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Tracking & Fitting Larger ships

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Vol Arm'OOO
Central Co-Prosperity Union
#21 - 2014-09-02 20:49:51 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Clarice Humphries wrote:
so frigates win from battleships...in most cases? seems weird from a new players point of view. or am i missing something?

A battleship has problems hitting a frigate that is travelling with a traversal velocity that exceeds the tracking of the battleship's turrets.

Some possible solutions:
* Send drones after the frigate.
* Web the frigate to slow it down.
* Energy neutralize the frigate (turns-off its propulsion module).
* Use a Warp Scrambler on the frigate to shut-off its MWD.
* Manually navigate the larger ship so the frigate has a lower traversal velocity.
* Fit mid-slot and / or low-slot tracking modules.
* Use a smartbomb, to force the frigate to orbit further away.
* Be assisted by remote tracking computers from other friendly fleet ships.
* Use a target painter to make the frigate effectively a larger target. [Applies more to missiles.]

Example: My Tornado with 1400mm artillery and no drones, cannot generally hit a moving frigate closer than ~20 km, however I can easily one-volley them at about 30 km. So I try to kite away from the frigate, and really like it when they follow directly behind, as 0 traversal velocity even for a moment = dead frigate.

EDIT: I hate battling a Dominx (and drone boats in general), as they do have drones, and often also webs, neuts, and even smartbombs.


Should just add some points from the frigs perspective:

Generally, you want to keep your traversal up so that means approaching in a spiral. If you are going against a ratting ship, you can get as close as you can while still being able to hit the bs. (Believe it or not, but if you orbit too close and are moving too fast, you may create tracking problems for your own guns). If you believe that the bs has webs you want to try and kite them outside of overheated web range - approximately 11-12k. If you believe that the ship has heavy neuts - well then you need to try and kite outside of neut range 24k (?). Of course many bs now carry MJD which means that you cant hold the bs unless you are able to scram them. As I recall, normal scram range is approx 9k. So if you are in a non-boosted t1 frig it is certainly no guarantee that you will take down a solo bs.

I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#22 - 2014-09-02 22:21:48 UTC
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Clarice Humphries wrote:
so frigates win from battleships...in most cases? seems weird from a new players point of view. or am i missing something?

A battleship has problems hitting a frigate that is travelling with a traversal velocity that exceeds the tracking of the battleship's turrets.

Some possible solutions:
* Send drones after the frigate.
* Web the frigate to slow it down.
* Energy neutralize the frigate (turns-off its propulsion module).
* Use a Warp Scrambler on the frigate to shut-off its MWD.
* Manually navigate the larger ship so the frigate has a lower traversal velocity.
* Fit mid-slot and / or low-slot tracking modules.
* Use a smartbomb, to force the frigate to orbit further away.
* Be assisted by remote tracking computers from other friendly fleet ships.
* Use a target painter to make the frigate effectively a larger target. [Applies more to missiles.]

Example: My Tornado with 1400mm artillery and no drones, cannot generally hit a moving frigate closer than ~20 km, however I can easily one-volley them at about 30 km. So I try to kite away from the frigate, and really like it when they follow directly behind, as 0 traversal velocity even for a moment = dead frigate.

EDIT: I hate battling a Dominx (and drone boats in general), as they do have drones, and often also webs, neuts, and even smartbombs.


Should just add some points from the frigs perspective:

Generally, you want to keep your traversal up so that means approaching in a spiral. If you are going against a ratting ship, you can get as close as you can while still being able to hit the bs. (Believe it or not, but if you orbit too close and are moving too fast, you may create tracking problems for your own guns). If you believe that the bs has webs you want to try and kite them outside of overheated web range - approximately 11-12k. If you believe that the ship has heavy neuts - well then you need to try and kite outside of neut range 24k (?). Of course many bs now carry MJD which means that you cant hold the bs unless you are able to scram them. As I recall, normal scram range is approx 9k. So if you are in a non-boosted t1 frig it is certainly no guarantee that you will take down a solo bs.


Yeah if the BS has neuts you are quite possibly going to be unable to kill them. You can almost certainly survive the encounter, so frig vs neut BS is usually a stalemate.

If the BS does not have neuts, and does not have bonused light drones, you are almost never going to be at risk of being killed, and you can orbit the BS and warp scramble it indefinitely and you may be able to kill it depending upon its tank. Just being able to point a BS indefinitely is a 'win' even if you can't kill it (as you totally control the fight), and there are times you can kill them too.

That's why I say 'frigates usually beat battleships'.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com
Keisha Tachyon
Perkone
Caldari State
#23 - 2014-09-03 09:04:50 UTC
On Point why frigates are sort of "dangerous" to a lone battleship has not been mentioned here.

Battleships (except drone ships) generally lack the means to kill a properly flown frigate quickly. That means if a frigate tackles your battleship (makes it stay in place by warpscrambler/webifier) and even if it can´t actually kill you. You can be pretty sure that somewhere in the corp/fleet or whatever Chats the frigate Pilot is calling for more firepower.
And if you can´t shake the frigate of quickly you´ll find a fleet arriving shortly that has plenty foirepower to kill you.

Obviously not every Player running around in a frig has a fleet behind them, but a lone frigate attacking a battleship usually does.
Lilliana Stelles
#24 - 2014-09-03 22:20:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Lilliana Stelles
Ka'Narlist wrote:
Lilliana Stelles wrote:
There are a handful of ships it's feasible to mis-size the guns on, (light missile caracal for example).

Caracals get their bonus to light and heavy missiles, so light missiles are not mis-sized on a caracal


It is according to ISIS, which lists the caracal as a medium-module ship.
I'm not talking about rapid launchers.
I'm talking about the frigate size launchers.
There are some fits that use them.

Not a forum alt. 
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#25 - 2014-09-04 00:46:33 UTC
Lilliana Stelles wrote:
Ka'Narlist wrote:
Lilliana Stelles wrote:
There are a handful of ships it's feasible to mis-size the guns on, (light missile caracal for example).

Caracals get their bonus to light and heavy missiles, so light missiles are not mis-sized on a caracal


It is according to ISIS, which lists the caracal as a medium-module ship.
I'm not talking about rapid launchers.
I'm talking about the frigate size launchers.
There are some fits that use them.


They did, till we got the rapids.
Lilliana Stelles
#26 - 2014-09-05 05:53:34 UTC
Gregor Parud wrote:
Lilliana Stelles wrote:
Ka'Narlist wrote:
Lilliana Stelles wrote:
There are a handful of ships it's feasible to mis-size the guns on, (light missile caracal for example).

Caracals get their bonus to light and heavy missiles, so light missiles are not mis-sized on a caracal


It is according to ISIS, which lists the caracal as a medium-module ship.
I'm not talking about rapid launchers.
I'm talking about the frigate size launchers.
There are some fits that use them.


They did, till we got the rapids.


You still see them on blitz fits that don't want to deal with the reload times.

Not a forum alt. 
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