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plex prices...

First post First post
Author
Odelll
Project Valhalla.
The Initiative.
#61 - 2014-10-22 08:30:16 UTC
PLEX - allowed players like myself to grind isk on another persons behalf and be paid with in game time. When the price of plex becomes too expensive, the active players ratting/mining/grinding declines. The more I personally have to invest in gaining PLEX the less time I spend Roaming and in fleets.

People that purchase PLEX do so because they do not want to play the game. They employ another player to play for them. If you have the money and lack the time this is perfect, it means you can focus on the aspects of the game you enjoy.

People that grind for PLEX do so because they have the time to invest in playing the game. They generate ISK in their day to day activities and giving some of that earned ISK away means they can be paid for their time invested in playing the game.

One type of player cannot exist without the other, as the price of plex increases the amount I'm left with to play the game decreases. an example per hourly income from ratting is 60m per hour.

If plexes hit 1 billion
and I earn 60m/hr anom grinding
thats 33.3 hours of play a month dedicated to PLEX

33.3 hours for essentially $15 is unpractical, its too much for too little, so why PLEX? why not purchase a sub? or quit all together? right?

If that happens, two things are going to be effected;

1. The people who rely on the money generated by selling PLEX will find it takes longer to sell plexes as less people use them.

2. The economy of the markets suffer as less people are generating isk internally. Items from DED sites, hacking and relic sites, faction rewards all become more expensive because less people are running missions and/or grind isk. Also that means less targets for roaming/ganking and more empty space in null.

And I know some of you are going to say that 60m per hour is too low, that you personally can make 100m, 300m, 500m an hour but they are all niche corners of the game that are not open to every player. The average nullsec dweller can make 60-100m per hour running anoms so that is what I used in my example.

TLDR; Higher plex prices = Less ingame activity
Ria Nieyli
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#62 - 2014-10-22 08:56:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Ria Nieyli
Summer Isle wrote:
Ria Nieyli wrote:
Erin Crawford wrote:
For those who don't have the time to grid endlessly to generate enough isk to buy PLEX, and instead do so using RL cash, these increasingly higher PLEX cost are perfect: more bang for your hard-earned buck!


It's funny because the higher PLEX price goes, the less PLEX is seeded into the market by players, accelerating the price climb.

You have that backwards. The higher the price of PLEX, the more likely it is to be seeded, because people are going to be getting more ISK for their money.


If I seed 1 plex, I can buy a Vindicator + some modules at the current prices. If PLEX was still 600m, I'd need to seed 2. So no, I don't have it backwards, you do. Your assumption that people that are currently not spending $ on PLEX will start is false. The people who would use $-to-PLEX to fund themselves already do, and the higher price is a quality of life improvement for them, no doubt, but it restricts the supply of PLEX nonetheless.
Ria Nieyli
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#63 - 2014-10-22 09:10:36 UTC
Odelll wrote:
1. The people who rely on the money generated by selling PLEX will find it takes longer to sell plexes as less people use them.


This is wrong. If you don't use a PLEX for your account this month, somebody else will, since the supply is restricted. Unsubbing will literally do nothing besides removing you specifically from the market landscape, and if you make less than 850m/month currently, you're not even a blip on the map.
Arronicus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#64 - 2014-10-22 09:20:04 UTC
Jandice Ymladris wrote:
Arronicus wrote:
Jandice Ymladris wrote:
Serenity PLEX price is 3.6 Billion isk, make of that what you will. Now keep in mind their economy is a based around very high levels of botting activity, which the company that runs the game turns a blind eye to, creating a completely different sort of economy of which we cannot in any reasonable fashion, compare Tranquility to. --This quoted was edited by Arronicus, disorting original intent--


FTFY.



I don't appreciate the editing of that quote, making it appear I wrote that instead of you.


Now onward to PLEX prices. A lower PLEX price means less people sell it on market folks, a high price means more people sell it on market. That's the short of it, but i'ts not that simple.

If you check market histories, you'll notice that PLEX trade volume has lowered(!) since last year. So less PLEX traded! As PLEX got more useful this year (simultaneous skill qeues on alts!) the only logical outcome of that is a rise of prices!
You want cheaper PLEX? Convince more people to sell PLEX on the market AND convince them to keep doing it when PLEX prices drop.


I edited the quoted section because it lacked significantly important detail. There's nothing misleading about it, as FTFY means fixed that for you, and is posted after editing what someone else said.

As for the value of plex, you are missing half of the equation. Plex prices are directly influenced by investment purchasing, where it continues to rise because people stockpile plex. Plex has been the one reliable investment that almost everyone knows about, which continues to rise in price every year. The amount that it rises waxes and wanes throughout the year in some form of pattern, but plex sales have proven that an increase in the amount of plex sold does not result in a meaningful drop in the market price, just more dumped at the current median that gets eagerly grabbed up by people wanting to bank more of it.

If you really want plex prices to crash, a) convince people to cash out on their large plex stockpiles (Good luck with that), or b) convince CCP to freeze the price, and tie any price increase to true eve inflation (plex investors would lose no money as the value of their plex would rise in accordance with the devaluation of isk). Though, again, good luck with that.

Which leaves you with option c) Find additional ways for your account to passively pay for itself, or don't plex if it's getting too expensive for you.
Mithandra
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#65 - 2014-10-22 10:18:10 UTC
I've contacted the Vatican, but they tell me that exorcising this particular topic is beyond their capabilities

Eve is the dark haired, totally hot emo gothchild of the gaming community

Erin Crawford
#66 - 2014-10-22 10:40:40 UTC
Mithandra wrote:
I've contacted the Vatican, but they tell me that exorcising this particular topic is beyond their capabilities

Would be a perfect spot to make a comment about Grrr Goons, the Vatican and PLEX prices...
But, i shall refrain.
Roll

"Those who talk don’t know. Those who know don’t talk. "

Steve WingYip
Doomheim
#67 - 2014-10-22 10:44:20 UTC
High plex prices are a good thing for people like me for example. Plex prices are getting high because people are not buying enough and there is a lot of ISK. Prices are high enough where buying them for isk seems worth it and more get purchased and it then reverses around. Pretty simple eh? :)

(I could be wrong here but that's how I see it)
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
#68 - 2014-10-22 11:45:10 UTC
Steve WingYip wrote:
Plex prices are getting high because people are not buying enough and there is a lot of ISK.


Supply and demand:

When demand goes up price goes up. When supply goes down price goes up.

Inversely:

When demand does down price goes down. When supply goes up price goes down.

Not today spaghetti.

Odelll
Project Valhalla.
The Initiative.
#69 - 2014-10-22 12:41:59 UTC
Ria Nieyli wrote:
Summer Isle wrote:
Ria Nieyli wrote:
Erin Crawford wrote:
For those who don't have the time to grid endlessly to generate enough isk to buy PLEX, and instead do so using RL cash, these increasingly higher PLEX cost are perfect: more bang for your hard-earned buck!


It's funny because the higher PLEX price goes, the less PLEX is seeded into the market by players, accelerating the price climb.

You have that backwards. The higher the price of PLEX, the more likely it is to be seeded, because people are going to be getting more ISK for their money.


If I seed 1 plex, I can buy a Vindicator + some modules at the current prices. If PLEX was still 600m, I'd need to seed 2. So no, I don't have it backwards, you do. Your assumption that people that are currently not spending $ on PLEX will start is false. The people who would use $-to-PLEX to fund themselves already do, and the higher price is a quality of life improvement for them, no doubt, but it restricts the supply of PLEX nonetheless.


Individually yes, however I represent a play style. What creates demand for PLEX is its use. If the price goes up to a level which makes me switch to subs, demand decreases as people switch from using plex to subbing/quitting.

I'm not talking about just me here, I'm talking about 1000's of players who purchase gametime via plex right now.
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#70 - 2014-10-22 13:48:16 UTC
In economic theory there is something called Giffen good. These are goods which have a reversed demand curve. That is, an increase in price results in an increase in demand. It is possible that the PLEX is a Giffen good. To see how this could be, first let me recast what I mean by "the price of the PLEX".

Consider how much Real Money (RM) I need to buy, say, 10 billion ISK via PLEX. As the ISK price of the PLEX increases, the price, in RM, of ISK is decreasing. I need to buy fewer PLEX to get 10 billion ISK. Normally one would expect this to increase the demand for ISK obtained via PLEX. As the RM cost of 10 billion ISK drops, more players will opt to make the purchase. But if the PLEX is a Giffen good, then the reverse happens. The mechanism may be:

The number of people who would want a supercap is limited by the number of characters who have skills to fly them, not the super's price. Dropping the price of supers will have only a small effect on their demand. (I'm assuming a player does not want spare supers sitting about, they want most every one logged off in space with a pilot sitting in it.)

A player with little ISK can buy a super by using Real Money to buy PLEX, selling the PLEX for ISK and buying the super. As the ISK value of a PLEX increases, the number of PLEX the player need buy goes down. Increased ISK price leads to reduced supply. (Or, to put it another way, the decreasing price of ISK leads to decreasing demand for PLEX). This makes the PLEX a Giffen good.

A numerical example:

Say the ISK price of the PLEX increases by 10%. Any player deciding to make a big purchase now needs to buy 10% fewer PLEX. Lets say as a result of the better price, 5% more players decide to make such a purchase. Yes, the total players buying PLEX increases, but as each now buys fewer PLEX, the total demand goes down. Again, we have a Giffen good.

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Dominique Vasilkovsky
#71 - 2014-10-22 14:15:21 UTC
I'm PLEXed until January 2020 so no worry about PLEX prices here.
ISD LackOfFaith
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
#72 - 2014-10-22 14:35:39 UTC
Quote:
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