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Evictions, good for w-space?

First post
Author
Nero Pantera
Whale Girth
Touched by the Tism
#21 - 2014-10-28 09:17:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Nero Pantera
Tuscor wrote:
I've been in and out of Wormholes since ~2011. I've been on the receiving end of evictions twice, and one corp I was in had to move out of a WH 'under threat' when our CEO fell out with the Alliance leadership (back in Talocan United days).

I still live in a WH and most of the guys I flew with over the years still do too. The evictions did not stop me and many of my corpies from coming back (albeit not always in the same corp).

Evictions every weekend are clearly not sustainable - but the odd eviction, be it for loot, killmails, to settle an old grudge or to kick up the dust is part of living in WH's and part of the uncertainty of this way of life. If you are doing it right, an eviction will not be an 'extinction event' for your corp...

We recently invaded a C5... we got a good fight from the locals, we could have been beaten if they had bought more WH appropriate ships (ie fitted their armageddons with neuts not missiles). We even offered to leave after the fight for a nominal fee but the locals preferred to go down fighting...

Anyway, the point is, conflict is fun, being on the receiving end of an invasion is stressful but can be entertaining and if it leads to people leaving WH space for good, maybe they should not have been there in the first place...



Yeah I'm sure its fun when your not facing a 99 man t3/dread capital fleet from bluebuttdonutlover'sanonymous, however for us 20 to 30 man active pvp entities it will never anywhere close to "fun" because it wouldn't even be a fight.
King Fu Hostile
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#22 - 2014-10-28 09:30:36 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:

C5s are not 'unpopulated', they have the same level of population as all other classes of WHs: low.


In C5 space we used to roll for action several times a night, scan down 20 holes deep every time and then log off because there was nobody out there. In C4/C2 space we almost never need to roll, since there's actually people about and flying in space. The difference is dramatic and C5 space is like a bad memory of a desolate, sad place.

Moving out of C5s was the best decision we made and cured all frustration and boredom.






Tuscor
13.
#23 - 2014-10-28 09:32:19 UTC

Yeah, fair enough, being steam-rolled is rarely enjoyable. However, the reality is that unless your 20-30 man corp has pissed off this supposed 'bluebuttdonutlover'sanonymous' either by being dorks, or not bringing the fights (presumably not a problem if you are active pvpers), then practically speaking you are not likely to face eviction by an overwhelming force.
Mithandra
B.O.P Supplication For Glorious
Dracarys.
#24 - 2014-10-28 10:14:24 UTC
My opinion.

Eviction to claim the hole for your own is good. Its content

Joining up to protect someone elses hole if asked is good. Its content

Joining a fleet to go shoot those self same people a few days later is good. Its content

justifying your actions by pontificating about the evils of the corp/alliance/donkey bangers in question is idiocy. Admit it's due to boredom or greed and lets get to it Big smile



I'm a little vague about how evicting a corp/alliance improves WH space though.


And finally, if we are the next to face an eviction for actually turning up for a fight , then if BoB wills it. So be it. No tears here, it's all part of the rich tapestry of eve

Eve is the dark haired, totally hot emo gothchild of the gaming community

Rek Seven
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2014-10-28 10:29:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Rek Seven
Good for wormholes?

Not really. The majority of people find them boring and rarely make any isk from it. If you're not doing it to take the system, evictions only serve to make corp/alliance leaders feel special and give their members something to do.

What should be talked about more are the small corps who plan an eviction and execute it on their own to demonstrating the power of small gangs in wormhole space. Instead all we hear about are the evictions that involve massive coalition dogpiling on one entity and why would anyone come to wormhole space to take part in blob warfare? Straight
RudinV
Sons Of Mother's Friend
Can i bring my Drake...
#26 - 2014-10-28 10:35:55 UTC
Andrew Jester wrote:


Is carebearing 23/7 dumb? Absolutely. I don't think it's a reason to evict someone though. When they carebear they provide gank targets. In a C5, that's usually cap gangs, and everyone likes to kill caps. In a lower class hole, it's tengus or drakes, which, while not the greatest, are still something to kill.


srsly? Jessy one this paragraph is an example u know nothing about subject...
carebears provide targets? yes the moment u go inside the hole and they are there, waiting for to kill them...oh noes, i forgot, in case they are bit better than brain damaged high sec miner all u would see is just bunch of caps under the force field. and another variant: 5-6 dreads+3-4 carriers in magnetar? or even without bonuses? what fleet comp u would suggest for that?
last time NoHo was ganked cose they didnt even bothered to roll the damn hole. And u know why? cose years of "content providing" during carebearing with that massive fleet made them lazy as fk.
Evictions are boring-yes. but dont u wanna say that chilly home bearing is fun and exciting?
and last point. corp which loose any assets (like10b+) during eviction-bunch of nubz and slakers. its wh. its fkn dangerous place, and if u bring tons of shiny loot just to feel better-u r an idiot in not idiot welcome environment and should be punished for that. Everyone who thinks another state against evolution theory and would be punished as well. Its just yours opinion against millions years of prove.
Viscis Breeze
The Northerners
Pandemic Horde
#27 - 2014-10-28 10:41:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Viscis Breeze
Evictions happen, its good content if people won't step up and fight.

Its also boring as hell.

Recruitment: http://bit.ly/1r4G5Pv Website: http://www.no-vacancies.net/ Channel: No Vacancies

Tuscor
13.
#28 - 2014-10-28 10:46:18 UTC
Viscis Breeze wrote:
Evictions happen, its good content if people won't step up and fight.

Its also boring as hell.


Pretty much this!
Andrew Jester
Collapsed Out
Pandemic Legion
#29 - 2014-10-28 12:19:23 UTC
RudinV wrote:
Andrew Jester wrote:


Is carebearing 23/7 dumb? Absolutely. I don't think it's a reason to evict someone though. When they carebear they provide gank targets. In a C5, that's usually cap gangs, and everyone likes to kill caps. In a lower class hole, it's tengus or drakes, which, while not the greatest, are still something to kill.


srsly? Jessy one this paragraph is an example u know nothing about subject...
carebears provide targets? yes the moment u go inside the hole and they are there, waiting for to kill them...oh noes, i forgot, in case they are bit better than brain damaged high sec miner all u would see is just bunch of caps under the force field. and another variant: 5-6 dreads+3-4 carriers in magnetar? or even without bonuses? what fleet comp u would suggest for that?
last time NoHo was ganked cose they didnt even bothered to roll the damn hole. And u know why? cose years of "content providing" during carebearing with that massive fleet made them lazy as fk.
Evictions are boring-yes. but dont u wanna say that chilly home bearing is fun and exciting?
and last point. corp which loose any assets (like10b+) during eviction-bunch of nubz and slakers. its wh. its fkn dangerous place, and if u bring tons of shiny loot just to feel better-u r an idiot in not idiot welcome environment and should be punished for that. Everyone who thinks another state against evolution theory and would be punished as well. Its just yours opinion against millions years of prove.


Maybe I do not know much because I never did evictions because they made me want to kill myself. So many times bears are still there because they're bad. With dreads+cars in mag then you call the rest of bluefriends to bring 60-70 T3 gang and kill easy. HK+other have done before, can easy do again. Home bearing makes me want to kill myself in a way that nothing else I've experienced does. If corp come back to WH, losing assets is not a problem for them. With C5, if they are big bears, they should have enough from bearing to replace all, but they don't come back which mean empty hole. My point is that a bear hole is better than an empty hole.

If thuggin' was a category I'd win a Grammy

ChaeDoc II
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#30 - 2014-10-28 14:20:17 UTC
It's always amused me that some people who play this game get offended by others who choose to spend their time carebearing. It's like a child throwing a tantrum because another child is wearing a t-shirt he doesn't like.
MooMooDachshundCow
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#31 - 2014-10-28 14:20:17 UTC
RudinV wrote:
5-6 dreads+3-4 carriers in magnetar? or even without bonuses? what fleet comp u would suggest for that?


Tech 3's.

Magnetar probably plays in your favor in this case (less tracking for dreads) as long as you can outnumber their subcaps, or mitigate them with jams.

Haven't you personally done this? I'm certain that your corp has.

Yeah, well, it's just like my opinion, man.

mechform
#32 - 2014-10-28 14:34:48 UTC  |  Edited by: mechform
Some people like making sand castles, some like kicking them down.

There are plenty of other games that are all about building sand castles, maybe EVE is not a game for those who do not like dealing with both extremes of the player spectrum.

Black Power - Brotha's in space unite!

ChaeDoc II
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#33 - 2014-10-28 15:08:24 UTC
mechform wrote:
Some people like making sand castles, some like kicking them down.

There are plenty of other games that are all about building sand castles, maybe EVE is not a game for those who do not like dealing with both extremes of the player spectrum.


To be clear, if your kid is building sand castles on the beach and i come along and kick it down your response is going to be to advise your kid to not build sand castles, is that right?
mechform
#34 - 2014-10-28 15:13:14 UTC
ChaeDoc II wrote:
mechform wrote:
Some people like making sand castles, some like kicking them down.

There are plenty of other games that are all about building sand castles, maybe EVE is not a game for those who do not like dealing with both extremes of the player spectrum.


To be clear, if your kid is building sand castles on the beach and i come along and kick it down your response is going to be to advise your kid to not build sand castles, is that right?


I dont' have kids so Im not too worried about a hypothetical scenario which will never really happen.

This is Eve Online a game, not a day at the beach.

If you cannot make the distinction, there is not much the Eve forums can do for you.

Black Power - Brotha's in space unite!

ChaeDoc II
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#35 - 2014-10-28 15:31:06 UTC
mechform wrote:
ChaeDoc II wrote:
mechform wrote:
Some people like making sand castles, some like kicking them down.

There are plenty of other games that are all about building sand castles, maybe EVE is not a game for those who do not like dealing with both extremes of the player spectrum.


To be clear, if your kid is building sand castles on the beach and i come along and kick it down your response is going to be to advise your kid to not build sand castles, is that right?


I dont' have kids so Im not too worried about a hypothetical scenario which will never really happen.

This is Eve Online a game, not a day at the beach.

If you cannot make the distinction, there is not much the Eve forums can do for you.


You made the analogy, not me.
RudinV
Sons Of Mother's Friend
Can i bring my Drake...
#36 - 2014-10-28 15:40:42 UTC
MooMooDachshundCow wrote:
RudinV wrote:
5-6 dreads+3-4 carriers in magnetar? or even without bonuses? what fleet comp u would suggest for that?


Tech 3's.

Magnetar probably plays in your favor in this case (less tracking for dreads) as long as you can outnumber their subcaps, or mitigate them with jams.

Haven't you personally done this? I'm certain that your corp has.

plz tell me more about, i love to listen EFT warriors
mechform
#37 - 2014-10-28 16:01:26 UTC  |  Edited by: mechform
ChaeDoc II wrote:
mechform wrote:
ChaeDoc II wrote:
mechform wrote:
Analogy
Horrible analogy of how said analogy relates from a game to real world
Retort
troll


Which is a pretty good analogy about one of the game play choices in eve online. I will break it down so you can understand a little better.

"Some people like making sand castles"
This refers to the players that really like the industry side of the game, the mining, and the farming. Since Eve is a sandbox game, they can do this where ever they want. There are no mechanics in game which stop them from doing industry and farming inside of the programmed limitation of said game. Keep in mind, that CCP has stated plenty of times, with bigger risk come bigger rewards.

You maybe wondering what these risks of industry/farming in WH space could possibly be, this comes in the second part of the analogy.

"Some people like kicking them down"
This refers to the players that like PVP, sieges, conflict. This is one of the risks of the big rewards a player gets from WH living. We should thank Blood Union for bringing this meta into actual existence rather than just a myth, and thank the Blued Union for continuing it.

But some people want to bring the safe aspect of the game, into the more dangerous 'risky' parts and expect the same awsome rewards. Which the nature of CCP's advertised game driver will not allow. But luckily they have made 'zones' in game which are relatively conflict free.

Black Power - Brotha's in space unite!

Ridvanson
#38 - 2014-10-28 16:28:51 UTC
We've been evicted two times, now going to (try and) evict some people that moved into a hole before we could put up towers of our own. Should we feel bad now?

Said group has twice as many pilots as we do, yet in the three weeks that we've been watching they haven't done anything but log in and off again, and planting small towers on every single moon of the system oO. They don't even bear ...

Frankly, having been on the receiving end of evictions, I find nothing wrong with them. Finding empty holes is easy enough, so if you don't like the logistics part of it, maybe you don't belong (anymore) ...
mechform
#39 - 2014-10-28 16:53:29 UTC
I too have a NPC alt that is going to do something.

Black Power - Brotha's in space unite!

Karma Arkaral
Doomheim
#40 - 2014-10-28 17:43:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Karma Arkaral
Incindir Mauser wrote:



Carebears are typically the victims of getting evicted and the standards to which those individuals are held vary widely, corp by corp. We've done our fair share of peter ops and our halls are decorated with the corpses of flash-crashing bears that dared name their towers "Elite PvP". They lose it all and because they are motivated purely by milking the teats of Sleepers, they don't come back.




Maybe it's not so much that they love sucking the teet of sleepers so much as it's a losing battle to put up a fight agaist overwhelming corps/alliances/coalitions. At the end of the day if your chances of winning is 0% you might as well cut your loses, not fight back, and just gather whatever is left and move somewhere else where you actually stand a chance.

mechform wrote:
hich is a pretty good analogy about one of the game play choices in eve online. I will break it down so you can understand a little better.

"Some people like making sand castles"
This refers to the players that really like the industry side of the game, the mining, and the farming. Since Eve is a sandbox game, they can do this where ever they want. There are no mechanics in game which stop them from doing industry and farming inside of the programmed limitation of said game. Keep in mind, that CCP has stated plenty of times, with bigger risk come bigger rewards.

You maybe wondering what these risks of industry/farming in WH space could possibly be, this comes in the second part of the analogy.

"Some people like kicking them down"
This refers to the players that like PVP, sieges, conflict. This is one of the risks of the big rewards a player gets from WH living. We should thank Blood Union for bringing this meta into actual existence rather than just a myth, and thank the Blued Union for continuing it.

But some people want to bring the safe aspect of the game, into the more dangerous 'risky' parts and expect the same awsome rewards. Which the nature of CCP's advertised game driver will not allow. But luckily they have made 'zones' in game which are relatively conflict free


Right, I don't think that's what we're all arguing here. WH is dangerous, sooner or later you will either get ganked or get your stuff destroyed. The problem is larger entities complaining about weaker ones "not fighting back". What's there to fight back when you, as the smaller entity, has already lost a portion of your resources and the chances of making a dent on the enemy force is close to zero?

For that matter, like I already said, just cut your loses, pick everything up and move out of the system if you can't survive. Blue ball these large entities and go watch them sperg in the forums about how there is no content in WHs, just like null people were sperging about the lack of content when they were the ones responsible for that situation.

this is a decease hard to solve in a game that dependson destruction to keep its content up. It's human nature to want to consolidate power because there is strength in unity. In the real world this would be fine because it guarantees survival, but not in a game where the more strength and power in numbers means there are less and less groups willing to put up a fight.

I love the industry side of Eve, I also love the PvP aspect of it. It's possible to do both. I supplement by PvP by doing industry. I was doing some lowsec mining one time in a procurer, partly for the resources, but also because of the thrill. I was, and still am aware or the risk. That's where the fun is! I was expecting a couple of guys or the solo pvper to drop on me, but instead I got a cloaky loki to put up a cyno and drop about 3 blops BSes, couple of bombers, and a couple of marauders all on me, the lone procurer.

There is nothing absolutely wrong with that, I told them "good catch, well played" in local and chatted them up, but there was no way that I could actually put up against them in my small corp. So we moved out and that was pretty much the only kill they got from me.