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In simplest terms, what is wrong with EVE

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MiA Jamus
Salt Miners Union
SONS of BANE
#641 - 2014-10-30 11:14:58 UTC
/tears

Love it.
Westmarch
#642 - 2014-10-30 11:33:40 UTC
You joined EVE. Trust No one. KILL EVERYTHING.
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#643 - 2014-10-30 12:17:49 UTC
Enable awoxing for NPC corporations only, and make CONCORD not respond to violence against <10 man corporations. All of EVE' problems solved in two changes.

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Black Pedro
Mine.
#644 - 2014-10-30 12:32:35 UTC
Bastion Arzi wrote:
but its only a concord response, its not a total ban on awoxing. so it is still possible however 2 ships will be lost instead of 1.

I don't understand your point. If CCP removes awoxing, that is the legal ability to shoot corp mates in highsec, by adding a CONCORD response (although the exact change is probably still under discussion), then shooting a corp mate is exactly the same as suicide ganking. This will severely limit the types of ships that can be destroyed by an awoxer before CONCORD arrives, and makes the whole endeavour (sneaking into a corp to damage it) moot as the attacker will loose their ship exactly the same way as if they did not join the corp in the first place.

The 8 Golden Rules of Eve

Why Do They Gank?
Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
#645 - 2014-10-30 13:54:06 UTC
La Nariz wrote:
Enable awoxing for NPC corporations only, and make CONCORD not respond to violence against <10 man corporations. All of EVE' problems solved in two changes.


Oh yes because nothing would be better for Eve than the creation of 10 man alt corps or forcing everyone into the blue donut. The playerbase has spoken - their response to awoxxing is to stay in NPC corps...they don't like the mechanic. That is what is motivating CCP, not the fact that awoxxing is claiming victims, but the fact that highsecers are responding en masse by just avoiding the entire corporation system because of it.
Kamahl Daikun
State War Academy
Caldari State
#646 - 2014-10-30 14:05:10 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
La Nariz wrote:
Enable awoxing for NPC corporations only, and make CONCORD not respond to violence against <10 man corporations. All of EVE' problems solved in two changes.


Oh yes because nothing would be better for Eve than the creation of 10 man alt corps or forcing everyone into the blue donut. The playerbase has spoken - their response to awoxxing is to stay in NPC corps...they don't like the mechanic. That is what is motivating CCP, not the fact that awoxxing is claiming victims, but the fact that highsecers are responding en masse by just avoiding the entire corporation system because of it.


Uh...
At that point, there's nothing inherently wrong with the system. The problem lies with the players. Everything, for the most part, in Eve has a risk associated with it. The risk associated with the Corporation system isn't "too high", the players are just too scared to take the risk. That doesn't justify changing it. In fact, it's empirical evidence that your players are crybabies.

Just because people cry about it doesn't make it a good reason.
Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
#647 - 2014-10-30 14:09:36 UTC
Kamahl Daikun wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
La Nariz wrote:
Enable awoxing for NPC corporations only, and make CONCORD not respond to violence against <10 man corporations. All of EVE' problems solved in two changes.


Oh yes because nothing would be better for Eve than the creation of 10 man alt corps or forcing everyone into the blue donut. The playerbase has spoken - their response to awoxxing is to stay in NPC corps...they don't like the mechanic. That is what is motivating CCP, not the fact that awoxxing is claiming victims, but the fact that highsecers are responding en masse by just avoiding the entire corporation system because of it.


Uh...
At that point, there's nothing inherently wrong with the system. The problem lies with the players. Everything, for the most part, in Eve has a risk associated with it. The risk associated with the Corporation system isn't "too high", the players are just too scared to take the risk. That doesn't justify changing it. In fact, it's empirical evidence that your players are crybabies.

Just because people cry about it doesn't make it a good reason.


True enough. What worries CCP is that solo mission runners who avoid the corp system and stick with solo play are less likely to remain paying accounts. They feel (probably correctly) that getting more people involved in the social fabric of Eve will lead to a higher retention rate and a broader subscriber base. So to the extent players are responding to current game mechanics by engaging in corpless solo play, CCP has an interest in adjusting those mechanics to encourage otherwise.
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#648 - 2014-10-30 14:36:10 UTC
Black Pedro wrote:
Bastion Arzi wrote:
but its only a concord response, its not a total ban on awoxing. so it is still possible however 2 ships will be lost instead of 1.

I don't understand your point. If CCP removes awoxing, that is the legal ability to shoot corp mates in highsec, by adding a CONCORD response (although the exact change is probably still under discussion), then shooting a corp mate is exactly the same as suicide ganking. This will severely limit the types of ships that can be destroyed by an awoxer before CONCORD arrives, and makes the whole endeavour (sneaking into a corp to damage it) moot as the attacker will loose their ship exactly the same way as if they did not join the corp in the first place.


yeah i agree
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#649 - 2014-10-30 14:54:53 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
La Nariz wrote:
Enable awoxing for NPC corporations only, and make CONCORD not respond to violence against <10 man corporations. All of EVE' problems solved in two changes.


Oh yes because nothing would be better for Eve than the creation of 10 man alt corps or forcing everyone into the blue donut. The playerbase has spoken - their response to awoxxing is to stay in NPC corps...they don't like the mechanic. That is what is motivating CCP, not the fact that awoxxing is claiming victims, but the fact that highsecers are responding en masse by just avoiding the entire corporation system because of it.


It would improve a lot of things and give an incentive to get out of npc corps. It adds easily mitigated risk. You also need to provide proof that people stay in npc corps because of awoxing.

CCP is repeating history right now and we know how popular incarna was.

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Fabio Suave
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#650 - 2014-10-30 14:57:57 UTC
I don't like the time-based skill system. Instead I wish we all got X number of skill points, and we could drop 1-5 points into any skills we wanted.

Maybe it's an idea for EVE 2? I just hate waiting weeks or months for a skill to train. I love everything else about EVE.
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#651 - 2014-10-30 15:13:09 UTC
Fabio Suave wrote:
I don't like the time-based skill system. Instead I wish we all got X number of skill points, and we could drop 1-5 points into any skills we wanted.

Maybe it's an idea for EVE 2? I just hate waiting weeks or months for a skill to train. I love everything else about EVE.


This and remove learning implants.

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Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#652 - 2014-10-30 15:15:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Fabio Suave wrote:
I don't like the time-based skill system. Instead I wish we all got X number of skill points, and we could drop 1-5 points into any skills we wanted.

Maybe it's an idea for EVE 2? I just hate waiting weeks or months for a skill to train. I love everything else about EVE.
We passed version 2 a long time ago, we're currently on version 8 and a bit.

The fact that skills train in real time is a draw for many, not a deterrent. Unlike pretty much every other game out there your skills still improve when you're not logged in.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#653 - 2014-10-30 15:20:43 UTC
Fabio Suave wrote:
I don't like the time-based skill system. Instead I wish we all got X number of skill points, and we could drop 1-5 points into any skills we wanted.

Maybe it's an idea for EVE 2? I just hate waiting weeks or months for a skill to train. I love everything else about EVE.


No
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#654 - 2014-10-30 15:27:41 UTC
Wait with unlimited skill queue all we need to do is remove learning implants.

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Fabio Suave
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#655 - 2014-10-30 15:49:22 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Fabio Suave wrote:
I don't like the time-based skill system. Instead I wish we all got X number of skill points, and we could drop 1-5 points into any skills we wanted.

Maybe it's an idea for EVE 2? I just hate waiting weeks or months for a skill to train. I love everything else about EVE.
We passed version 2 a long time ago, we're currently on Version: 8 and a bit.

The fact that skills train in real time is a draw for many, not a deterrent. Unlike pretty much every other game out there your skills still improve when you're not logged in.


Your skills train while your logged off, sure. But it's like the exercise wheel in a hamster cage - it doesn't take you where you want to go. My main character is years old and still can't fly ships I want. With a point-based system like I described you could just respec your skills and instantly be able to fly a new ship. It's a better system, IMO. They could even charge a small fee for extra respec points and get extra money from people like me that want to jump around and try out new setups all the time.

I started shortly before Incarna and now that I am sitting on all these skill points I can't look back and say "Yeah. All those years were worth it. I sure did a good job waiting all that time." The hamster wheel just keeps turning. I would rather grind the ISK for my new ships and have the instant satisfaction of being able to drop my skill points intodifferent skills. The current system where you grind skill points and can get instant ISK from plex is completely back-asswards.

Anyways, rant over. I don't want to start an argument, I'm just venting.
R0mparkin
Th3 Illuminati
#656 - 2014-10-30 15:54:36 UTC
simplest terms whats wrong? EvE hasn't gone F2P yet!!!!! Once EvE goes F2P ccp will see cash rev go up 100%
R0mparkin
Th3 Illuminati
#657 - 2014-10-30 15:59:35 UTC
La Nariz wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
La Nariz wrote:
Enable awoxing for NPC corporations only, and make CONCORD not respond to violence against <10 man corporations. All of EVE' problems solved in two changes.


Oh yes because nothing would be better for Eve than the creation of 10 man alt corps or forcing everyone into the blue donut. The playerbase has spoken - their response to awoxxing is to stay in NPC corps...they don't like the mechanic. That is what is motivating CCP, not the fact that awoxxing is claiming victims, but the fact that highsecers are responding en masse by just avoiding the entire corporation system because of it.


It would improve a lot of things and give an incentive to get out of npc corps. It adds easily mitigated risk. You also need to provide proof that people stay in npc corps because of awoxing.

CCP is repeating history right now and we know how popular incarna was.


i will confirm it. i stay out of corps because of it.
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#658 - 2014-10-30 16:10:01 UTC
R0mparkin wrote:
La Nariz wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
La Nariz wrote:
Enable awoxing for NPC corporations only, and make CONCORD not respond to violence against <10 man corporations. All of EVE' problems solved in two changes.


Oh yes because nothing would be better for Eve than the creation of 10 man alt corps or forcing everyone into the blue donut. The playerbase has spoken - their response to awoxxing is to stay in NPC corps...they don't like the mechanic. That is what is motivating CCP, not the fact that awoxxing is claiming victims, but the fact that highsecers are responding en masse by just avoiding the entire corporation system because of it.


It would improve a lot of things and give an incentive to get out of npc corps. It adds easily mitigated risk. You also need to provide proof that people stay in npc corps because of awoxing.

CCP is repeating history right now and we know how popular incarna was.


i will confirm it. i stay out of corps because of it.


Now get a couple thousand more people's opinion and do some statistics and we might have something.

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IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#659 - 2014-10-31 05:05:14 UTC
Fabio Suave wrote:
I don't like the time-based skill system. Instead I wish we all got X number of skill points, and we could drop 1-5 points into any skills we wanted.

Maybe it's an idea for EVE 2? I just hate waiting weeks or months for a skill to train. I love everything else about EVE.


What you want is a space game based on the WoW system... I'm not saying it wouldn't be popular but this isn't Eve.
Shizuken
Venerated Stars
#660 - 2014-10-31 19:34:36 UTC
Aeon Plex wrote:

Ask yourself though, when the majority of people that come into this game as newbies get treated like crap, (I have been treated like crap plenty more times than this in EVE) and for no reason, and leave, can you blame them? And can you see any future in a game like that? Any real value?

Whatever, I'll buy another ship, but how much longer can a game like this really last? I've talked with ppl on TS about this, and they are just as worried about the serious lack of new blood in EVE.


Amen to this. There really should be severe consequences to all fighting in highsec, more than just a loss of a ship. and an insignificant sec status drop. Wardecs need to go bye bye too. They are the equivalent to the government allowing criminal activity against others for no reason at all. In either context it is an affront to fundamental fairness and civility. If you want to fight people take your bullshit to low/null sec. Allowing that boorishness in highsec to go unpunshed is what turns people off from this game.