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Language Chat Channel Consolidation With Oceanus

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Miles Hadah
Tillistrian Enterprises
#21 - 2014-09-23 22:22:25 UTC
Thank you very much for supporting the 'non supported language channels' for this long time. I've meet a lot of new people and helped many many new players that came to this Spanish channel asking for help. It's been a pleasure doing your work for this long, newbies now belong to you again with their doubts in 'non supported languages'.
Ikadz
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#22 - 2014-09-23 22:55:39 UTC
I see it as a really bad move CCP.

Language channels are often the first step for many new players who are not proficient with "Official" languages.

If you took them out, you will enforce those bad issues with new player experience that you said you will try to soften, in a game known for being rough for new players.

Is that what you really want? Many people reach those channels as a salvation and, in many cases, it's the reason why they don't leave the game in the first week. Some also ask why they can't close the rookie channel, because they have no interest in a channel in which they can't communicate.

Don't be so naive, there's many people in this game who can't read nor speak english, french, german or russian.

If you want to lose all those potential new customers, just do it. If not, let us do the rookie help as we are doing now.

Drama in those channels? Sure, just in MOTD put an advice that are a non moderated in language channel, and moderate pics, video, links... things that you don't need to know that language in particular.

Just my point of view.

Yours, Ikadz.
Sierra Payne
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2014-09-23 23:40:56 UTC
It seems CCP has missed the lecture on how to retain new players that don't speak English/French/German/Japanese.
Seraph Essael
Air
The Initiative.
#24 - 2014-09-24 03:35:43 UTC
So players should make their own channels and moderate them themselves. Advertise the channel in the respective forums and get a big player run channel going?

For example, someone stated 300-500 German players in one German chat channel, just band all of them together in another player made channel?

Or am I missing something painfully obvious here What?

Quoted from Doc Fury: "Concerned citizens: Doc seldom plays EVE on the weekends during spring and summer, so you will always be on your own for a couple days a week. Doc spends that time collecting kittens for the on-going sacrifices, engaging in reckless outdoor activities, and speaking in the 3rd person."
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#25 - 2014-09-24 04:51:26 UTC
Samsara Toldya wrote:
CCP Falcon wrote:
...however over the course of the last 12 months or so we have had a rise in the number of complaints regarding politically motivated trolling and inappropriate content being displayed in them.
...
invite you to create your own player run language ... in your native languages if you wish to do so.


Ehm... do I get this right? Politically motivated trolling and inappropriate content won't be CCPs business as long as it happens in channels created by players? Does this include private conversations and Eve-Mail as they are "player run", too?

Otherwise I fail to see how shutting down some channels will reduce complaints.


Not providing a magnet to draw idiots and victims together is a step in the right direction. A few hundred more bans will get the rest of the point across.
Maylin Li
Order of the Red Kestrel
#26 - 2014-09-24 06:02:30 UTC
Seraph Essael wrote:
So players should make their own channels and moderate them themselves. Advertise the channel in the respective forums and get a big player run channel going?

For example, someone stated 300-500 German players in one German chat channel, just band all of them together in another player made channel?

Or am I missing something painfully obvious here What?


Well the only problem is that new players have no idea where to find that channel, you need to know someone to send you there first. As it is now, with it being on an official list, someone who is new to the game can, for example, join the Spanish channel and chat with some Spanish people, without needing the channel name etc...

Would it be possible to make the existing un-official language channels read-only, and create a list of linked player channels in the MOTD?

Or prehaps keep the channels, but make it clear in the MOTD that these channels are not moderated by CCP and that CCP is not responsible for the content in the channels and that discretion is advised, close the channel if you're offended by some guy trolling with political **** etc.
Darkblad
Doomheim
#27 - 2014-09-24 06:15:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Darkblad
Seraph Essael wrote:
So players should make their own channels and moderate them themselves. Advertise the channel in the respective forums and get a big player run channel going?

For example, someone stated 300-500 German players in one German chat channel, just band all of them together in another player made channel?

Or am I missing something painfully obvious here What?
"Official" channnels can be found in the channel list right from the start. Channels created by players are not. It's difficult to reach those players that are new and/or not on the forums or other external ways the community provides information. It's no longer possible to just click the speech bubble in a chat window to find a chat channel where a player's native/preferred language is used.

NPE – ISD – RIP
Yongtau Naskingar
Yongtau Naskingar Corporation
#28 - 2014-09-24 06:16:48 UTC
How is this any different from the trade channels? Blueprints and such are full of trolls too. People just block 'm and move on. Remove those too, then, so we can have player alternatives.

And I really don't get how all of CCP is patting themselves on the back about this. This is a "sorry we can't keep this up" situation not a "woo look at the cool thing we did."
Samsara Toldya
Academy of Contradictory Behaviour
#29 - 2014-09-24 07:59:41 UTC
KIller Wabbit wrote:
[Not providing a magnet to draw idiots and victims together is a step in the right direction. A few hundred more bans will get the rest of the point across.


I can only talk about german channels.
There is a channel called "German"(300-600 players) - a rough place to be for new players, but perfectly "EvE'ish". You love it or leave it.
There is a channel called "German Help (Hilfe)"(400-700 and up to 1000 players whenever there is a steam sale or the days after events like B-R) - we are doing our best to help new players and try to keep "trolls" out.

Closing the "official troll allowed channel" will leave some of the "trolls" homeless and there it is your "magnet to draw idiots and victims together" as many of them will simply move to the help channel. Because why would they join a player run channel where they can get banned/muted whenever the "chief of channel" doesn't like him?

Now some may say: Not a problem at all as the german help channel will be heavyly supported (monitored/moderated) by dozens of ISD/GM/CCP, but in fact the last time I've seen an ISD is >10 weeks ago. Who is going to do those "few hundred more bans"?
I know one ISD, one GM and one CCP who can be seen twice a year - how are they supposed to take care of a channel with 500+ players 24/7?

Just take a look at the "official german sub-forum"... 24+ days without any ISD/GM/CCP action. Oceanus? Never heard of it!

"Official supported"

At least give us a button, something like "Channel could really need some moderation RIGHT NOW!"
Naburi NasNaburi
Doomheim
#30 - 2014-09-24 08:51:07 UTC
Samsara Toldya wrote:


At least give us a button, something like "Channel could really need some moderation RIGHT NOW!"




This...
Solecist Project
#31 - 2014-09-24 09:09:12 UTC
Samsara Toldya wrote:
KIller Wabbit wrote:
[Not providing a magnet to draw idiots and victims together is a step in the right direction. A few hundred more bans will get the rest of the point across.


I can only talk about german channels.
There is a channel called "German"(300-600 players) - a rough place to be for new players, but perfectly "EvE'ish". You love it or leave it.
There is a channel called "German Help (Hilfe)"(400-700 and up to 1000 players whenever there is a steam sale or the days after events like B-R) - we are doing our best to help new players and try to keep "trolls" out.

Closing the "official troll allowed channel" will leave some of the "trolls" homeless and there it is your "magnet to draw idiots and victims together" as many of them will simply move to the help channel. Because why would they join a player run channel where they can get banned/muted whenever the "chief of channel" doesn't like him?

Now some may say: Not a problem at all as the german help channel will be heavyly supported (monitored/moderated) by dozens of ISD/GM/CCP, but in fact the last time I've seen an ISD is >10 weeks ago. Who is going to do those "few hundred more bans"?
I know one ISD, one GM and one CCP who can be seen twice a year - how are they supposed to take care of a channel with 500+ players 24/7?

Just take a look at the "official german sub-forum"... 24+ days without any ISD/GM/CCP action. Oceanus? Never heard of it!

"Official supported"

At least give us a button, something like "Channel could really need some moderation RIGHT NOW!"

Quoting for truth.

CCP is the number one force in trying to ruin their game,
simply by not fighting the people who keep trying it too.

Same goes for rookie corps, tbh.

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
Szczurek
BSX Industries
PanSwarm Federation Please Ignore
#32 - 2014-09-24 09:11:10 UTC
Baaaaaad move.

People who got irritated by trolls can always leave the chat and/or block the trolls.

Now you remove default place to go to talk to your country mates, speaking same language and having the same cultural background for dubious reasons... now they not only have to look for place such as this, but there is high chance they will find some nicely named newbie-bait setup by trolls who will just chat-gank (by e.g, giving wrong advice) newbies and then ban/kick them from chat... yup, indeed an improvement over the "official" channel...

Way to add more obstacles to already problematic new player retention...
Prol1fe
ALTERCO
#33 - 2014-09-24 10:37:12 UTC
really bad news Oops
Rionan Nafee
#34 - 2014-09-24 12:51:58 UTC
I dont see any benefits for the players in this only that the player runned channels are much harder to find for new players and there are no limits for despotism by the channel creators.

I dont see any drawbacks for CCP in keeping the status quo. Currently active moderation is also not existing and harrassment suppot tickets will be created nevertheless is there an official channel or not.

Bad decision, CCP.

Keep at least the channels of supported official languages.
Indahmawar Fazmarai
#35 - 2014-09-24 13:22:17 UTC
Migui X'hyrrn wrote:
Such a shame that spanish being official in more than 20 countries and having more than 500 million of native speakers is not an official language.



I guess we can just struggle to have The True And Only Spanish Channel (All Other 24 True And Only Spanish Channels Are Sh*t)... Roll
Indahmawar Fazmarai
#36 - 2014-09-24 13:30:39 UTC
Migui X'hyrrn wrote:
It is very interesting that pissing off a big portion of the community is seen as "greatest news".


Apparently playing this game as a Spanish speaker was not difficult enough... they only want the bestest noobs, those who can find, not just help in their language, but do it among half a dozen competing channels. Plus the chance of landing on a "troll" channel ruled by some people we know.
Nerriana
Avanto
Hole Control
#37 - 2014-09-24 15:45:20 UTC
This is a bad idea. EvE is a global game (aside Chinese server, but that's another political matter) with international audience. While nearly all players have some command of one of the officially-sanctioned languages, there are many, many players who want to mingle with people from same countries and/or language regions.

Trolling is an unavoidable fact of Internet life. Likewise, unless CCP wants to take the business-unfriendly decision of banning in-game discussions outside four "sanctioned" languages, there will be difficult-to-handle cases of trolling, griefing and so on in languages other than the sanctioned ones.

In short, IMHO this policy archieves nothing while degrading player experience for many. Normal ESRB warnings that online interactions are not rated along CCP warnings that unofficial languages are not supported should be sufficient.
lolcorpholder alt
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#38 - 2014-09-24 15:57:46 UTC  |  Edited by: lolcorpholder alt
If CCP has anyone still in the firm remembering the old times, player moderated national chat channels WERE TRIED BEFORE. This didnt end well, for example, the finnish chat channel moderators started demanding tariffs for posting on said channel (see also: bad messenger).

This also has the effect of driving new people away from the game when they cant find same-cultured people to play with. Am personally against this stuff, instead, expand on the options given to the players already. We have the report isk spammer function which killed isk spamming rather fast. We also have the report bot-function. What is stopping ccp from adding a report harasser-button on national/language specific channels?

Not to forget that these channels house a big part of the culture for the users of said channels. Friday millions from Jepso, Hesbu and his mono/altlogies, blackjack nights at weekends... CCP is throwing all of this culture to waste if this change goes through
Deryn Angrard
Lightning Squad
Snuffed Out
#39 - 2014-09-24 16:08:43 UTC
Language channels are really good for new players, they can easily find a chat channel where they can meet other players and ask questions in their native language making the game easier. This might even lead into a player staying in the game and finding a good corp for them.

If player has to make the channel, the trolling that doesnt really happen will continue, but no new player will ever find those channels and have no way to get help in their tutorials and with whatever they might need help with.
lolcorpholder alt
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#40 - 2014-09-24 16:17:30 UTC
Also, has this been discussed by CSM? Why bring it up only now, just a week before the expansion? Will we be getting a devblog about this?