EVE General Discussion

No, this is a fact.

And if it's not an alt, it's a main. The problem with this is that the allure of an incursion in empire is so great, nullbears are abandoning their empires for greed.

This is the way of EVE where greed > all. Nullbears are now 50 jumps away when they're needed by their alliance and their JC's are on cooldown.

Holding space in null sec needs to have benefits which outweigh running empire incursions. There needs to be a reason for not just the alliance to be there, but the individual pilot as well. Pre-anom nerf there was. When CCP took the anoms away, they nerfed small gang PVP, they nerfed the grunt's ability to sustain an income IN NULL SEC and in essence made over 70% of null sec space worthless.


Prior to that nerf, more ships died. More roams happened and null sec was a scarier, more risky environment to be in. Now you can pass entire regions, barely seeing a soul.

The reason the pay is go good is low player population. Try doing High Sec Incursions and hitting that 120M/hour figure. Now, try doing it during prime-time when the server count is nearing 50k.

There's only so many sites that spawn at a time. The payouts for those sites generally go to the 2 or 3 badass, well-run fleets. Everyone else rushes around to catch the crumbs the good fleets don't want, and loses the payout to a third of their sites to the good fleets.

Add in that you spend a lot of time waiting for people to get their crap together, or waiting for someone to warp 20 jumps because they logged in at the last Incursion, or waiting to replace a Logistics that had to log off last minute, or waiting while your FC scouts out a site that isn't already taken...

Yeah, that 120M/Hour is an "ideal" number. Most of the time the payouts are far far lower.

Unless you're in a decent corp/alliance that runs something other than Highsec Vanguards/Assaults. Then the money is even better (until something bad happens).

See, here's where you're just being silly.

We have incursions in null sec sure.. however, think of how much space that is null. Now, imagine that an incursion is in your enemy's space, where their allies control. You'd literally need to fight another empire to run said incursion.

It's not worth the risk when I can just go to empire and run them under the safety of concord.

What you and so many people seem to miss is that null sec space needs to hold value for the solo, casual player to log in, make some isk and log out. The space itself needs to have that value OVER empire space not because we want more of you out here, simply because it's the basic principle of what EVE was built off of.

A solar system in null sec, no matter the security status should never be worth less for a solo, casual player to make an income than that of a .5 system that has the protection of Concord.

Ever.

But you can go anywhere in highsec (faction standings notwithstanding), and go there without risk. Players who want to run incursions in highsec can run one, then go and do the next one as soon as it appears. Highsec incursions also get completed, so all the pilots who participated get massive LP payouts.

In nullsec, there's only one or two incursions going on at once, and nullsec is a big place when you can't just autopilot your faction battleships around with impunity. If an incursion does appear nearby, you can sometimes rustle up a small gang to go and run the Vanguard sites for an hour or so. But you have to get the right numbers and fleet composition before you all set off, which takes a good 20 minutes, then the time it takes to fly the 20 jumps out to the incursion itself, run it for an hour or so before someone has to leave, and then fly 20 jumps home again. Because you have to travel - often through hostile territory - you can't just have a waiting list of people to join your fleet when someone has to go.

NBSI rules of engagement apply, so you can't just get together with some randoms from a hostile alliance to run the bigger sites with you - they'd rather just fight you. And because it's only a few of you running low-end sites sporadically, those nullsec incursions are very rarely completed. So no shiny BPCs, and no LP.

Incursions in nullsec are more lucrative than belt or anomaly ratting, hour-for-hour, but preparing for them is also a lot of hassle, and they're certainly nowhere near the cash cow of their highsec equivalents.

its 1.2+ bill a day if you put in a 9 hour day and have a good fleet run



let me say this, that's before you convert LPs to isk,

I like to think of all the "bears" who make isk as inadvertent PVPers who are fighting null sec with inflation.

Economic warfare is a valid war tactic and should not be nerfed.

Examples include:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaii_overprint_note
Account for Japanese invasion of Hawaii and prevent the use of any captured US legal tender by issuing special tender

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Bernhard
secret Nazi plan devised during the Second World War by the RSHA and the SS to destabilise the British economy by flooding the country with forged Bank of England

Certainly agree about a nullsec ISK/hr buff. But highsec bears (and the nullsec players that have now joined them) were here before Incursions, and they'll be here if they're nerfed. Sure, there will be whining, but when isn't there when something is changed (other than eye candy)?

If you don't nerf incursion income, then there needs to be far more ISK sinks. The PVP ISK sink of getting more players back into null is a start, but nowhere near enough, especially when you're drawing them into null by buffing yet another ISK faucet!

It's a bad idea to nerf the income of the game right now as too much inflation has already happened.

Economics 101 will tell you that in order to counter the current inflation, more money needs to be printed.

Where that money is injected will determine the face of EVE though. People by nature go where the resources which are available to them are.

EDIT: And if null continues the way it is, inflation will continue, accounts will continue to un-sub and null sec will continue to stagnate.

Words from a nullbear that hate everything highsec

Why be in null sec losing ships
when you can be in high grinding isk ?
Or... grinding isk in high.... loosing them in null..
Little info: ppl loosing ships in highsec allso