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Walmart Carebears Need to HTFU
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Sir Substance

Sebiestor Tribe

Minmatar Republic

Likes received: 689

#21 - 2011-11-28 10:45:17 UTC

Alara IonStorm wrote:

Pass them out like candy and if someone decides to make you rub your eyes for a little while without good reason they have 5 years to reflect on why it was a bad idea.

Would you care to make a small wager on the outcome of the situation then?

If she gets any real jail-time, I'll give you 10 mil.

If she gets a suspended sentence, a fine over $10,000USD, or some other sentence that could be construed as reasonable for aggravated assault with a weapon I'll give you five.

If she gets off with the proverbial slap on the wrist (community service, a fine less then $10,000USD, basically anything that's inappropriate for aggravated assault with a weapon), you give me 5 mil.

If it doesn't get as far as court, you give me 10.

Sound fun?

Because, as I put my money where my mouth is, I bet she doesn't get 5 years.

The beatings will continue until posting improves. -Magnus Cortex

Official Eve Online changelist: Togglable PvP. - Jordanna Bauer

Alara IonStorm

Likes received: 5,477

#22 - 2011-11-28 10:50:57 UTC | Edited by: Alara IonStorm

Sir Substance wrote:

That does not make your point. It just shows how weak their legal system is.

But sure why not. I am poor right now because all my cash is in Combat Ships but if you win I will pay up even if it takes a week. I will run a mission or sell one of them or something.

VKhaun Vex

Viziam

Amarr Empire

Likes received: 331

#23 - 2011-11-28 10:53:12 UTC | Edited by: VKhaun Vex

She wouldn't be knocking them out, no... but the five tough guys would be in front of the line and she'd be at the back.

In a world with no weapons, the biggest meanest toughest people win.
In a world with weapons, the most committed wins.

Personally, I prefer the latter and it's drawbacks are largely tempered by less-than-lethal options like pepper spray. I'm suddenly surprised that I don't own any weapons... Need to get myself a few Christmas presents this year.

Charges Twilight fans with Ka-bar -Surfin's PlunderBunny LIIIIIIIIIIINNEEEEE PIIIEEEECCCCEEE!!!!!!! -Taedrin Using relativity to irrational numbers is smart -rodyas I no longer believe we landed on the moon. -Atticus Fynch

Sir Substance

Sebiestor Tribe

Minmatar Republic

Likes received: 689

#24 - 2011-11-28 10:53:26 UTC

Alara IonStorm wrote:

Then its a bet!

The point IS to show how weak the legal system is though. Its no good justifying handing out weapons on the basis that people wont misuse them due to the penalties of doing so, if the penalties are never applied.

The beatings will continue until posting improves. -Magnus Cortex

Official Eve Online changelist: Togglable PvP. - Jordanna Bauer

Alara IonStorm

Likes received: 5,477

#25 - 2011-11-28 11:06:27 UTC

Sir Substance wrote:

Its no good justifying handing out weapons on the basis that people wont misuse them due to the penalties of doing so, if the penalties are never applied.

Better then the Lethal Weapons already being used.

As I said, I would rather rub my eyes then be holding my guts in after being stabbed, just like I would rather my attacker be rubbing his eyes rather then be holding my guts in after being stabbed.

It is not dangerous compared to Baseball Bats and Knives that are sold legally and will save lives not end them. In my book worth it.

Endeavour Starfleet

Likes received: 968

#26 - 2011-11-28 11:33:25 UTC

I don't have much hope they will do anything meaningful as far as a criminal sentence. However, I suspect the civil suits will be quite severe.

Yet the civil suits are not the main thing that discourages this kind of crap. Abuse of a defensive weapon must be punished by jail time and a big one because it becomes second nature to these people to abuse it " 'cause it w0nt kill em!"

Officers sometimes face severe penalties for abuse of tasers and other "less lethal" weapons. If civilians don't get jail time for doing the same it is silly to expect an officer facing danger to go instead.

Sir Substance

Sebiestor Tribe

Minmatar Republic

Likes received: 689

#27 - 2011-11-28 12:05:09 UTC | Edited by: Sir Substance

Alara IonStorm wrote:

Better then the Lethal Weapons already being used.

No, its no better.

Look what it did. A perfectly ordinary woman went crazy and shot people in the face with a chemical deliberately designed to inflict pain and suffering.

There are international laws specifically outlawing laser based weapons designed to cause blindness, temporary or permanent, and any form of chamical warfare will land you with charges of war crimes. Torture is illegal in every civilized nation in the world, and if I were to throw boiling water in your face I'd be jailed.

But because its been "designed not to cause lasting damage", which it doesn't always succeed at, its ok to put it in the hands of untrained personel?

What if I were to start using pepper spray for muggings? Would your tune change?

The beatings will continue until posting improves. -Magnus Cortex

Official Eve Online changelist: Togglable PvP. - Jordanna Bauer

Alara IonStorm

Likes received: 5,477

#28 - 2011-11-28 12:14:31 UTC | Edited by: Alara IonStorm

Sir Substance wrote:

No, its no better.

Look what it did. A perfectly ordinary woman went crazy and shot people in the face with a chemical deliberately designed to inflict pain and suffering.

It did nothing, she did. Lucky it was pepper spray rather then a knife.

Sir Substance wrote:

There are international laws specifically outlawing laser based weapons designed to cause blindness, temporary or permanent, and any form of chamical warfare will land you with charges of war crimes. Torture is illegal in every civilized nation in the world, and if I were to throw boiling water in your face I'd be jailed.

Lasers are outlawed because they cause permanent blindness and boiling water causes disfigurement so there is no connection.

You are mistaking legal with it's Ok to use. It isn't, it is only to save your life anything else is a crime. A Crime that would happen with or without a law.

Sir Substance wrote:

But because its been "designed not to cause lasting damage", which it doesn't always succeed at, its ok to put it in the hands of untrained personel?

Why do you assume over the counter sales. There should be a training course and your name goes in a registry if you own it just like guns.

Sir Substance wrote:

What if I were to start using pepper spray for muggings? Would your tune change?

Not that you would not use it anyway if there was a law...

Absolutely use Pepper Spray. Better then dying of a Stab wound.

Sir Substance

Sebiestor Tribe

Minmatar Republic

Likes received: 689

#29 - 2011-11-28 13:42:57 UTC

Alara IonStorm wrote:

Sir Substance wrote:

No, its no better.

Look what it did. A perfectly ordinary woman went crazy and shot people in the face with a chemical deliberately designed to inflict pain and suffering.

It did nothing, she did. Lucky it was pepper spray rather then a knife.

So if she had had no weapon at all, she would have punched everyone in the face instead?

The beatings will continue until posting improves. -Magnus Cortex

Official Eve Online changelist: Togglable PvP. - Jordanna Bauer

Alara IonStorm

Likes received: 5,477

#30 - 2011-11-28 13:56:30 UTC

Sir Substance wrote:

So if she had had no weapon at all, she would have punched everyone in the face instead?

Or a Gun or a Knife.

Honestly if your gonna hurt people it does not matter what the law says or if the weapon is legal.

Putting Non Lethal Weapons into the hands of the potential victims will save lives. If bad guys use them instead of dangerous weapons well that is just a plain out BONUS.

Sir Substance

Sebiestor Tribe

Minmatar Republic

Likes received: 689

#31 - 2011-11-28 13:57:41 UTC

Alara IonStorm wrote:

Sir Substance wrote:

So if she had had no weapon at all, she would have punched everyone in the face instead?

Or a Gun or a Knife.

Honestly if your gonna hurt people it does not matter what the law says or if the weapon is legal.

What if she had NO WEAPONS?

None.

The beatings will continue until posting improves. -Magnus Cortex

Official Eve Online changelist: Togglable PvP. - Jordanna Bauer


Alara IonStorm Likes received: 5,477	#32 - 2011-11-28 14:09:42 UTC 1 Sir Substance wrote: What if she had NO WEAPONS? None. Then she would have committed no crime and therefor not been a criminal. Since she was a criminal she brought one. Join me in Thanking God it was a Non Lethal one like Pepper Spray.

Astrid Stjerna

Sebiestor Tribe

Likes received: 818

#33 - 2011-11-28 17:13:13 UTC

VKhaun Vex wrote:

No. If you take that as 'lethal' then everything on earth is lethal. There is nothing you can name that hasn't or couldn't have killed someone with sufficient quantity and/or in some circumstance. Teddy bears are lethal. Flowers are lethal. Toys, candy, video games, forum posts are lethal, even sex is lethal by that rational.

The word would literally have no meaning, because it would apply to anything and it has no unit of measurement.

Pepper spray is not lethal.
Don't be thick about it.

Don't be rude. Pepper spray has verifiably caused dangerous allergic reactions in some people with asthma.

Quote:

Cases of death from pepper spray have been reported as asthmatics suffer from anaphylactic shock from pepper spray.

(source: http://www.targetwoman.com/articles/pepper-spray.html)

Quote:

In rare cases, pepper spray can cause life-threatening anaphylactic shock

(source: http://www.livestrong.com/article/288402-how-to-remove-pepper-spray-from-the-body/)

I can't get rid of my darn signature! Oh, wait....

Sir Substance

Sebiestor Tribe

Minmatar Republic

Likes received: 689

#34 - 2011-11-28 20:56:09 UTC

Alara IonStorm wrote:

Sir Substance wrote:

What if she had NO WEAPONS?

None.

Then she would have committed no crime and therefor not been a criminal. Since she was a criminal she brought one.

Punching people in the face is a crime. Or do you agree that, had she had no weapons, she would not have assaulted people?

The beatings will continue until posting improves. -Magnus Cortex

Official Eve Online changelist: Togglable PvP. - Jordanna Bauer

1,080
Selinate Likes received: 1,080	#35 - 2011-11-28 20:57:49 UTC 1 This is why I try to go shopping in the middle of a week day, almost guaranteed no hassling... On a separate note, no, cracked.com is not a respectable source to prove that Black Friday isn't as bad as it seems. Every year, it is a suck fest of suck, no matter which way you want to try and spin it.

Jhagiti Tyran

Caldari Provisions

Caldari State

Likes received: 290

#36 - 2011-11-28 21:14:54 UTC

Astrid Stjerna wrote:

VKhaun Vex wrote:

Don't be rude. Pepper spray has verifiably caused dangerous allergic reactions in some people with asthma.

Quote:

Cases of death from pepper spray have been reported as asthmatics suffer from anaphylactic shock from pepper spray.

(source: http://www.targetwoman.com/articles/pepper-spray.html)

Quote:

In rare cases, pepper spray can cause life-threatening anaphylactic shock

(source: http://www.livestrong.com/article/288402-how-to-remove-pepper-spray-from-the-body/)

People tend to call things like Tasers and irritant sprays "non lethal" when the correct definition is "less lethal". Although on saying that somebody can usually worse injury's with just their fists than pepper or CS sprays usually cause.

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