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A Reminder Regarding Real Life Harassment

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Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#321 - 2014-09-11 13:55:38 UTC
Sibyyl wrote:
(Sohkar's entire "fortune" was worth about $30, or less than an hour of RL work in my case).


Good Lord, what do you do for a living? Hairdresser to the President?

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
S'No Flake
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#322 - 2014-09-11 13:57:48 UTC
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
S'No Flake wrote:
[quote=IIshira]

Then it's easy... CCP is pissed off about the whole AT thing and this payback :)



This was on my short list of explanations, but there's people banned that had nothing to do with CODE. that are members of null alliances.


Maybe they handed the bans for the investigations from the last 6 months in one wave probably some bots, RMT, client alteration, etc.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#323 - 2014-09-11 14:00:04 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Sibyyl wrote:
(Sohkar's entire "fortune" was worth about $30, or less than an hour of RL work in my case).


Good Lord, what do you do for a living? Hairdresser to the President?


Meh, my guess is she lives in Australia. $30 is a pretty standard minimum wage for a casual fast-food employee in their early to mid 20s who's worked for at least 24 months in the same job.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
FleetWarp Ichoriya
#324 - 2014-09-11 14:00:20 UTC
S'No Flake wrote:
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
S'No Flake wrote:
[quote=IIshira]

Then it's easy... CCP is pissed off about the whole AT thing and this payback :)



This was on my short list of explanations, but there's people banned that had nothing to do with CODE. that are members of null alliances.


Maybe they handed the bans for the investigations from the last 6 months in one wave probably some bots, RMT, client alteration, etc.


I guess that this is the most probable case

Nothing sweeter than tears of tearcollectors. mhh yummy!
Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#325 - 2014-09-11 14:00:58 UTC
FleetWarp Ichoriya wrote:
Sibyyl wrote:


Don't know what kind of EVE you play, but EVE voice isn't the best voice comms interface and not everything can be accomplished by typing furiously in a tiny chat window and sharing imgur links.



I don't know why you are hanging up on that statement?
She's just stating that if you dont lure your victim onto a TS you can't be penealized for it. She never ever stated that you should not use TS. Thats an important point you and your friends try to...well..'overlook'...



TS is a third party communication environment. By your statement:
-You can be penalized inside of EVE
-You can be penalized outside of EVE


I don't believe we are overlooking anything, and maybe you can clarify what you mean.

What I am trying to say is that the specific set of rules by which game bans are administered are *totally* invisible to us as players and these rules are not only applied within CCP's purview (the game), but also outside it. If I'm going to kicked out of a game I've paid for because of things I've been doing on a third party server that I pay RL money for, I think it makes sense to at least communicate to me the reason for which I'm kicked. It's at the very least the professional thing to do.


This hasn't occurred as far as anyone knows.


Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.
Thomas Hurt
Future Ventures
#326 - 2014-09-11 14:08:16 UTC
S'No Flake
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#327 - 2014-09-11 14:09:24 UTC
Jin Kugu wrote:
S'No Flake wrote:


Well, you have two options then :)
1. leave now
2. try to find where the line is and CCP will make you leave.

In your place, i would choose 2. This will help out other players avoiding stepping on the same line Cool


Maybe these people should be banned for whatever happend vov

All I know is that ccp should be done with shady community management. Somer was handled clearly, why can't this be done in a similar fashion?

Instead we have CCP Falcon insulting people and mass indefinite bans without explanation.


Clearly? Clearly it took half a year to do it :)

By the way, is not Falcon handing the bans, writing the TOS/EULA/rules.. he is just the face put there in front of you to punch.
Black Pedro
Mine.
#328 - 2014-09-11 14:12:52 UTC
Andski wrote:
I hardly expect CCP to clarify this any further, not because they believe people will simply dance on the edge of the line, but because they simply don't have a line drawn and enforcement is absolutely down to the whims of whatever GM handles a given case.


At this point I don't expect them to ever draw a line in the sand for us to understand clearly what is kosher and what isn't and I will concede that even maybe they shouldn't, but at least they could stand up and take responsibility for wielding the ban hammer. Those banned are due the courtesy of an explanation why they are no longer welcome on CCP's servers. A simple "bonus room participation" as a reason would go a long way to clearing things up. Right now, it isn't even clear what some of these players banned for "harassment" even did as many seem to have little or nothing to do with the bonus room shenanigans. Providing the actual event or action that got them banned would at least make it clear what their transgression was and they can move on, or, allow them to make an appeal petition if CCP was in error. No clear reason just adds further confusion to the community on what is allowed and is disrespectful to those banned.

The 8 Golden Rules of Eve

Why Do They Gank?
Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#329 - 2014-09-11 14:13:14 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Sibyyl wrote:
(Sohkar's entire "fortune" was worth about $30, or less than an hour of RL work in my case).


Good Lord, what do you do for a living? Hairdresser to the President?


Meh, my guess is she lives in Australia. $30 is a pretty standard minimum wage for a casual fast-food employee in their early to mid 20s who's worked for at least 24 months in the same job.



Sorry, I meant 30 USD, and all I'm saying is that it was pretty clear** that the reaction of the victim on TS was disproportionate to the actual-RL-money worth of "damage" he was taking.


For some people $30 may be a massive investment. It may take them many RL hours to earn it, and they may not be able to spare that much on top of other RL commitments. But if $30 is a lot, then why would someone callously transfer that much to another player without immediately receiving an equal amount of goods or services in return?


IP law, btw P




**for those who listened to the entire recording and didn't just base their opinions off a blog post

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.
Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
#330 - 2014-09-11 14:13:25 UTC
Some toxic mongrels got booted out

Oh noes what do...

Good riddance.

You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear

Because >>I is too hard
Arec Bardwin
#331 - 2014-09-11 14:13:31 UTC
Is it too late to jump on the banned wagon?
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#332 - 2014-09-11 14:15:05 UTC
Andski wrote:
I hardly expect CCP to clarify this any further, not because they believe people will simply dance on the edge of the line, but because they simply don't have a line drawn and enforcement is absolutely down to the whims of whatever GM handles a given case.


This is pretty much the conclusion I have come to at this point.

Nothing else explains the staggering inconsistencies, that are only corrected if they are absolutely catastrophic.

"You can impersonate yourself".

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
S'No Flake
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#333 - 2014-09-11 14:15:28 UTC
Kristalll wrote:
Mike Azariah wrote:
They stood next to the sign looking out at the long grass. Right next to them was a sign reading 'Danger, Minefield'

m



Okay, this analogy, while funny, is also GREATLY missing the mark.

This is more like a field, with no mines sign, that get advertised as a tourist destination that people have been playing in for years. And one day a few mines go off, and everyone is wondering where the edge of the minefield is so they can get out of it.


Well, where those mine went off is the edge ... most likely ... but not 100% so, try to stay a few more meters away.
Dave Stark
#334 - 2014-09-11 14:16:26 UTC
S'No Flake wrote:
Kristalll wrote:
Mike Azariah wrote:
They stood next to the sign looking out at the long grass. Right next to them was a sign reading 'Danger, Minefield'

m



Okay, this analogy, while funny, is also GREATLY missing the mark.

This is more like a field, with no mines sign, that get advertised as a tourist destination that people have been playing in for years. And one day a few mines go off, and everyone is wondering where the edge of the minefield is so they can get out of it.


Well, where those mine went off is the edge ... most likely ... but not 100% so, try to stay a few more meters away.


we seem to be missing a line to indicate where the edge is.
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#335 - 2014-09-11 14:16:40 UTC
FleetWarp Ichoriya wrote:
Sibyyl wrote:

At some point you start destroying everything EVE is marketed to be in order to protect RL feelings that people seem to have for possessions that are essentially fake and have no significant RL value (Sohkar's entire "fortune" was worth about $30, or less than an hour of RL work in my case).


Thats fine for you if you can afford it that good. Some other people don't. Some people can advance very slowly in game due to other parts of their life. For whatever reason, it doesnt matter if he had 30b ISK or 3m ISK. It has a value to him and afterall its not about the crappy scam he fell for. I thought I'd already stated. Its about tormenting him for hours when there were no money and no assets to scam anymore - literally! It was just a game messing with someone's head for no apparrent reason but for the lols not even remotely related to the game.


Dave Stark wrote:

no, i couldn't say that. not with a straight face.


that is sad.

You're probably wasting your time, if you want to convince people here. This thread is a prime example why CCP doesn't want to draw a line in the sand. These people are pretending to be incapable of thinking and aren't genuinely confused about anything. That is why they leave out convenient details, that is why the recurring bans on the same activities are painted as random and unpredictable application of the rules, that is why they try to get the bans to be about scamming and other accepted gameplay when it is clear they never were and that it why they dabble in technicalities. The good thing is, that CCP is run by actual people with functioning brains, so their efforts to get CCP tangled up in their game is a lost cause.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#336 - 2014-09-11 14:17:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Remiel Pollard
S'No Flake wrote:
Jin Kugu wrote:
S'No Flake wrote:


Well, you have two options then :)
1. leave now
2. try to find where the line is and CCP will make you leave.

In your place, i would choose 2. This will help out other players avoiding stepping on the same line Cool


Maybe these people should be banned for whatever happend vov

All I know is that ccp should be done with shady community management. Somer was handled clearly, why can't this be done in a similar fashion?

Instead we have CCP Falcon insulting people and mass indefinite bans without explanation.


Clearly? Clearly it took half a year to do it :)

By the way, is not Falcon handing the bans, writing the TOS/EULA/rules.. he is just the face put there in front of you to punch.



I actually don't think anyone should be getting riled up at Falcon for this. He has a tough job, stuck between us and CCP policy, and he has to strike a balance. On one hand, CCP pays him and on the other, we pay CCP. I personally don't hold **** against Falcon. I'm sure he's letting everyone blow off steam and thinking of how best to address the community the next chance he gets, I actually believe that and I'd bet on it.

But he is right smack bang between a rock and a hard place on this one because he has a heated community to deal with and has to stand in solidarity with the company at the same time. Me, I'm going to bed to get some sleep. I haven't been banned and don't intend to be so I really don't have a stake in this but make no mistake, CCP the company is not being consistent with policy enforcement, in both the game and the forums. Maybe this hasn't affected you yet, so congratulations, but if you're standing here right now and arguing black and blue that CCP have done no wrong and their inconsistency does one day affect you, you ******* remember this day and how you only screwed yourself.

But don't blame Falcon. This is not on him. It's on the company as a whole.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#337 - 2014-09-11 14:18:50 UTC
Thomas Hurt wrote:


https://twitter.com/fucktyler/status/285670822264307712



Let's try not to take this issue, which is a discussion of interactions in an online game which seem to only involve transfer or destruction of in-game assets, and try to blow it up to cyber bullying in general.


That tweet might seem clever at first glance, but that fellow is completely ignorant on how underaged and/or emotionally vulnerable internet users could be deeply manipulated and damaged by keystrokes alone.

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.
Clara Pond
Never Not Snazzy
#338 - 2014-09-11 14:30:10 UTC
Dear people who don't understand satire: look up satire.
Amyclas Amatin
SUNDERING
Goonswarm Federation
#339 - 2014-09-11 14:31:35 UTC
Clara Pond wrote:
Dear people who don't understand satire: look up satire.


Surely such things have no place in the clean and open discussion that takes place on the EVE forums.

For more information on the New Order of High-Sec, please visit: http://www.minerbumping.com/

Remember that whenever you have a bad day in EVE, the correct reponse is "Thank you CCP, may I please have another?"
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#340 - 2014-09-11 14:34:10 UTC  |  Edited by: KIller Wabbit
So players reported some/several/many/f* ton of bans. Any intel that some of them weren't for one more typical ban offenses? RMT, botting, etc etc This might have just been a convenient time to empty the bin.

Edit: Tracking enhancer engaged