EVE General Discussion

You are wrong. It is easy to hide these things. For example i am on linux. To eve it looks like it is the only thing running on windows, even when i multibox. Even worse, is the privacy implications in the EU that no EULA can overrule.

Except it isn't as you can easily stack eve in window mode so all your overviews and such are right next to each other. I can run VGs about the same without isboxer as I can with isboxer's videofx. The only difference is someone with a smaller monitor at a lower resolution can only keep up with me if they are using videofx.

If anything videofx levels the field by allowing those without the financial resources to buy a 55 inch 4k monitor to do something similar with a smaller display.



I like your imagination and shamelessness. You have no issue with making up whole stories in an attempt to support your statements. Also I love your "no one is ever banned for multiboxing and if they were obviously they were using isboxer and are lying. Guilty no matter what. God I hope you don't serve on jury duty.

Think about this for a moment. If CCP can tell what you're running then how do they fail so massively at stopping bots? I mean they ban some and I applaud them for that but any trip to certain areas will result in you seeing a lot of obvious bots running.

Lets head back to WoW and their Warden. It was blatantly obvious to anyone playing WoW that Blizzard had added a scanner to the game. That scanner called warden fails MASSIVELY to catch such obvious bots as the newbie level 1s floating in space forming website names....

There are plenty of tools to see that, lsof, netstat, nc, and while they don't show all processes from all users, they can show processes from the current user that executed the program. Works for me in Ubuntu...

god damn, offline for two days and new wall of text in the Forums.

to the Video FX haters.
i can just Position 10 Webcams to the Monitors i have and accumulate the recorded Videos on one Screen. not third Party Software used. but same effect.

so why not using the power of the graphicscard to do the same? out of eve btw cause videofx is NOT changing eve. ist just recording eve and displaying it on another Position.
you dont want to ban fraps for recording eve. why do you want to ban Video fx for that?

ccp falcon stated that in the lates Podcast that videofx is NOT taken as a bannable offense. and since no other Statement is beeing put here readable for ALL OF THE COMMUNITY we dont have reason to believe otherwise.

and to the guys who are not getting tired to post again that evemon, teamspeak etc is not causing an unfair Advantage over Players not using those.

THEY ARE. teamspeak is giving you a huge Advantage over another fleet not using teamspeak during fight.
evemon is giving you a huge Advantage in planning skills etc. compared to a guy who is not using it.

I am issueing ten commands to ten different boxes using ten different keys.
so no difference to a normal Player cause i dont use multiplex or broadcasting.

if you want to get me banned cause i use my ten fingers then go on.
since eve is not getting into the News anymore with good things it might has to be the first MMORPG banning Players for using all fingers a normal grown human has.

i'm looking forward to that.

Be careful as under the rules being discussed using wine would be a bannable offense.


As noted above Falcon already made the argument against banning videofx in a podcast not that long ago.

The reason why using examples like Teamspeak, Evemon, Dotlan, EFT, Excel, Windows Calculator or any other third or fourth-party program you can think of is so fail is because CCP does not consider these part of in-game play. They may indeed create an advantage, but these apps do not interact with the client on the input side of the equation. Using VFX for streaming reasons doesn't either. But if you are using VFX to create inputs into the game, then that is an entirely different story. You are ostensibly creating an alternate user interface. These other programs that are continuously referenced don't change anything but the decision-making process in the mind of the player sitting at the keyboard. How is this not clear to you?

All third-party apps are not created equal. Even if you could legitimately make a non-laughable case that any of these apps, up to and including Windows itself, somehow bestows an advantage, it doesn't even matter. CCP has the right to rule in favor of one or more at the expense of any of the others. Why not just focus your efforts on defending ISBoxer based on its own merits? It's just a smarter argument than trying to create some equivalency between all third-party apps. CCP could decide Dotlan or EFT create the most lopsided advantage in the history of gaming and still choose to allow them. It has absolutely nothing to do with their decision related to ISboxer.

At this point, the arguments in favor of ISBoxer and the examples of various workarounds have probably hurt the pro-ISBoxer case more than helped it. Your best case, and one that I have been trying to hammer on for months, is in trying to pressure CCP to say more publicly so that the rules are as understandable as possible. However, I think this is just going to come down to all sides hearing what they want to hear by twisting the words to fit a desired outcome. Sadly, that isn't going to save anyone when/if the bans come. "I thought what Falcon said meant this..." isn't going to be a defense. If Falcon said anything it is: petition CCP for an answer. You may want to try that.

In the end, I'm really starting to wonder if some of you are just dead-enders. That if it really does go the way it seems like it is going that you'll just quit anyway, so why not go down fighting until you get banned. Fair enough. We've all got to go out some way. Good Luck. I hope they bring more clarity and perhaps they will at FanFest. I'm sure some of you will be there and will be able to meet face to face with Falcon and Peligro and others. I look forward to what may come of some face to face sidebars or even their presentation from Team Security.

Every Third Party Program is creating an In Game Advantage.

EvEMon - reducing significantly your needed time for long term skill plannings. thereforce it might reduces your Ingame or Realworld Money costs.
Teamspeak - creating a significant better Fleetmovement and allows faster control and reaction in certain circumstances.
EveCentral - allows daytraders and "marketbots"! to react quicker to the market than normal pilots. that is a huge advantage over normal players.
Siggy - Wormhole overviews. without that a normal pilot has to do a lot more to spread his scanned information.
isboxer with broadcasting - allowing one player to fly with multiple accounts and do the same actions to ALL accounts at the same time. hence. you misclick and warp into a trap. you die. with all your boxes. there is no difference between 10 players flying and 1 player flying with 10 boxes. except the pure envy the 1 player gets. for what? i dont know. he has multiple costs in ships, ammo, plex / realmoney. and multiple chances to lose all ships at once.
isboxer without broadcasting - still allowing one player to fly with multiple accounts, but this time the player has to interact with each box. this can be achieved via keybuttons linked to a specific box. so every command send out needs to be pressed seperatly.

yes. you have an advantage with third party software.
yes teamspeak and evemon are falling under this description as well as isboxer.

and no. your freighter got not ganked from an isboxer because he could. your freighter got ganked cause it was worth it.
if youre getting ganked by a regular pirate crew or an isboxer doesnt matter in the end, does it?

don't bother with the new skill queue evemon just waste time. I know from in game what skills are what attributes and once I make a year ish queue I remap to those attributes. I can do this quickly as its not hard at all. Evemon doesn't do anything that you can't figure out ingame.

Evemon doesn't do anything for speed, proof set up a plan and see how fast it trains oh that's right it doesn't you need to go into eve and queue the skill and you train at the same speed with evemon installed or not.


EFT fitting tools I don't bother with. If someone wants me to pvp they either give me a ship(doesn't happen much anymore :( ) or they just post a fitting for me.

It's not that it makes it faster. It's that it can be argued that it grants an advantage over someone who DOESN'T use EVEMon, or EFT. With EVEMon, you can optimize your queue for a year or more and optimize your attribute remap timing and train faster than someone who hasn't mapped it out and perfectly remaps every year.

For EFT, just because you don't use it doesn't mean it can't provide an advantage. My current PVP toy came about because of EFT/PYFA, as I have to use a meta module in order to cram everything on without implants. I challenge you to find me someone who has memorized each and every module in EVE and their CPU/PG attributes. I'd be very surprised if someone has. Some of the meta modules (damage controls, for example) are kinda expensive, and new players without much ISK or market skills would buy the meta 4 one (currently 8m or so Jita) and find out it didn't fit, or that he could fit the T2 version, and now he's wasted ISK.

Its really not hard to pick int+mem skills for a year, then pick per+will for a year and so on. When you could only have a 24 hour queue it was a pain to remember what skills you wanted to train next sometimes but with over a year long queue now it really isnt hard.