
Then they removed the profession bonuses making professions basically useless, rebalanced racial traits. so everyone is now on a somewhat even playing field with no special incentives to play any race over the other.
This ultimately resulted in millions of players quitting the game b/c it took away the fun they had.


This is essentially what you are suggesting, take away any incentives or bonuses from skill training so everyone is on a level field.
This then negates the time spent for those that have gotten the +5's or special sets of implants so the day 1 rookie will be able to train just as fast as the 6 year old veteran.

If eve starts removing advantages a player has from playing the game longer than someone else it essentially removes some of the fun they have from that advantage.

Sure it would be nice to have quicker training or a more balanced training ,but look at the players that have spent the time gained the isk to get the implants and then they become obsolete b/c people wanted to have their rookie take less time to get built up.


IN a simple sentence and an ancient word of advice. IF IT AINT BROKE DONT FIX IT.


I would be served no advantage from the removal of attribute implants, other than never again having to purchase them.
I have only one toon in game, and that toon runs +5s at pretty much all times.
I enjoy PVE content in high sec and put very little risk in losing my +5 implants.
Where as a PVP player cannot do the same. If he wishes to run +5s, he must risk them every time he goes out.
Where's the risk/reward?
I take less risks yet get the same reward?
That's counter intuitive to the design of Eve.


I would also like to note that the 6 year old character has many more skills than the 1 week old.
He can pilot many more ships, use many more weapon systems, and do many more different activities at a much more efficient rate than the new toon can.
Being able to afford +5 implants does not set you apart from a 1 week old player.
Gaining SP at a much higher rate than a 1 week old player doesn't set you apart from him.
The fact that you can do so much more in Eve and the fact that you do it better is what sets you apart.

1v1 a new toon in any situation and you will outperform. Mining, missions, plexing, PVP, trading, transporting, etc. etc. etc...
Take that 1 week old toon and give him +5s and it doesn't make him any better than you at anything.
However, if he never takes any risks with those implants, he is now being rewarded with more SP generation, as a new player, without taking the risks that have caused you to only run +2s or 3s.
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
#24 - 2014-12-23 17:57:04 UTC
Removing the learning skills was a wise move on CCP's part. There was no real benefit to not training them, and spending so much time training them slowed down new players.

Implants, on the other hand, offer a real choice. Do I want to pay some ISK for the implants and risk losing them if I get podded, or do I want to keep my clone free of implants so have less at risk?

-1

Relatively Notorious By Association

My Many Misadventures

I predicted FAUXs
Lord Parallax
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#25 - 2014-12-23 18:05:34 UTC
If you are going to pvp all day that is what jump clones are for.

Why should high sec players be subjected to any advantage loss such as higher SP bonus implants b/c someone that wants to play a high risk aspect of the game?

If you pvp that is the risk you take, it's as simple as that.

The game should not be changed b/c your choice of risk/reward is not the same as some one else's.
Axen Moon2
Logistics LLC
#26 - 2015-01-05 04:39:36 UTC
Pandering to the few that don't have time invested should not outweigh people that has been here since the beginning. For ten years I have seen idiots come and go but their ideas remain.
Aiyshimin
Shiva Furnace
#27 - 2015-01-05 04:50:09 UTC
Joe Risalo wrote:

I would be served no advantage from the removal of attribute implants, other than never again having to purchase them.
I have only one toon in game, and that toon runs +5s at pretty much all times.
I enjoy PVE content in high sec and put very little risk in losing my +5 implants.
Where as a PVP player cannot do the same. If he wishes to run +5s, he must risk them every time he goes out.
Where's the risk/reward?
I take less risks yet get the same reward?
That's counter intuitive to the design of Eve.


No you don't get the same reward, the PVP player has fun and gets kills. Meanwhile you don't get anything.
Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#28 - 2015-01-05 04:51:55 UTC
I could only think of another variant of cerebral accelerator available for players older than 35 days, with some limitations like recaps, once a year or so.

"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP
Max Deveron
Deveron Shipyards and Technology
Citizen's Star Republic
#29 - 2015-01-05 05:01:32 UTC
Joe Risalo wrote:
Lord Parallax wrote:
NO I am not confused, by removing the attributes or impants all together will do exactly what blizzard did with Warcraft, remove any advantage from the player. much like weapon skills with them.

in the past you had to go manually level the skill that related to the weapon, that gave people an advantage, then it was removed making everyone have the same skill level per weapon regardless.
Then they removed the profession bonuses making professions basically useless, rebalanced racial traits. so everyone is now on a somewhat even playing field with no special incentives to play any race over the other.
This ultimately resulted in millions of players quitting the game b/c it took away the fun they had.


This is essentially what you are suggesting, take away any incentives or bonuses from skill training so everyone is on a level field.
This then negates the time spent for those that have gotten the +5's or special sets of implants so the day 1 rookie will be able to train just as fast as the 6 year old veteran.

If eve starts removing advantages a player has from playing the game longer than someone else it essentially removes some of the fun they have from that advantage.

Sure it would be nice to have quicker training or a more balanced training ,but look at the players that have spent the time gained the isk to get the implants and then they become obsolete b/c people wanted to have their rookie take less time to get built up.


IN a simple sentence and an ancient word of advice. IF IT AINT BROKE DONT FIX IT.


I would be served no advantage from the removal of attribute implants, other than never again having to purchase them.
I have only one toon in game, and that toon runs +5s at pretty much all times.
I enjoy PVE content in high sec and put very little risk in losing my +5 implants.
Where as a PVP player cannot do the same. If he wishes to run +5s, he must risk them every time he goes out.
Where's the risk/reward?
I take less risks yet get the same reward?
That's counter intuitive to the design of Eve.


I would also like to note that the 6 year old character has many more skills than the 1 week old.
He can pilot many more ships, use many more weapon systems, and do many more different activities at a much more efficient rate than the new toon can.
Being able to afford +5 implants does not set you apart from a 1 week old player.
Gaining SP at a much higher rate than a 1 week old player doesn't set you apart from him.
The fact that you can do so much more in Eve and the fact that you do it better is what sets you apart.

1v1 a new toon in any situation and you will outperform. Mining, missions, plexing, PVP, trading, transporting, etc. etc. etc...
Take that 1 week old toon and give him +5s and it doesn't make him any better than you at anything.
However, if he never takes any risks with those implants, he is now being rewarded with more SP generation, as a new player, without taking the risks that have caused you to only run +2s or 3s.


you are forgetting the fact that newer players/toons have a great many skills that are easily trained up to lv4 in from 0 in about a 7 days or less. While the veterans have skills that are taking weeks or months to train.
ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#30 - 2015-01-05 09:03:08 UTC
Foxicity wrote:
And if you'll look to the left, you'll see yet another thread about attributes on the front page.
Here's the thread you should be posting in
Exactly. Thread locked.

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