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Update regarding Multiboxing and input automation

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Commentus Nolen
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1901 - 2014-11-29 19:30:37 UTC
Verde Minator wrote:
http://community.eveonline.com/support/policies/eve-eula/ rule 2.


Check the bottom for the last update.

Come on CCP get you act together and update you EULA to reflect your launcher capabilities.
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#1902 - 2014-11-29 19:34:22 UTC
Nolak Ataru wrote:
Madd Adda wrote:
Now that's just silly, no one is going to ever stop buying plex. Either they are going stockpile it, use it for game time, or additional training queues. Even then, you assume that subscriptions are in decline because multiboxers are quitting, as if they make up the majority of the player base, but even now new players are joining (they won't necessarily stay, but some will).


I said nothing about subscriptions. I was talking about raw demand. I don't have the numbers on all the multiboxers in EVE, but we had somewhere around 250 accounts in one "chat". That's 250 less PLEX being used each month. Nothing about actual subs.



Assuming they all unsub.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Verde Minator
Crack And Cookies For Santa
#1903 - 2014-11-29 19:35:10 UTC
and again, number 9. license:
http://community.eveonline.com/support/policies/eve-eula/

LICENSE
A. Software License

Subject to the terms of the EULA, CCP grants you a limited, non-exclusive, revocable license to use the Software and its accompanying documentation solely in connection with accessing the System in order to play EVE using a single valid Account.

For each valid Account you maintain, you may install a copy of the Software on, and access the System from, a single computer or Game platform, and from a secondary computer if you so choose. You must purchase a separate license to the Software for each additional Account you register; e.g., if you have 2 Accounts, you must have 2 licensed copies of the Software. You may not use more than one Account with a single licensed copy of the Software. You may make one (1) copy of the Software for backup or archival purposes.
Madd Adda
#1904 - 2014-11-29 19:40:46 UTC
Nolak Ataru wrote:
Madd Adda wrote:
Now that's just silly, no one is going to ever stop buying plex. Either they are going stockpile it, use it for game time, or additional training queues. Even then, you assume that subscriptions are in decline because multiboxers are quitting, as if they make up the majority of the player base, but even now new players are joining (they won't necessarily stay, but some will).


I said nothing about subscriptions. I was talking about raw demand. I don't have the numbers on all the multiboxers in EVE, but we had somewhere around 250 accounts in one "chat". That's 250 less PLEX being used each month. Nothing about actual subs.


which translates to 250 more plex on the market to buy, which will be scooped up by others. Demand is lower than before, but is still greater than the supply.

Carebear extraordinaire
Commentus Nolen
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1905 - 2014-11-29 19:40:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Commentus Nolen
Verde Minator wrote:
and again, number 9. license:
http://community.eveonline.com/support/policies/eve-eula/

LICENSE
A. Software License

Subject to the terms of the EULA, CCP grants you a limited, non-exclusive, revocable license to use the Software and its accompanying documentation solely in connection with accessing the System in order to play EVE using a single valid Account.

For each valid Account you maintain, you may install a copy of the Software on, and access the System from, a single computer or Game platform, and from a secondary computer if you so choose. You must purchase a separate license to the Software for each additional Account you register; e.g., if you have 2 Accounts, you must have 2 licensed copies of the Software. You may not use more than one Account with a single licensed copy of the Software. You may make one (1) copy of the Software for backup or archival purposes.



I can assure you that no matter what the ECUA says the launcher now handles this. After you log in with your first account you click on "switch user" to log in to the next account and so on. The launcher creates a EVE.exe for each account you launch.

Like I said before CCP needs to update their ECUA. Don't believe me put up a support ticket.

Meant the last in a nice way.
Verde Minator
Crack And Cookies For Santa
#1906 - 2014-11-29 19:53:42 UTC
the underlined portion, this is stated 2 times in the eula. yes, the launcher will and has the ability to switch accounts, ur not supposed to do that. it makes u sign the eula which it states this every time u reinstall eve. basically, you can set the eve client launcher to not close after it launches a specific account, so when you close out that instance of the game, you can have the launcher switch to another account. if on your taskbar, you have the eve clients tiled, you are doing it wrong, if you have them next to each other, you are probably okay. so if you have 30 clients, you should have 30 boxs with the E on it on the task bar, each originating from it's own eve launcher which originates from it's own eve folder. per eula section 2 and 9 a. see underlined portion.

back to the subject at hand, if that were true, someone with 80 some odd clients open should have about a terabyte of hdd space dedicated to just eve online clients. purposterous i know, but it is exactly why that is in there, because this kind of thing wasn't supposed to happen in the first place, further backing up their current ruling to making this automation become illegal via game play
Gonzo Liberace
Limp Geckos
#1907 - 2014-11-29 19:58:32 UTC
Verde Minator wrote:
the underlined portion, this is stated 2 times in the eula. yes, the launcher will and has the ability to switch accounts, ur not supposed to do that. it makes u sign the eula which it states this every time u reinstall eve. basically, you can set the eve client launcher to not close after it launches a specific account, so when you close out that instance of the game, you can have the launcher switch to another account. if on your taskbar, you have the eve clients tiled, you are doing it wrong, if you have them next to each other, you are probably okay. so if you have 30 clients, you should have 30 boxs with the E on it on the task bar, each originating from it's own eve launcher which originates from it's own eve folder. per eula section 2 and 9 a. see underlined portion.

back to the subject at hand, if that were true, someone with 80 some odd clients open should have about a terabyte of hdd space dedicated to just eve online clients. purposterous i know, but it is exactly why that is in there, because this kind of thing wasn't supposed to happen in the first place, further backing up their current ruling to making this automation become illegal via game play


Now you're just being dumb.
Verde Minator
Crack And Cookies For Santa
#1908 - 2014-11-29 20:19:31 UTC
http://community.eveonline.com/support/policies/eve-eula/ section 2 and 9 a.


input automation, aka macros, scripts, input cloning, etc.

Input Automation

Input Automation refers to actions that are commonly also referred to as botting or macroing. This term is used to describe, but is not limited to, the automation of actions which have consequences in the EVE universe.

Input Broadcasting & Input Multiplexing

Input Broadcasting and Input Multiplexing refer to the multiplication of inputs, actions and events to multiple instances of the game.

Going Forward

As of 15th of March 2013 we have been policing input automation based on a two-strike policy

• 1st strike for input automation is a 30 day ban
• 2nd strike for input automation is a permanent ban

Input Automation remains strictly prohibited, and is policed under our suspension and ban policy.

Based on the discussion in this area and our will to be more clear and concise with the community regarding this part of our rules, we have decided to also apply this two-strike policy to prohibited forms of Input Broadcasting and Input Multiplexing as of January 1st 2015.

We would like to add, however, that we will not be taking action retroactively and will only be policing this policy as of January 1st, 2015.

Input Broadcasting and Input Multiplexing of actions with consequences in the EVE universe, are prohibited and will be policed in the same manner as Input Automation.

This includes, but isn’t limited to:

• Activation and control of ships and modules
• Navigation and movement within the EVE universe
• Movement of assets and items within the EVE universe
• Interaction with other characters

Examples of allowed Input Broadcasting and Input Multiplexing are actions taken that do not have an impact on the EVE universe and are carried out for convenience:

• EVE Online client settings
• Window positions and arrangements (of the EVE Online client in your operating system’s desktop environment)
• The login process

NOTE: Please keep in mind that using the same password for multiple accounts as well as storing your password in a third party tool or script which helps you to automate the login process can increase the risk of account theft and hacking drastically. It is strongly recommended that you do not engage in this type of activity.

We are closely monitoring all game events for suspicious activity suggesting illicit behaviors, including Input Broadcasting and Input Multiplexing.

We would like to clarify that it does not matter how Input Broadcasting and Input Multiplexing are being done, whether through use of software or modified hardware. Our only concern is regarding how it is being used in the EVE universe.

If you are uncertain about your Input Broadcasting and Input Multiplexing use-case, please get in contact with us, as we would prefer to work with members of the community to come to an amicable resolution. We will also follow up this statement with further clarifications if needed, based on questions and concerns from the community.




again, this is what you signed when you first installed eve online, and henceforth every time you have installed eve or every now and then when there has been a very large patch...

the other is from the OP
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#1909 - 2014-11-29 20:20:34 UTC
Madd Adda wrote:
Nolak Ataru wrote:
Simple answer: No. One
But CCP *is* gutting it's revenue stream. There are some multiboxers such as myself that didn't PLEX their accounts ever because we wanted to support the game. To take away a significant chunk of the demand of a product and then claiming "We will still sell the same amount / make the same profit" is ludicrous to say the least.


The thing is, even if you were to plex, you are supporting the game. People buy plex to sell with real money. That money goes to CCP, and you get game time. Now that you and a lot of other multiboxers are either gone or reducing in number of accounts, there's more for the rest of us, and can now pick up the slack. Revenue stream might be hurt, but it won't be catastrophic.

another irl $ sub paying player here. not anymore. not paying ccp anything so they can develop your boring game.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Jean Luc Lemmont
Carebears on Fire
#1910 - 2014-11-29 20:24:47 UTC
I do hope that the people who are running around screaming "I quit, I quit" actually have the courage of their convictions this time around.

Will I get banned for boxing!?!?!

This thread has degenerated to the point it's become like two bald men fighting over a comb. -- Doc Fury

It's bonuses, not boni, you cretins.
kraken11 jensen
ROOKS AND KRAKENS
#1911 - 2014-11-29 20:36:06 UTC
As far as i have understood it when i was talking to most of my friends, they wont buy plex to so sell it for isk if it the prices going poor. ( bad) PirateLolUghStraight Idk, what to say.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#1912 - 2014-11-29 20:37:24 UTC
Jean Luc Lemmont wrote:
I do hope that the people who are running around screaming "I quit, I quit" actually have the courage of their convictions this time around.

not quit. farm to play for free like I should have done for a long time now. it means I'm playing more.

I need to start ganking too.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
kraken11 jensen
ROOKS AND KRAKENS
#1913 - 2014-11-29 20:39:51 UTC  |  Edited by: kraken11 jensen
Rain6637 wrote:
Jean Luc Lemmont wrote:
I do hope that the people who are running around screaming "I quit, I quit" actually have the courage of their convictions this time around.

not quit. farm to play for free like I should have done for a long time now. it means I'm playing more.

I need to start ganking too.



I feel ya. By the way... To be an member of goonswarm, i think you're alright :)

Nevermind. lol.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#1914 - 2014-11-29 20:43:23 UTC
Nolak Ataru
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#1915 - 2014-11-29 20:51:20 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
what does that mean in english


"You aren't a ****" is what I got after google translate.
Jean Luc Lemmont
Carebears on Fire
#1916 - 2014-11-29 21:07:30 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
Jean Luc Lemmont wrote:
I do hope that the people who are running around screaming "I quit, I quit" actually have the courage of their convictions this time around.

not quit. farm to play for free like I should have done for a long time now. it means I'm playing more.

I need to start ganking too.


I wasn't talking to you in particular Rain, and given a community the size of the GSF, I expect any multiboxers in their ranks to find this change to be annoying at worst. They always were an adaptable bunch.

I'm just tired of the whining masses that react like preschoolers when CCP does something they don't like, toss their toys out of the pram on the forums, but when the rubber meets the road they just keep on doing what they were doing while sulking in the corner and muttering under their breath. The amount of illogical arguments I have seen put forward in this discussion thread (from both sides of the table mind) would be enough to write a case study. I've seen appeals to emotion, slippery slope, appeals to tradition, false dichotomies, and a half dozen other fallacious arguments - and that's just in the last dozen pages.

I suppose I'm just being a crotchety old man, but this happens every time CCP announces changes that negatively impact a popular play style. The nano-nerf, jump fatigue, freighter slots. I expect it will happen again when they finally get around to deciding what to do about the Ishtar. I know it will happen when they finally announce their plans for Sov 3.0.

Some people support the change, other people disapprove, and we end up with a hundred page threadnaught with half the posters threatening to quit because they disagree with the change. There's no need to tell everyone on the forums - just tell your mates so they know you didn't die. By all means, go enjoy the latest BC3K - sorry, I mean Star Citizen - or LOL, or whatever other game you enjoy playing.

If you feel that strongly about it - then unsub. We don't care and we won't miss you.

But if you're going to quit, then quit expeditiously and stop being drama llamas about it.

Will I get banned for boxing!?!?!

This thread has degenerated to the point it's become like two bald men fighting over a comb. -- Doc Fury

It's bonuses, not boni, you cretins.
Schneevva
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#1917 - 2014-11-29 21:13:50 UTC
Thanks for saving the game (again).
Nolak Ataru
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#1918 - 2014-11-29 21:17:15 UTC
Jean Luc Lemmont wrote:
I'm just tired of the whining masses that react like preschoolers when CCP does something they don't like, toss their toys out of the pram on the forums, but when the rubber meets the road they just keep on doing what they were doing while sulking in the corner and muttering under their breath. The amount of illogical arguments I have seen put forward in this discussion thread (from both sides of the table mind) would be enough to write a case study. I've seen appeals to emotion, slippery slope, appeals to tradition, false dichotomies, and a half dozen other fallacious arguments - and that's just in the last dozen pages.
I suppose I'm just being a crotchety old man, but this happens every time CCP announces changes that negatively impact a popular play style. The nano-nerf, jump fatigue, freighter slots. I expect it will happen again when they finally get around to deciding what to do about the Ishtar. I know it will happen when they finally announce their plans for Sov 3.0.
Some people support the change, other people disapprove, and we end up with a hundred page threadnaught with half the posters threatening to quit because they disagree with the change. There's no need to tell everyone on the forums - just tell your mates so they know you didn't die. By all means, go enjoy the latest BC3K - sorry, I mean Star Citizen - or LOL, or whatever other game you enjoy playing.
If you feel that strongly about it - then unsub. We don't care and we won't miss you.


Why is it that when CCP changed jump drives, freighters, nanos, people were not told they couldn't complain, while we are being told we shouldn't object, and that if we do we deserve it? What the hell?
Eryn Velasquez
#1919 - 2014-11-29 21:34:07 UTC
Nolak Ataru wrote:

Nonsense. People are currently crying at CCP because they lost a 20b Providence to an ISBoxer ganker and are trying desperately to make the argument that they would not have been ganked if ISBoxing wasn't a thing.

I've seen more people complain about the local CODE monkey who constantly bumps people in belts and tries to sell "mining permits" in their relatively short lifespan than I ever have of people complaining about ISBoxer in my three years of playing.

But CCP *is* gutting it's revenue stream. There are some multiboxers such as myself that didn't PLEX their accounts ever because we wanted to support the game. To take away a significant chunk of the demand of a product and then claiming "We will still sell the same amount / make the same profit" is ludicrous to say the least.


I never had any contact with code. or any hisec pseudo-pvp ganker. I'm playing 6 accounts without any cheating 3rd party software since 2008. Works absolutely fine.

It is completely irrelevant how much work you have put into the cheatingBox. You'd better had invested your time in learning how to play without crutch.

_“A man's freedom consists in his being able to do whatever he wills, but that he should not, by any human power, be forced to do what is against his will.” ― Jean-Jacques Rousseau _
Madd Adda
#1920 - 2014-11-29 21:40:18 UTC
Nolak Ataru wrote:


Why is it that when CCP changed jump drives, freighters, nanos, people were not told they couldn't complain, while we are being told we shouldn't object, and that if we do we deserve it? What the hell?


Just because you can complain doesn't mean we wish to read it. Jump Fatigue affects us all, this only affects multiboxers that input broadcast.

Carebear extraordinaire