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[Right Now] Insurance Payouts Recalculation

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TheMercenaryKing
Collapsed Out
Pandemic Legion
#21 - 2014-12-03 14:57:27 UTC
Why not just remove insurance from non-industrial ships?
Ariana Industrialis
Society of Penguins
#22 - 2014-12-03 15:00:42 UTC
Fozzie, what do you plan to do for the guys who insured their T2 hull yesterday at high insurance cost, and will now lose money on insurance because payout is now much lower ?

Practical exemple:

Insure paladin yesteday, costs 350m payout 800m.

Die in paladin today, payout 275m. Doesn't even cover the cost of the insurance, let alone any of the hull.
Xeleonn
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2014-12-03 15:09:06 UTC
Rabble rabble rabble!
Phoenix Jones
Small-Arms Fire
#24 - 2014-12-03 15:12:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Phoenix Jones
Can I insure my pod and implants. It'll sting less if I get some cash back when I'm podded, also it would stop me from ripping my implants out my head before I die.

Something like a percentage back based off the killmail loss of the pod, minus any specialty implants like the golden pod.

Yaay!!!!
Jin So
Goonswarm Federation
#25 - 2014-12-03 15:21:32 UTC
w00t back to condors
Theon Severasse
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#26 - 2014-12-03 15:38:40 UTC
Nice work bringing a really good change that made a lot of people happy, and then pulling the rug out from under their feet.


It's really the EVE way if you think about it, this is just another scam...
Tipa Riot
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2014-12-03 15:39:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Tipa Riot
I know the day was to come when you said so in Vegas, ... but a warning would have been nice, insured some T2 hulls yesterday :(

Seriously, what's the reasoning behind low insurance payouts for T2 hulls?

I'm my own NPC alt.
Grookshank
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2014-12-03 15:47:37 UTC
Dodo Veetee wrote:
Right when you start making sense, you show us the good old :ccp: that we all hate.

Thanks.

Don't be so harsh, we get a corp invite spam function in replacement.
Aerie Evingod
Midwest Miners LLC
#29 - 2014-12-03 15:55:39 UTC
Ariana Industrialis wrote:
Fozzie, what do you plan to do for the guys who insured their T2 hull yesterday at high insurance cost, and will now lose money on insurance because payout is now much lower ?

Practical exemple:

Insure paladin yesteday, costs 350m payout 800m.

Die in paladin today, payout 275m. Doesn't even cover the cost of the insurance, let alone any of the hull.


I was under the impression the insurance rates and payout was determined when the ship was insured, not when it blew up.
Esharan
State War Academy
Caldari State
#30 - 2014-12-03 15:56:24 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hello folks.

Some of you will have noticed that insurance payouts for T2 ships have decreased starting today (December 3rd). This is an intentional change, designed to counteract the higher-than-desired increase in insurance payouts that resulted from the Crius industry changes.

You should expect insurance payouts for Tech 2 ships to now be a bit closer to what they had been pre-Crius.

This change isn't tied to any release since the insurance values recalculate on Tranquility on their own. Today just happens to be recalculation day.



Too bad, this was a great QoL change...I wont fly T2 ships as often now because of it...It's kind of counter-intuitive, considering all the changes they are making to get people to fly more dangerously (e.g. clone changes) but then they do this - which is the total opposite of that QoL momentum.

Reconsider please? It's fun being able to fly more expensive stuff - there's still a loss if you die, just not as severe - with this change I just wont fly expensive T2 stuff meh.
Grookshank
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#31 - 2014-12-03 15:56:48 UTC
Aerie Evingod wrote:
Ariana Industrialis wrote:
Fozzie, what do you plan to do for the guys who insured their T2 hull yesterday at high insurance cost, and will now lose money on insurance because payout is now much lower ?

Practical exemple:

Insure paladin yesteday, costs 350m payout 800m.

Die in paladin today, payout 275m. Doesn't even cover the cost of the insurance, let alone any of the hull.


I was under the impression the insurance rates and payout was determined when the ship was insured, not when it blew up.

Nope.
Aerie Evingod
Midwest Miners LLC
#32 - 2014-12-03 16:05:11 UTC
Grookshank wrote:
Aerie Evingod wrote:
Ariana Industrialis wrote:
Fozzie, what do you plan to do for the guys who insured their T2 hull yesterday at high insurance cost, and will now lose money on insurance because payout is now much lower ?

Practical exemple:

Insure paladin yesteday, costs 350m payout 800m.

Die in paladin today, payout 275m. Doesn't even cover the cost of the insurance, let alone any of the hull.


I was under the impression the insurance rates and payout was determined when the ship was insured, not when it blew up.

Nope.



Interesting...
Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#33 - 2014-12-03 16:13:43 UTC
Let us, for moment, look at the Great Circle of Insurance.

Nulsec entity does moon mining and POS reactions, which are then sold in Jita. Isk is used to buy Ishtars at let us say 150M isk per unit.

Player A goes out and rats for an evening or three to buy his fleet reimbursable Ishtar.

Here is where things will begin to differ. He then insures it for 80% of the hull value at platinum level payout. This costs him 10% of the hull value. Its less than that, but you get the point.

Player A goes on a reimbursable fleet and gets blapped. He gets 80%-10% = 70% of the hull value and then alliance reimburses the remaining 30% and perhaps a bit more for the fit. LEts assume the alliance is generous is also covers the cost of the fit. Player A then turns around and buys a new Ishtar. This happens every time he gets blapped at no cost to the player, and at 30% hull cost to the alliance.

With the changes, the cost of the hull will remain the same. So the initial cost will as well. But now the player platinum insures for 2.5% and gets back 20%. Again, just throwing some rough numbers around. So when he gets popped, he and the alliance now has to pay 87.5% of the value to get another Ishtar.

RIP alliance level SRP.

So the real question is... will T2 prices go back up to the levels they were at 3 months ago? How adversely will this effect alliance SRP programs? Were higher T2 insurance payouts allowing SRP alliances to pocket more isk off of moongoo due to the extra isk injection into the eve economy?

I'd love to hear from a major nulsec alliance on how this is going to effect their isk flow and SRP.

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY
Akiko Sciuto
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#34 - 2014-12-03 16:16:27 UTC
Serious question, why do you want the insurance rate so low on T2 ships? Can you please explain the reasoning behind this thought process. It just doesn't make sense to me.


Also blah blah blah wasted isk on T2 insurance, want refund blah blah blah.....
Although it was kind of a **** move.
X ATM092
The Hatchery
RAZOR Alliance
#35 - 2014-12-03 16:24:10 UTC
I agree with any reductions to the huge isk faucet that is insurance.
Leyara Raholan
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#36 - 2014-12-03 16:33:21 UTC
Soldarius wrote:
Let us, for moment, look at the Great Circle of Insurance.

Nulsec entity does moon mining and POS reactions, which are then sold in Jita. Isk is used to buy Ishtars at let us say 150M isk per unit.

Player A goes out and rats for an evening or three to buy his fleet reimbursable Ishtar.

Here is where things will begin to differ. He then insures it for 80% of the hull value at platinum level payout. This costs him 10% of the hull value. Its less than that, but you get the point.

Player A goes on a reimbursable fleet and gets blapped. He gets 80%-10% = 70% of the hull value and then alliance reimburses the remaining 30% and perhaps a bit more for the fit. LEts assume the alliance is generous is also covers the cost of the fit. Player A then turns around and buys a new Ishtar. This happens every time he gets blapped at no cost to the player, and at 30% hull cost to the alliance.

With the changes, the cost of the hull will remain the same. So the initial cost will as well. But now the player platinum insures for 2.5% and gets back 20%. Again, just throwing some rough numbers around. So when he gets popped, he and the alliance now has to pay 87.5% of the value to get another Ishtar.

RIP alliance level SRP.

So the real question is... will T2 prices go back up to the levels they were at 3 months ago? How adversely will this effect alliance SRP programs? Were higher T2 insurance payouts allowing SRP alliances to pocket more isk off of moongoo due to the extra isk injection into the eve economy?

I'd love to hear from a major nulsec alliance on how this is going to effect their isk flow and SRP.


This makes some sense. My NPC corp doesn't have an SRP program though. Fml I guess? Lol
Bagrat Skalski
Koinuun Kotei
#37 - 2014-12-03 16:41:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Bagrat Skalski
Cheer people, soon you will not need insurance payout to pay for your next clone.

Custom ship skins, character creator style "repaint". Bring it!
Jafit McJafitson
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#38 - 2014-12-03 16:43:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Jafit McJafitson
X ATM092 wrote:
I agree with any reductions to the huge isk faucet that is insurance.

If you want to talk about isk faucets, maybe CCP should revisit the Encounter Surveillance System deployable that was introduced in Rubicon? After Goons figured out you could just anchor it in one of the horrible anomolies that nobody actually runs, pop all the triggers and end up with a fleet of scramming rats guarding it for you. CCP seemed to forget about it entirely and it just ended up being a buff for nullsec ratting income while adding none of the risk of theft or interesting gameplay dynamics that it was supposed to add.

Soldarius wrote:
So the real question is... will T2 prices go back up to the levels they were at 3 months ago? How adversely will this effect alliance SRP programs? Were higher T2 insurance payouts allowing SRP alliances to pocket more isk off of moongoo due to the extra isk injection into the eve economy?

I'd love to hear from a major nulsec alliance on how this is going to effect their isk flow and SRP.


Well Brave's Eagle fleet apparently just got 3x more expensive to reimburse. While I think its a sh*t doctrine anyway, it doesn't exactly bode well for their prospects for flying competitive doctrines in the future, especially as CCP also rolled back the bomber changes that might have helped their dominixes not get repeatedly bombed off field by an endless stream of 3rd partying bombers turning up to every timer.

Nor does it bode well for any other alliance that doesn't already own multiple regions worth of renter space and R64s. So here's to another year of stangnant nullsec, we're not likely to see any new players emerging any time soon.
Charles Case
State War Academy
Caldari State
#39 - 2014-12-03 16:43:42 UTC
BadAssMcKill wrote:
Booooo
Jassmin Joy
Pulling The Plug
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#40 - 2014-12-03 16:52:30 UTC
Havent bothered insuring a ship that isnt a suicide capital in the past three years.