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Station blindness.

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Jenshae Chiroptera
#1 - 2014-10-31 03:06:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenshae Chiroptera
I am constantly surprised by my inability to find a window in a station to have a look outside.

Can we have:

  • The ability to load the outside and have the camera position as though we were piloting the station and not be able to interact with the surrounding system?
  • Seemlessly undock our ships, change camera position and have controls restored without loading delays?
  • Two or more exits from the station, which we can select and co-ordinate with others?


Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Could make it so that you can only look out of the window if your corp holds offices in that station?

Theory being that they gained rooms with a view and links to station's external cameras.


Gadget Helmsdottir wrote:
I like the idea of clicking a button and having an outside view of the station. Beyond the point that having a different view every once in a while is a nice change of pace, having some intel of what's out there will intice more pilots to actually leave the station.

Like Wolf Incaelum said, stations are 100% safe. So why leave at all? Mostly, you leave to do other things in the game that can't actually be done from the station interior... like 95% of the of the game. However, I disagree that having a window to the outside situation would make the station safer by any means. It's already at it's max safeness, it can't get any safer. The character inside cannot be physically attacked by any means.

However, if the pilot has an outside view, this will increase her chances of actually leaving said station where she then becomes a target. She has now a much less than a 100% chance of being safe from attack.

As for giving an unfair chance for the person leaving the station over potential attackers, I look at it this way. If there are red pilots in the system, why would a pilot undock at all? There's a chance that they may be outside your door. A cool headed pilot will wait out the reds by spinning, or switching to an alt. The ability to see outside increases the chance of a pilot getting killed, by giving the pilot a (false?) sence of confidence that it's safe to undock. This can only increase the chances for the attackers to kill their target. Before, the pilot was 100% safe from harm; undocked they aren't.


--Gadget

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#2 - 2014-10-31 03:37:11 UTC
Always been a fan of station windows ideas. Its part of a 2 step change for me. We get the windows and ccp could make the station campers happy with maybe better undock attack mechanics. As currently the only way to see if reds in undock is to undock and redock if too hot and fast warp off not looking good. Or get a nuet friend/alt to e-stalk the undock and see the information of who is there.
Rowells
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2014-10-31 04:31:59 UTC
just open the door and you can see outside
Komi Toran
Perkone
Caldari State
#4 - 2014-10-31 06:39:04 UTC
Only if a defenestration skill is introduced at the same time.
James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#5 - 2014-10-31 06:41:30 UTC
Komi Toran wrote:
Only if a defenestration skill is introduced at the same time.

WTB Advanced defenestration skillbook.

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp
Humang
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#6 - 2014-10-31 07:22:54 UTC
Rowells wrote:
just open the door and you can see outside


Just think of all those nasty drafts that will blow through.

AFK cloaking thread Summary - Provided by Paikis Good Post Etiquette - Provided by CCP Grayscale
King Fu Hostile
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#7 - 2014-10-31 08:18:30 UTC
+1 for Observation Deck
Gadget Helmsdottir
Gadget's Workshop
#8 - 2014-10-31 09:00:19 UTC
Or make that damned TV useful in the Quarters. Choose channel LookOutside.

--Gadget

Work smarter, not harder. --Scrooge McDuck, an eminent old-Earth economist

Given an hour to save New Eden, how would respected scientist, Albertus Eisenstein compose his thoughts? "Fifty-five minutes to define the problem; save the galaxy in five."
Jenshae Chiroptera
#9 - 2014-10-31 12:08:47 UTC
Could make it so that you can only look out of the window if your corp holds offices in that station?

Theory being that they gained rooms with a view and links to station's external cameras.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Wolf Incaelum
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2014-10-31 16:40:23 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
I am constantly surprised by my inability to find a window in a station to have a look outside.

Can we have:

  • The ability to load the outside and have the camera position as though we were piloting the station and not be able to interact with the surrounding system?
  • Seemlessly undock our ships, change camera position and have controls restored without loading delays?
  • Two or more exits from the station, which we can select and co-ordinate with others?


Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Could make it so that you can only look out of the window if your corp holds offices in that station?

Theory being that they gained rooms with a view and links to station's external cameras.


I don't really care too much about having windows in the station. When I'm in a station, I'm usually too occupied with other things to really care about what's going on outside. Having multiple undocks to choose from, on the other hand, sounds like something that could be very nice to have.

Especially at the hubs. It could be interesting for FW pilots, because station campers will have two separate undocks to choose from. The undock points will be less congested making it easier for the campers to find a target. At the same time, since the campers will be spread out over multiple undocks, pilots who are undocking will have a better chance of escaping the camp.

ANARCHYFOREVAAARRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!
Jenshae Chiroptera
#11 - 2014-10-31 17:40:45 UTC
Wolf Incaelum wrote:

I'm ... too occupied ... to really care about what's going on outside. Having multiple undocks ..., sounds like something that could be very nice to have.


While we are busy in the station, a fleet comes into the system. You are the only one there. Wouldn't you want to know if they have bubbles at all the exits? Wouldn't you like to have a look at the ships gathered around the station?

I think others would.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Wolf Incaelum
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2014-10-31 17:53:51 UTC
I wouldn't. Undocking is always fun for me because I never know what's going to be there waiting for me when I come on grid. Now, I'm not saying that I will warp around between stations docking and undocking just for ***** and giggles. That's just silliness. But I do always get a tiny little adrenaline rush every time I undock because, no matter how unlikely it may be in some areas, I never know if someone will be waiting there to insta-lock me.

The way I see it, stations are already the one and only 100% safe place in Eve, as long as you never undock. It's not like the other pilots can dock up, walk through the station to find your CQ, and beat the door open to come beat the hell out of you. Station air quality apparently won't allow for such activities. Stations don't need to be safer by allowing the pilots who are inside to see what it outside.

Besides, if someone is waiting for you, TECHNICALLY they're at a disadvantage because they don't know what you'll be undocking in, or how many of you are going to undock (assuming you have corp members or alts that you use). But that disadvantage is equaled out because you are at the same disadvantage, unless they've been following you for a while and you actually took the time to D-Scan or look at the OV and see what they are flying. If you have the ability to look outside, that tips the odds in your favor a little bit. I believe the term commonly used on the forums is "unbalanced".

ANARCHYFOREVAAARRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!
Wolf Incaelum
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2014-10-31 19:29:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Wolf Incaelum
Also, you should be watching local for spikes. That way, you know if a fleet is coming into the system. Go have a look through local real fast and check out the info on a couple of the players who just jumped in. If they look like people you want to avoid, either stay docked, or wrap up your business and try to gtfo before they get to the station. We all have a gtfo tab in our OV, right?

Edit: I'm not trying to bash your idea. Just giving you my honest feedback. I like not being able to see out of the station, and I'm pretty well able to avoid getting pinned down in a station.

ANARCHYFOREVAAARRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!
Jenshae Chiroptera
#14 - 2014-11-01 01:03:43 UTC
Wolf Incaelum wrote:

Besides, if someone is waiting for you, TECHNICALLY they're at a disadvantage because they don't know what you'll be undocking in, or how many of you are going to undock (assuming you have corp members or alts that you use). But that disadvantage is equaled out because you are at the same disadvantage, unless they've been following you for a while and you actually took the time to D-Scan or look at the OV and see what they are flying. If you have the ability to look outside, that tips the odds in your favor a little bit. I believe the term commonly used on the forums is "unbalanced".


Attackers are oganised, they set a time, make up a fleet of a few hundred then camp a station that has 12 people online using bait ships.
The unbalance is now in that the attackers know when they will attack. Seeing outside the station gives some home advantage and balances it out.

As to your escaping and having warp off points try that with a bubble outside and ships waiting in position to bump you off station.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Mharius Skjem
Guardians of the Underworld
#15 - 2014-11-01 08:39:08 UTC
Do we even need station interiors?

Just dock and stay outside under station protection such as their guns and force field. Access the normal station menus to do your thing whilst looking around and keeping an eye on all the other ships you can see.

With only 4 station interiors for all of new eden, you've got to ask, just how much do they bring to the game?

A recovering btter vet,  with a fresh toon and a determination to like everything that CCP does to Eve...

Don't take me too seriously though, I like to tease a bit on the forums, but that's only because I love you...
Ix Method
Doomheim
#16 - 2014-11-01 09:33:35 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
While we are busy in the station, a fleet comes into the system. You are the only one there. Wouldn't you want to know if they have bubbles at all the exits? Wouldn't you like to have a look at the ships gathered around the station?

I think others would.

Isn't this a pretty good argument against the idea?

Travelling at the speed of love.
Jenshae Chiroptera
#17 - 2014-11-01 15:18:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenshae Chiroptera
Mharius Skjem wrote:
Do we even need station interiors?

The windows thing was not literal. After the captain's quarters burnt out my 8800 GTX with slow heat build up when I went AFK. I have used the disable option as soon as it was implemented.

The windows comment was a rhetorical way of needling CCP for not having a logical design implemented in the game all these years.
Ix Method wrote:
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
While we are busy in the station, a fleet comes into the system. You are the only one there. Wouldn't you want to know if they have bubbles at all the exits? Wouldn't you like to have a look at the ships gathered around the station?

I think others would.

Isn't this a pretty good argument against the idea?


That is a matter of perspective. If you feel that CCP should keep on hand holding and feeding up victims then that is the religious beliefs you can keep following.

I can already think of a counter strategy for being able to see out of a station before undocking:


  • Cloaked tacklers and a cloaked bumper.
  • Warp fleet to 1000km off station.
  • Enemy looks out of the station and sees nothing.
  • Enemy comes out.
  • Now the cloaked ships have to tackle, bubble and bump before he warps off.
  • If successful the fleet has a short fast warp to join in the slaughter.


Bit more challenging but still possible to get them.
If you know they don't have offices in that station then you don't need to do any of this, just proceed with that everyone already does now. Blink

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Ix Method
Doomheim
#18 - 2014-11-01 15:47:14 UTC
I believe the Book of Station Games is widely considered apocrypha.

Just curious as to why you feel you should be allowed perfect, if limited, intel completely without cooperation/alts and while hiding in total safety?

Travelling at the speed of love.
Gadget Helmsdottir
Gadget's Workshop
#19 - 2014-11-01 15:58:32 UTC
I like the idea of clicking a button and having an outside view of the station. Beyond the point that having a different view every once in a while is a nice change of pace, having some intel of what's out there will intice more pilots to actually leave the station.

Like Wolf Incaelum said, stations are 100% safe. So why leave at all? Mostly, you leave to do other things in the game that can't actually be done from the station interior... like 95% of the of the game. However, I disagree that having a window to the outside situation would make the station safer by any means. It's already at it's max safeness, it can't get any safer. The character inside cannot be physically attacked by any means.

However, if the pilot has an outside view, this will increase her chances of actually leaving said station where she then becomes a target. She has now a much less than a 100% chance of being safe from attack.

As for giving an unfair chance for the person leaving the station over potential attackers, I look at it this way. If there are red pilots in the system, why would a pilot undock at all? There's a chance that they may be outside your door. A cool headed pilot will wait out the reds by spinning, or switching to an alt. The ability to see outside increases the chance of a pilot getting killed, by giving the pilot a (false?) sence of confidence that it's safe to undock. This can only increase the chances for the attackers to kill their target. Before, the pilot was 100% safe from harm; undocked they aren't.


--Gadget

Work smarter, not harder. --Scrooge McDuck, an eminent old-Earth economist

Given an hour to save New Eden, how would respected scientist, Albertus Eisenstein compose his thoughts? "Fifty-five minutes to define the problem; save the galaxy in five."
Jenshae Chiroptera
#20 - 2014-11-01 16:20:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenshae Chiroptera
Gadget Helmsdottir wrote:
I like the idea of clicking a button and having an outside view of the station. Beyond the point that having a different view every once in a while is a nice change of pace, having some intel of what's out there will intice more pilots to actually leave the station.
--Gadget


That is a beautiful post. I am going to add it to the OP and find more posts by you to "Like" because I can't like this one enough. Big smile

P.S. How much do you cost in ISK to hire for idea PR and post clarifications? P

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
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