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Lasers with Recoil.
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Owen Levanth
Sagittarius Unlimited Exploration
#21 - 2014-09-20 20:53:33 UTC
Brixton Jaynara wrote:
I'm just wondering how we all feel about the subject. Some of the Laser modules have a clear recoil animation when firing. As far as my understanding of recoil goes, it occurs from the force of the item leaving the weapon as it fires. With something like light being fired, how realistic is it to have a recoil animation? I personally am against it, and would love others opinions and knowledge on the subject.


Clearly this isn't actually recoil, it's just a mechanism meant to draw the turrets back to help with cooling. Since it's kind of hard to bleed of heat into space, (Not many particles to take of the molecular movement, even in New Eden's weird super dense space.) this mechanism draws the outlying parts of the turrets physically closer to the cooling mechanism, to cool those parts faster and easier.
Grimpak
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#22 - 2014-09-20 23:07:43 UTC
also, piezoelectric laz0rz?

[img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]

[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right
unslaught
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#23 - 2014-09-24 10:22:46 UTC  |  Edited by: unslaught
Serendipity Lost wrote:
I always enjoy these science/physics based discussions. We argue these finer points as to if they are reasonable or not and yet we travel at warp speed from everywhere to everywhere and never question it. AND I think there are more ships inside Jita 4-4 than it can actually hold - no one ever gets upset over that.



i'm been waiting for a realistic warp animation for a while :(... space being compressed on the front - point in front of the ship that 'seems' to suck in the air/vacuum- and expanded at the back of the ship...
Ranamar
Nobody in Local
Of Sound Mind
#24 - 2014-09-24 21:25:25 UTC
Arrogus Advenient wrote:
Zhilia Mann wrote:
While photons lack rest mass, they do have momentum (which obeys the basic relationship p=E/c=h/lambda where p is momentum, E is total energy, c is the speed of light, h is Planck's constant, and lambda is the wavelength of the photon). Since momentum is a conserved quantity in a system it would in fact make some sense that a concentrated beam consisting of a massive number of electrons would result in recoil on some level (even though that would normally be well under the visible threshold). So: assuming lasers in Eve push out enough photons -- sure, there would be macroscopic recoil effects due to conservation of momentum.

As for whether graphics *should* have recoil? Eh. I really don't care.


To expand upon this, a Medium Beam Laser uses 7.22 GJ of energy to fire. Assuming 100% efficiency, the resulting beam of light would carry roughly 24 kg m/s of momentum, about the same as a liter of water moving at 55 mph. Decreases in efficiency would yield corresponding decreases in momentum, with the best modern lasers working at 30% efficiency.

So yes, lasers as powerful as those in eve would produce noticeable recoil.


I have to admit I looked at that and said to myself, "That seems a little weak."

Direct-fire artillery rifles have muzzle velocities of around 1-2000m/s small-caliber (say, 5" or smaller) weapons. To match a velocity of 1-2000m/s with that momentum, your payload is going to be one to two kilos max.
Applying some focused but not-great googling, this tells me that this approximately matches the performance of an anti-tank gun, or maybe a naval destroyer or cruiser main armament at best. Those 200mm autocannons the Minmatar mount? Definitely bigger. Blink

Of course, nobody actually requires the capacitor numbers to actually, y'know, *mean* anything.
SFM Hobb3s
Perkone
Caldari State
#25 - 2014-09-24 21:43:24 UTC
I'm totally cool with lazors having the recoil animation. Not like any of us aren't having a matching pelvic thrust every time those beams go off....
Aurelius Valentius
Valentius Corporation
Valentius Corporation Alliance
#26 - 2014-09-25 18:50:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Aurelius Valentius
anyone care to make a calculation on the momentum distance thrown of any ship using Projectile Artillery broadside... on say a BS hull, moving at speed at a 90 degree off vector... and if it would also spin the shim on it's CG due to placement of turrets.
Arrogus Advenient
The Machine. LLC
#27 - 2014-09-25 19:34:44 UTC
Ranamar wrote:
Arrogus Advenient wrote:

To expand upon this, a Medium Beam Laser uses 7.22 GJ of energy to fire. Assuming 100% efficiency, the resulting beam of light would carry roughly 24 kg m/s of momentum, about the same as a liter of water moving at 55 mph. Decreases in efficiency would yield corresponding decreases in momentum, with the best modern lasers working at 30% efficiency.

So yes, lasers as powerful as those in eve would produce noticeable recoil.


I have to admit I looked at that and said to myself, "That seems a little weak."

Direct-fire artillery rifles have muzzle velocities of around 1-2000m/s small-caliber (say, 5" or smaller) weapons. To match a velocity of 1-2000m/s with that momentum, your payload is going to be one to two kilos max.
Applying some focused but not-great googling, this tells me that this approximately matches the performance of an anti-tank gun, or maybe a naval destroyer or cruiser main armament at best. Those 200mm autocannons the Minmatar mount? Definitely bigger. Blink

Of course, nobody actually requires the capacitor numbers to actually, y'know, *mean* anything.


The momentum of a laser's fire is almost certainly much lower than that of any other weapon system in eve, but it's the energy of the beam that does the damage, not its momentum.
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