Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Having (almost) everyone show up in Local in non-WH space is not only fine (to some extent), it fits with the lore. Each system has stargates, and these stargates control who can enter and leave a system, and they keep a record of who's in system. This is the "Traffic Control" we notice when we first try to go into a system after downtime.

But here's the thing. Traffic Control has (or should have) no way of knowing if a pilot has left system via means other than a stargate (Wormhole, Jump Drive, or Jump Bridge.)

So here's an idea. Keep Local largely as-is but pilots will not become visible in Local until they:

1. Enter a system via stargate.
2. Dock at a station.
3. Say something in Local Chat.

And here's the kicker: Pilots won't disappear from their previous Local channel until they show up in a new one.

Given the lack of stargates and stations in WH-space, this would leave Local in WH-space exactly as it is now.

Local in hisec would remain largely as it is now because the vast majority of traffic into or out of hisec is via stargate, but the presence of hisec wormholes and the ability to jump out of hisec would change it's dynamic slightly.

But Local in losec and nullsec would become more...dynamic. BlOps bridging would become more covert (only the covert cyno pilot would show up in local, assuming they weren't left there by another BlOps bridge). Non-hotdropped capitals would gain a certain element of surprise, assuming they didn't dock after jumping in. Wormholes would become far more useful for transit between points in K-space. And (I feel unfortunately), it would remove supercap pilots from Local entirely unless they talked in Local.


Having said all of that, I'm not a strong supporter of changing how Local works. I think it's largely fine just how it is. This is just an idea I'm pitching in to see what folks think.

Thoughts?

EDIT: From my reply below, adding for clarity.

I had thought about how Local handles pilots logging off. Initially, I was thinking that pilots would continue showing up in Local (whichever Local they happened to be in) when they logged out. This would make for some interesting gameplay options because you'd never know if, for example, that AFK cloaker was even really logged in or not, let alone at the keyboard.

But, I took it out of my proposal because of the density of logged out pilots in certain systems. Can you imagine the server strain and bandwidth issues if Jita Local tried to display the names and portraits of every single pilot logged off in Jita? As interesting as I think this would be from a gameplay perspective, I doubt the hardware could handle it effectively. So, for now, my idea has you disappearing from Local, whichever Local you may be in, when you log out, and then reappearing when you log in. It's just like it is now, except for the whole "I may not be where Local thinks I am" part.

looks more solid than the other "fix local" plans.

Not sure having supers have "nope, you're never gonna see me!" is a good thing though.

+1 for innovation and logic. Reserve my judgement about implementation for now. Nice trail of thoughts.

I had thought about how Local handles pilots logging off. Initially, I was thinking that pilots would continue showing up in Local (whichever Local they happened to be in) when they logged out. This would make for some interesting gameplay options because you'd never know if, for example, that AFK cloaker was even really logged in or not, let alone at the keyboard.

But, I took it out of my proposal because of the density of logged out pilots in certain systems. Can you imagine the server strain and bandwidth issues if Jita Local tried to display the names and portraits of every single pilot logged off in Jita? As interesting as I think this would be, I doubt the hardware could handle it effectively. So, for now, my idea has you disappearing from Local, whichever Local you may be in, when you log out, and reappearing when you log in. It's just like it is now, except for the whole "I may not be where Local thinks I am" part.

So, to answer the original question, if you show up in Local, you'll show up in Local until you show up in another Local. Logging out won't drop you from whichever Local you're in when you log back in.

Now, you could still get a "ghost" CovOps into any system without the logoff mechanic. Have another CovOps pilot enter the system via stargate (they'd be visible in Local), have them light a covert cyno, and then have a BlOps bridge you into system. You'd be cloaked, and not show up in Local, but it would take three pilots to accomplish and you'd be vulnerable to being probed out for at least a few moments while the covert cyno is up.

I originally wanted to do something like that as well. You do something in local, you show up in Local. However, I have a feeling that implementing that would be quite a technical challenge. For the sake of simplicity, I kept the current WH-space mechanic of you say something in local, you show up in Local.

+1 for the innovative side of it, I can't say I've read this before.

It does sound hard to implement, though, and would lead to massive headaches if you're trying to hunt someone.
The downside of your proposal is of course the fact it buffs hotdroppers in null, as it allows them to seed undetectable cynoships into system via bridges, with no counterplay possible.

What makes WH local work so well is the nature of wormholes and the inability of unseen predators to summon their whole coalition on top of Random Mackinaw #1287981 with impunity. People are fine with not seing reds in local since if they got into system it's because the entrances were not being monitored, and even if something decloaks, it will have to kill you by it's own merits, not via an "I Win Button"

While your system is a decent, if complex, proposal, it needs mechanics more advanced than the ones present in w-space to decide if someone shows up in local. Dscan pings could be a way, as they are needed for active hunting, and it matches RL nicely (active radars can be detected at double their own range due to them radiating energy out, so if someone is pinging dscan they should be noticeable in some way). You could argue for this to only happen if the hunter used dscan close enough to a gate, station, etc... thus adding another element to make systems more diverse.

In all honesty, I don't see this happening in EVE with it's current developement direction, but best of luck with the idea, as it's quite nice.

For once we have a reasonnable idea, that might work.

I would point out that only crossing a gate or log/unlog in station should be registered.
That for being logical with the Concord control.


If you arrived throught a wormhole or you log in space after downtime,
you shouldn't be visible in local until you speak out.

That might freakout people at war in hight sec and low sec might be more interesting to investigate if the usual pirate cannot see you directly at first, travelling in null might become tricky as most of the time it's allright.

I like this idea

I'm....actually a huge fan of this idea, and it fits perfectly with lore. It would definitely make wormhole travel a LOT more powerful, but still leave limits (ie you can surprise jump someone in the system the wormhole is in, but not in the next system over, since you'd have to take a stargate to get there).

That said, I would amend it such that jumping to a cyno beacon places you in local, since they are anchored structures that are likely in Concord's database uplink. Ship-based cynos would work as you suggest. This is to further emphasize that you either need to have a cyno ship to jump to, or an escort fleet at the cyno beacon.

Also, since kills are logged in Concord's DB in k-space, it might make sense to add pilots to local once they've been logged on a killmail. This would allow single-instance ganks without allowing hordes to float in a system cloaked on a gate for every traveler through.

That said, I tend to agree with the above. I think Supers should have an innate exclusion to this, in that they always show up in local (large enough that the stargates automatically detect them, or a Concord-required transponder, or something).

Local is fine.

With interceptor gangs jumping in and warping to all the sites within seconds, local keeps people paying attention or they get killed.

The good thing about local is that it makes people feel safe enough to rat in Carriers and bring out other expensive ships.

Ships that can then fall victim to smart gangs or to the pilot not paying attention.

People beg for a local nerf because they want free kills for little or no effort but once the risk-reward scales so far in the risk direction then they will just find other methods of income and you won't have anything to hunt.

People are killing ratters in null all day every day. What are they doing right that you don't?