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Dev Blog: Long-Distance Travel Changes Inbound

First post First post First post
Author
Demeter Corinth
The Corinth Clan
Effort.
#8121 - 2014-11-05 22:59:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Demeter Corinth
I have never seen a whinier bunch of complainers (even on these forums) than on this Threadnought.

"Oh I don't get to move my capitals across the galaxy in 3 minutes flat, time to unsub"

"Oh I don't get to easily fuel 100 POS' all by myself with little to no risk, time to unsub"

"Oh I don't get to instantly converge with everyone else in my region on top of a ratting frigate via jump bridge, time to unsub"

"Oh I don't get to drop 150 capitals on top of a ratting frigate from a radius equal to 1/8 the galaxy, time to unsub"

These are EXACTLY the reasons the changes needed to be done. People are complacent, people have become lazy, people have been able to sit in a station and 'wait' for a hunter to find something, then pounce. Alliances of a thousand people have been able to logistically maintain bridge and POS fuel due to the actions of 3 or 4 logistics experts. Ridiculous.

Capital hot drops from a quarter of the galaxy, ridiculous.

For the first time in a long time, I can bring out my shinier ships without having to worry that hungry carriers from who knows where will drop on it en masse, and that black ops won't drop as...willingly without the typical carrier support.

For the smaller corporations, the newer players, the low sec roamers, the aspiring null bears, haters of the blue donut, and industrialists looking to make a foray into low sec and null sec ninja mining, this patch is for YOU.

To those players who have, in vast minority, held a stranglehold on all of the aforementioned folks, I have no empathy. The playstyles of old have caused 'more' unsub activity than all of you whiners and your alts combined. 'Adapt, Die, or Leave.'

And CCP, keep deploying patches like this, and I'll expand my 10 accounts to 15. I'm sure other players (your majority) will get alts as well, knowing they can actually 'accomplish' something in the game now.

-D
Paulie Bananas
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#8122 - 2014-11-05 23:15:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Paulie Bananas
Demeter Corinth wrote:
I have never seen a whinier bunch of complainers (even on these forums) than on this Threadnought.

-D

Well then, you missed that last threadnought on this subject which was much worse. Understandably so too...
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#8123 - 2014-11-06 05:15:01 UTC
Paulie Bananas wrote:
Demeter Corinth wrote:
I have never seen a whinier bunch of complainers (even on these forums) than on this Threadnought.

-D

Well then, you missed that last threadnought on this subject which was much worse. Understandably so too...

You mean this one?
Sbrodor
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#8124 - 2014-11-06 19:06:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Sbrodor
Xartahez wrote:
I may be throwing in the towel as well here..

I have a family at home. I play Eve on the short time I get to myself, living in 0.0 it suited me well. However, with these changes, I don't have enough time to play. The time I have spent waiting on jump timers since yesterday killed my game time and it wasn't worth even logging in.

As it stands now, it appears I will have to leave my 0.0 corp, sell off my capitols and live in NPC space, if I want to continue playing on Eve as a outlet to relax after a rough day..

Very disappointed today...


THE JB nerf is killing and force to quit a lot of people.

i think u focused exactly the point.

We are 40-60 real people and 150 man corp most of the are over 30-40 year with child and family.

In defensive roam the time to reship,
to go back in staging system when need to logout,
the time needed to reach the fleet once login,
the time needed to reship after a loss,
the time needed reach hostile

is ENORMUOUS longer.

it mean we are in action many minutes later after login and we need to route back home many many minutes before end of evening.

CCP need to think about the start up and stand down time, the JB fatigue kills our gameplay in normal roam defensive.

In a moment when a lot of player enjoy try something more direct, more action (like World of tanks), i think make longer the time to start some action is think is a suicide.

i think everyone of us will make many many more night without any single kill, this is painful.

i did ove 6k kills and my corp over 36.000 kills almost all in small gang or in SIG, my alarm level is high at moment for the future.
Desdicado
Oberon Incorporated
Fedaykin.
#8125 - 2014-11-06 21:53:35 UTC
I'm already struggeling to find the time to play eve as it requires alot of hours when you like me love the hugh fights and care nothing for small gang pvp.

This patch has rendered this game almost unplayable for me as I need to risk my assets alot more because now I have an even bigger time issue then before seeing as jump bridges/capitals have been nerfed to hell. Not only did you change the jump range but also the jump fatigue...adding both of these is in my opinion a fix to a problem you have whit a few players ingame.
We choosed to live in 0,0, we choosed the lifestyle as it was possible to move around whit some safety using carriers...all CCP is doing right now is focusing on reducing and removing gameplay ideas players come up whit these days. You have already nerfed jump bridges/capitals several times before and now you're doing it again...why does CCP hate the 0,0 lifestyle?

I'm struggeling to find the motivation to play atm so if CCP is gonna try thier best to INCREASE the time for traveling then I simply might have to abandon this game for good.

I don't care about players using "deathclones" or capitals to move across eve universe in a few minutes if the result is they are enjoying the game and haveing fun...it's when someone is trying to police everything by nerfing/removing how the game is played from month to month that it gets confusing, irritating and frustration. I have read what you think will happen...I disagre...this game is dying and you just increased the speed to the end.
Sbrodor
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#8126 - 2014-11-07 06:19:52 UTC
just to take a real life example yesterday we had fight of provi vs PL and nc.
after some brawling the time needed to reship (in staging) take so much time and i seen watch list (red and blue) dropping after like 20 min waiting reship from both sides.
the time was so much long and both side don't want to fight anymore after over half hour.

apply fatigue to JB is a headshot for subcap pvp. Everyone enjoy reship fast and go quick in the hearth of action in the few place where it take place, half our from one round to next is too much long.
JC Anderson
RED ROSE THORN
#8127 - 2014-11-07 09:58:45 UTC  |  Edited by: JC Anderson
Sbrodor wrote:
just to take a real life example yesterday we had fight of provi vs PL and nc.
after some brawling the time needed to reship (in staging) take so much time and i seen watch list (red and blue) dropping after like 20 min waiting reship from both sides.
the time was so much long and both side don't want to fight anymore after over half hour.

apply fatigue to JB is a headshot for subcap pvp. Everyone enjoy reship fast and go quick in the hearth of action in the few place where it take place, half our from one round to next is too much long.


I am not saying I agree with it, but just pointing out that I believe this is one of the intentional goals that CCP had in mind.

They have said many times since these changes were first announced that they wanted to reduce the amount of large scale fights in the game and instead encourage small fleet vs fleet action.

Imho this also might very well mean that they want to make it a lot more difficult to reship and return to a fight after blowing up. From the impression I get when reading certain posts by greyscale, the idea is for these skirmishes to end once one side either gets blown up or retreats, without the option of people being able to continually reship and return to fight again right off the bat.
Quadima
HyperDreams Studios
#8128 - 2014-11-07 10:01:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Quadima
Not in null right now due to RL issues, but I agree on "Fatigue on Jump Bridge" being dumb.

This was supposed to be a capital force projection nerf applied to those big blobs of carriers, supercarriers and titans which could attack or defend sov at will at any given time.

Why is it applying to tiny frigs going through a JB? Makes no sense.
JBs are expensive PLAYER OWNED GATES. Not capital jump drives ...
Sbrodor
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#8129 - 2014-11-07 11:03:13 UTC
JC Anderson wrote:
Sbrodor wrote:
just to take a real life example yesterday we had fight of provi vs PL and nc.
after some brawling the time needed to reship (in staging) take so much time and i seen watch list (red and blue) dropping after like 20 min waiting reship from both sides.
the time was so much long and both side don't want to fight anymore after over half hour.

apply fatigue to JB is a headshot for subcap pvp. Everyone enjoy reship fast and go quick in the hearth of action in the few place where it take place, half our from one round to next is too much long.


I am not saying I agree with it, but just pointing out that I believe this is one of the intentional goals that CCP had in mind.

They have said many times since these changes were first announced that they wanted to reduce the amount of large scale fights in the game and instead encourage small fleet vs fleet action.

Imho this also might very well mean that they want to make it a lot more difficult to reship and return to a fight after blowing up. From the impression I get when reading certain posts by greyscale, the idea is for these skirmishes to end once one side either gets blown up or retreats, without the option of people being able to continually reship and return to fight again right off the bat.



if it "works as intended" the problem is a unluck 1st° primary or maybe one of the 1st casualty on the field have the unluck to have formupped for long minuts, then did only few second of action, then long time for logoff in staging...

if it is the new way to give some action and pleasure to play is awful.
Laughable Xhosa Girl
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#8130 - 2014-11-07 16:37:43 UTC
yo Greyscale whats up with this hateboner you've had for jump bridges for like 7 years you should probably see a physician
Antihrist Pripravnik
Scorpion Road Industry
#8131 - 2014-11-07 22:19:39 UTC
Quadima wrote:
Not in null right now due to RL issues, but I agree on "Fatigue on Jump Bridge" being dumb.

This was supposed to be a capital force projection nerf applied to those big blobs of carriers, supercarriers and titans which could attack or defend sov at will at any given time.

Why is it applying to tiny frigs going through a JB? Makes no sense.
JBs are expensive PLAYER OWNED GATES. Not capital jump drives ...


Tiny frigs? You mean alpha Maelstrom fleets.
Ned Black
Driders
#8132 - 2014-11-08 06:30:33 UTC
Desdicado wrote:
... We choosed to live in 0,0, we choosed the lifestyle as it was possible to move around whit some safety using carriers...all CCP is doing right now is focusing on reducing and removing gameplay ideas players come up whit these days. You have already nerfed jump bridges/capitals several times before and now you're doing it again...why does CCP hate the 0,0 lifestyle?


And here I thought you guys choose null because it was dangerous and because you were badas*es. I guess I was wrong...

Sbrodor wrote:
just to take a real life example yesterday we had fight of provi vs PL and nc.
after some brawling the time needed to reship (in staging) take so much time and i seen watch list (red and blue) dropping after like 20 min waiting reship from both sides.
the time was so much long and both side don't want to fight anymore after over half hour.

apply fatigue to JB is a headshot for subcap pvp. Everyone enjoy reship fast and go quick in the hearth of action in the few place where it take place, half our from one round to next is too much long.


That is EXACTLY why these changes were needed.

Before the patch killing someone from the either side had somewhere between zero and no effect. They were back in the fight within minutes. I remember when our WH allians went on a fun roam. The locals jumped us of course and we basicly beat them with a stick... only they returned time and time again, and in the end we went down in flames... as was intended.

Now suddenly you and every pilot out there counts becasue if you do get killed your side will feel the loss a lot more. If that would have been the case in our fight there would have been a decisive victory for us.

These changes will force a lot of new tactics instead of the regular mindless slugfests that most fleet fights are.
Sbrodor
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#8133 - 2014-11-08 13:09:57 UTC
eve was already a slow game. can u tell me how many SECOND blink your guns icon in a evening of roam? in a normal evening your guns cycle for few minuts in a evening.

not allowing reship and moving in your 0.0 (JB) maybe the guns can blink few second every couple of days... power projection was not against titan and super? why nerf a defensive assault frig gang?
Vipieris
Fraternal Order of Raddei
#8134 - 2014-11-08 20:13:12 UTC
So, hi,

I quit back in March, and rejoined lately with the "10 free days" promotion.

Probably won't stick around beyond that, but I just have a question:

I've seen these travel change with the Phoebe notes (I still keep a light finger on the pulse of EVE) and was surprised by it, frankly.

So I was asking some old buddies if they knew why these changes were happening, and apparently the idea was to make it more encouraging for "the little guys" to move to 0.0.

If that is the case, then, you know this won't work, right?

Being dropped on by the Goons in 0.0 wasn't the reason I quit living in 0.0 (and it did happen to me once) and ultimately quit playing EVE. It's because 0.0 is so stupidly expensive in regards to in-game currency AND time. The costs of controlling a system and putting a station in 0.0 is so ridiculously expensive that it's incredibly hard for a small group to establish a footprint in 0.0.

Factor in the fact that corps that DO establish themselves in 0.0 have such ludicrous requirements for players to join/play in their sandbox, that it becomes no fun whatsoever for someone to move out there.

I quit when EVE became a part-time job, and this nerf to capitals does nothing to fix that.
Telistra
Wildly Inappropriate
Goonswarm Federation
#8135 - 2014-11-08 22:45:00 UTC
Vipieris wrote:
So, hi,

I quit back in March, and rejoined lately with the "10 free days" promotion.

Probably won't stick around beyond that, but I just have a question:

I've seen these travel change with the Phoebe notes (I still keep a light finger on the pulse of EVE) and was surprised by it, frankly.

So I was asking some old buddies if they knew why these changes were happening, and apparently the idea was to make it more encouraging for "the little guys" to move to 0.0.

If that is the case, then, you know this won't work, right?

Being dropped on by the Goons in 0.0 wasn't the reason I quit living in 0.0 (and it did happen to me once) and ultimately quit playing EVE. It's because 0.0 is so stupidly expensive in regards to in-game currency AND time. The costs of controlling a system and putting a station in 0.0 is so ridiculously expensive that it's incredibly hard for a small group to establish a footprint in 0.0.

Factor in the fact that corps that DO establish themselves in 0.0 have such ludicrous requirements for players to join/play in their sandbox, that it becomes no fun whatsoever for someone to move out there.

I quit when EVE became a part-time job, and this nerf to capitals does nothing to fix that.


I can some what understand this perspective. But remember, the DEVs said if they have to sacrifice some players for the better long term goal, then so be it.

My game play has not changed one bit and its been business as usual. So ill sit here and wait for the intended blow/change this patch was supposed to have on my life in nullsec.

On a side note however; I know a group of n00bies who were getting a start in null, a small 50 man corp. After the patch they suffered and as of today have decided to move back to highsec. They said it was harder now to move goods in and out using the gates since JBs were no longer a viable option. Of course one could say, they need to learn play and adapt, but thats the point they are n00bs...

So if the intent was to make it easier, they sure as hell did not see it...

But again, the patch is nothing new from CCP, not to sure why people expect roses and rainbows...
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#8136 - 2014-11-09 04:49:10 UTC
Telistra wrote:


I can some what understand this perspective. But remember, the DEVs said if they have to sacrifice some players for the better long term goal, then so be it.


Hope they didn't say that. No way to treat your player base and as gaming history has shown the consequences of it always catches up with a developer/publisher eventually.
Bibosikus
Aliastra
#8137 - 2014-11-09 14:21:38 UTC
Demeter Corinth wrote:
I have never seen a whinier bunch of complainers (even on these forums) than on this Threadnought.

..

-D


The longest whinging thread I've ever seen on the Eve forums in 8 years of playing. And it's 99% nullsec tears.

Anyone reading this would think that capitals are the only ships in the game..

Justice is served.

Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.

Laughable Xhosa Girl
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#8138 - 2014-11-10 18:13:17 UTC
huge quality of life changes for industry are implemented = YOU ARE DESTROYING INDUSTRY AND MY NICHE MARKET OF SELLING DRASTICALLY OVERRESEARCHED CRAP FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

gigantic quality of life decrease for most of eve = JUSTICE SERVED

itt we roleplay chihuahuas
Alavaria Fera
Imperial Shipment
#8139 - 2014-11-12 23:41:18 UTC
Sbrodor wrote:
eve was already a slow game. can u tell me how many SECOND blink your guns icon in a evening of roam? in a normal evening your guns cycle for few minuts in a evening.

not allowing reship and moving in your 0.0 (JB) maybe the guns can blink few second every couple of days... power projection was not against titan and super? why nerf a defensive assault frig gang?

You know...

Perhaps this is all to encourage more cycling of guns... when you shoot structures.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Deryk Kyeld
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#8140 - 2014-11-15 08:40:46 UTC
Yay, I managed to rack up 16 days of jump fatigue in my interceptor jumping from GE to HED and back 3 times today. I guess I should have been more careful and kept an eye on my accumulating fatigue.