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Warfare & Tactics

 
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What do you think about the following evasion 'tactics'

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Substantia Nigra
Polaris Rising
Goonswarm Federation
#41 - 2014-09-16 04:38:59 UTC
Thanks OP, I am intrigued with the ‘grid’ type issues of this description.

Sure it seems counterproductive to burn a fast ship for half an hour and then fiddle around with ‘edge’ bookmarks etc, but the result of being able to place a ship (carrier in the example) into an unprobable pocket of space is very interesting. Not only is the carrier unprobable but it will also be invisible from within the deadspace pocket, because at 15,000+ km distance it will be almost certainly offgrid.
I suppose you may be able to gridfu the deadspace pocket so the NPC-ship grid extends to include your carrier spot … but that’d not be something you’d be wanting to do.

Very interesting observation. I might find a site hereabouts and explore some of the other implications of that particular game dynamic.

p.s. I wouldn’t worry too much about exploit accusations - https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=237681 – sometimes they’re a dime-a-dozen :-)

I guess I am almost a 'vet' by now. Hopefully not too bitter and managing to help more than I hinder. I build and sell many things, including large collections of bookmarks.
MonkeyBusiness Thiesant
Pandemic Unicorns
#42 - 2014-09-16 14:10:57 UTC  |  Edited by: MonkeyBusiness Thiesant
LUMINOUS SPIRIT wrote:
Might work well with a vigilant's web bonus, or a daredevil - so the fighters can track.

5 fighters with a ton of drone damage amps is what, 850 dps? 1000 on a thanny?

Not bad.



A touch over 1100 with a Thanny. Since it's totally safe you don't need any tank either, so you could stuff the thing with drone trackinglinks/navcoms/enhancers, perhaps even drone rigs.

Anyway, all fairly ridiculous. Definitely curious as to why CCP doesn't see this as an exploit.
Annia Aurel
J-CORP
Goonswarm Federation
#43 - 2014-09-16 19:15:26 UTC
The grid-fu is strong in this one.
Cudos for working that out.
nahjustwarpin
SUPER DUPER SPACE TRUCKS
#44 - 2014-09-16 19:39:24 UTC
MonkeyBusiness Thiesant wrote:
LUMINOUS SPIRIT wrote:
Might work well with a vigilant's web bonus, or a daredevil - so the fighters can track.

5 fighters with a ton of drone damage amps is what, 850 dps? 1000 on a thanny?

Not bad.



A touch over 1100 with a Thanny. Since it's totally safe you don't need any tank either, so you could stuff the thing with drone trackinglinks/navcoms/enhancers, perhaps even drone rigs.

Anyway, all fairly ridiculous. Definitely curious as to why CCP doesn't see this as an exploit.


I wonder if you could slowboat triage carriers into an incursion site .......


that's for a different topic, but i believe modules that affect drones (except for drone control unit) don't affect drones if they are offgrid
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#45 - 2014-09-16 23:28:44 UTC
Neat. Anyone taking bets on how long it takes before someone tries to do this, screws up, and loses their carrier?
Oxide Ammar
#46 - 2014-09-17 05:37:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Oxide Ammar
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Neat. Anyone taking bets on how long it takes before someone tries to do this, screws up, and loses their carrier?

There are no screw ups because the confirmation of you in safe spot is to warp your alt to the carrier, if it landed on the carrier then you need to adjust yourself if not then you are pretty much safe.

Lady Areola Fappington:  Solo PVP isn't dead!  You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.
Doctor Knuckles
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#47 - 2014-09-17 13:31:22 UTC
To be honest it seems to me this could be considered an exploit, and bannable.
Substantia Nigra
Polaris Rising
Goonswarm Federation
#48 - 2014-09-17 17:45:41 UTC
Oxide Ammar wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Neat. Anyone taking bets on how long it takes before someone tries to do this, screws up, and loses their carrier?


There are no screw ups because the confirmation of you in safe spot is to warp your alt to the carrier, if it landed on the carrier then you need to adjust yourself if not then you are pretty much safe.


I experimented with this a couple nights ago and found myself suddenly in normal space. The site had despawned because some inconsiderate soul had come in and run it on me. I also had a ship in the site at the time.
You get no indication when that happens, you just suddenly become warp-to-able.


I guess I am almost a 'vet' by now. Hopefully not too bitter and managing to help more than I hinder. I build and sell many things, including large collections of bookmarks.
Princess Bride
SharkNado
#49 - 2014-09-18 13:05:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Princess Bride
Substantia Nigra wrote:
Oxide Ammar wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Neat. Anyone taking bets on how long it takes before someone tries to do this, screws up, and loses their carrier?


There are no screw ups because the confirmation of you in safe spot is to warp your alt to the carrier, if it landed on the carrier then you need to adjust yourself if not then you are pretty much safe.


I experimented with this a couple nights ago and found myself suddenly in normal space. The site had despawned because some inconsiderate soul had come in and run it on me. I also had a ship in the site at the time.
You get no indication when that happens, you just suddenly become warp-to-able.




Which is why you should use an agent mission.

It seems pretty obvious to me why CCP is allowing this tactic to stand as fair game-play. Despite the extremely detailed explanation by the OP, it's just complicated enough that quite a few people will still screw it up and get their carrier killed. The responses in this thread speak for themselves.

Great job OP.

http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/
Arya Regnar
Darwins Right Hand
#50 - 2014-09-21 01:40:28 UTC
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
Interesting but seems like an incredible waste of time. Two Gilas can finish the mission long before you get all that rigmarole setup.

AS long as someone stays in the pocket even if cloaked the gates and dedlock stays.
It will go away at DT but you cant make it disappear faster than that.

EvE-Mail me if you need anything.
Wraymond Arji
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#51 - 2014-09-22 15:17:22 UTC
Why are interesting threads like this always going down the same path?

OP posts something outside the box, douche 1 comes in and threatens banning of OP due to rule violations, douche 2 comes in and says he can overcome this tactic on a high horse, CCP weighs in stating it's legit, douche 3 comes in and tries to rationalize how CCP is just CYA and can't fix it, then the tape measure comes out and the next 2 pages are like 3rd grade....
Darkblad
Doomheim
#52 - 2014-09-24 19:49:59 UTC
Milan Nantucket wrote:
Darkblad wrote:
Vincent Athena wrote:
If CCP wanted to get rid of this tactic, another way to do it would be to get rid of deadspace altogether. That is, once you have a BM in a mission area, you can warp right to it. Ditto for a ship you have scanned out.
Would render acceleration gates that limit the ship sizes (groups) which can pass it useless. DED, FW and unrated complexes, Burner mission sites and those few missions that do such.

The tactic already does that.

Get your carrier to the ded space side of the novice plex then warp to the beacon. Now you have a carrier in a novice plex.
Shouldn't be possible. Warping from outside of the deadspace area to something within that area: you land at the entry gate.
(attempt to) warpi within the deadspace area: not possible, unless you use acceleration gates.

NPE – ISD – RIP
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#53 - 2014-09-24 20:26:28 UTC
Level IV Security wrote:
Crosi Wesdo wrote:


Fighters will not follow you into DED space.


Depends on how you enter it ^_^


Exactly. The OP is finding the border of the DED space using a fast frigate. He then drops in the carrier outside of DED space, and slowboats the carrier into the DED space. Once the carrier is in DED space then he CAN assign his fighters to his alt sitting on the button.
Skir Skor
Stay Frosty.
A Band Apart.
#54 - 2014-10-03 18:23:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Skir Skor
Today I had the joy of pewing against a Neut, smartbombing and stabbed Typhoon Fleet Edition in a Nov plex, Manjo. I was in a frig. Not a bug or expolit.......
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