Ships & Modules

I'm not asking for matar nerfs, I'm asking for balance and bring other ships at the same level witch would be much better than nerfs.

Thing is, and if some of you don't agree then you must clearly have some serious mental issues, this supposed hybrids rebalancing resulted in another Matar buff. Point blank

With barrage and three TEs (may as well since you are fist ******* DPS) 3455+44.1 hurri only locks to 56km

That is on a current cyclone that has (shocker) a 5% falloff bonus.

...and I'll STILL outrun a Harbi

So what changes other than a Amarr fanboi is appeased.

Cyclone has a falloff bonus now huh.

BTW the new 10% Opt Harbinger stats with Heavypulse would be able to hit that far to it's optimal range with 2 TC's. While a Cane hitting that far would be so far in it's falloff it's Damage would be a joke.

As for outrunning a Harbinger... It is Minmatar of course it will. The long optimal more then makes up for it.

crumple yeah... and how does that differ from any other race? matar doesnt have less tank than the others , every other race would crumple too

This just in guys, shield cane as tanky as a plated harb, triple rep myrm or PDU drake!

J/K, Naomi Knight in a "I don't actually fly any of the ships I post about" non-shocker.

Just FYI, for buffer, a Drake beats Cane hands down. For active rep, a Myrm beats a Cyclone since it can get a 1K DPS tank with just T2 modules.

Its damage would be a joke ANYWAY after you chop its bonuses seriously, 650mm pointless and now that you have yanked a high you are talking a 500DPS ship with perfect skills in optimal and optimal is UNDER 4km



In otherwords you want the Harbi to be the premier BC, and the hell with the other three races.P.S. There is nothing stopping the cane from mounting Arties and essentially nuking you from space.

OH but you have to be able to hit with a MEDIUM short range turret into LARGE long range territory......I mean what could possibly go wrong.


...As sorry about the cyclone, that was erroneous, I was actually looking at a x2 TR Vaga.....for reference x2 TEs Vaga hits 3810 + 47500 with 220s with 425s it hits for 4233+51826. x2 TE (more realistic) its optimal plus falloff is still something like 48.


Are you using a speadsheet for this sillyness? This is your idea of balance?

Whatever, I can fit both I prefer 650s, YOU may fit 720s "always" but for the type of fighting I often to 650s are better all around, they are right in sweet sport of long point, you can actually hit something with the MWD below 35k AND it lets you fit a better tank.....on a ship that is ALWAYS going to thin in sheild trim.

...and don't bother BCing it, I've never lost one, despite 20 some odd kills.

Not to mention, no kidding atrilery has more than a 4km optimal...I was talking optimal DPS after you cut the ROF bonus and nerf the ship 30% overall. Go back to your spread sheet and show me a 500 DPS arty fit, you aren't getting there without some fairly exotic hardwires AND 650s AND HAMs along with perfect skills....and you are still going to need to overheat.

You play your spreadsheets, I play the game.





After you chop DPS and make it so the options for a shield cane and alpha or leave the field because you harbi is hitting 60km with SHORT RANGE TURRETS

Spare me

What is "going to beat it" a single neut Armor cane? That MAY get to 350DPS





.......jeee that wouldn't sort of make my point.




So do tell, which ship HAS a 5% falloff and medium guns.....NONE of them, what the **** am I supposed to model this after.
Vaga 10% Cyna 10%

None of the T1s HAVE a falloff bonus, you get ROF and damage.....its our flavor.

Either way it makes my point.




Where exactly did I contradict myself? I don't have every number for every fit memorized, you have yet to counter a point other than.

"It'll still win", whch is horseshit, if a shield cane is beating you in an armor Harbi solo your are doing it wrong. I intentially avoid them because a decent point will chase me off the field or draw it out until I screw up. Three times I've JUST managed to escape by virtue of suddely ECM drones when I've tried it.

But again, I want to hear how making a Harbi fire to lock inside optimal is in ANY way balanced.

C'mon, lets here something other than my numbers are wrong.

No because it should not exist.


I do not have to spare you because that is not a range it could get too. It would do less dmg then heavy Missiles at it's Optimal with Scorch as well so calm down. It just has the option of doing higher Dmg close up which it a good thing.


Tornado has a 5% Falloff. I love when your point involves being wrong about something you were already wrong about after mistaking a bonus on a Battlecruiser right below an exageration of range on the Harbinger. Your points are better made when you don't make so many mistakes.

That Armor Cane would get 440 DPS with 425mm with RF Ammo(which it could fit now) not counting Drones. As for one Neut sure two is to much for it and should be nerfed.

As for comparing it cut the Trajectory Analysis off of a Vega or Cyn to get the correct number. I can not believe I have to spoon feed you this.


Fact you can disengage. That is Minmatars strength. You want them to be hard to catch and beat the slowpokes at the same time? Again can not hit to lock range that's twice now.


1. Drake will still have longer range then the Harb.
2. Absolutely Nerf it the Cane is hugely overpowered.
3. Right now, no. Let them finish there Gal Rebalance.

Your Lock is 62km, with the bonus and Heavy Pulse Scorch you could not hit that far. Why is it that you keep posting wrong numbers. I know you want to here something other then your numbers are wrong but they are again and they make up your argument.

Of course. Lasers are tangibly better in actually killing than projectiles. You've never even pretended otherwise other than to complain about how falloff sometimes matches your optimal. They also obsolete blasters by doing nearly as much DPS, at approximately four times the range, but sure let's nerf the one viable turret alternative because PIE Inc. is a bunch of crybaby RPers.

Well, Im Gallente, and I must observe that this thread has run its course. Arguments - stale. Horse - beat.

I declare next subject for nerf discussion shall be: NERF DRAEK! While we have been arguing, it has been hiding, unnoticed, quietly sitting atop killboards and Isk boards alike. Surely, it is evil. ;)