EVE General Discussion

No, sorry, I must admit I skimmed it. I actually do agree that dynamic ore belts would be a great addition to mining and would go a long way to making it a more interesting profession. Your ideas about shared exploration costs (which sound similar to Crius teams) are good and would be an interesting dynamic. But I don't know that it's enough on it's own, since once you start mining at the new belt, you're right back to where you left off with the old drudgery. I also don't think that just because something is called a 'mini-game' that it's not a part of the overall gameplay. It just happens to be encapsulated into a more distinct activity than most other things in the game, but it is still something you do within the game, and I think it could make mining a bit more engaging personally.

Those basic numbers you posted I can't argue with.

However, to see if you believe hisec is more dangerous than low and null:

1. Do you think there are an equal number of retrievers in highsec and low/null combined?
2. Would you AFK mine in a retriever in low/null? Would you do it in highsec?
3. Would you autopilot your way through low/null in a retriever? Would you in highsec?
4. Would you sit comfortably in a belt and not d-scan in low/null? Would you ever do that in highsec?
5. Do you care if new neutrals appear in low/null? Do you pay close attention to that in highsec?

My own answers to that would be:

1. There are not equal numbers in highsec v low/null. There are many more retrievers in highsec, so more losses there anyway. Percentage wise, I don't know, but the raw numbers destroyed isn't a direct measure of relative danger. It's more likely a measure of relative population of retrievers.

2. Never would I AFK anything in low/null. I personally don't do it in highsec either, but it isn't dangerous to do so.

3. Autopiloting through low/null is a quick way to death. Not really a problem most of the time in highsec.

4. D-Scan is a vital tool in low/null. In many highsec systems it is almost irrelevant most of the time.

5. Changes in local are just as important as d-scan in low/null. In most highsec systems, it hardly even matters.

Highsec is on the whole, far safer than lowsec and nullsec.

People in low/null take much more care of their own safety compared to highsec, because they have to for the most part.

How about this: new modules allowing to "expose" ore better for lasers to gather. Only one can be fit per ship, scriptable for some mining improving factors (granulation - more m3 per cycle, saturation - more ore units per cycle, etc.). It would be like target painters of remote sebo kind of thing. It would have to be activated at specific rock so no off grid linky thing. So you would need at least two more ships to maximize your single miner's speed. You fit it on you mining ship, you gimp your base yield? You take 2 friends/alts with you, you will faster exploit site you found so competition has less chance to poach "your" ore.

And since ore would be only discoverable (sites) and scarce (no more than x simultaneous per system or sth) and elusive (signatures fading away with time) cycles of actual mining lazors could be make faster without worrying about saturation of market with instant ore fountains.

I don't know, I'm sure there are ways for make it more robust and interesting and group oriented than what we have now. But if we start every discussion with "nerf by 30% and mini game" we won't go anywhere.

@Kaarous Aldurald
And yes, I noticed your "10% more if succeed in mini game" but that's not making mining into fully fleshed resource gathering feature, that's just tamagotchi so you don't get bored by 90-ish second of waiting for your hulk cycle to end.

Who are 'they', devs? I must have missed something then. And I don't see Crius introducing mini games into production so no, nerfs and mini games are not only way to make gameplay out of mundane activities.

I think the scatter can thing they had for exploration would be glorious for mining, it would eliminate AFK mining, require effort and increase the risk a bit (if they make it so people can steal the ore at the risk of flags.)

If each laser scattered some ore after every cycle that your hull had to pull in, it would be a bit more realistic as a laser pounding a rock as they do in this game would produce some debris.

The mechanic is already there, just have to add it in.

You could even give the Rorqual the ability to auto-pull all ore a fleet produces from a certain range. Give the big thing a use in this regard.

Sorry if my English is bad, it is not my first language.

You're never going to get the high-sec miners to move to low/null-sec. Period. Most of them mine solo/multibox. Living in low/null requires a completely different approach to the game (watching d-scan, scouting, be aware, no afk). And the reward will never make up for the increased risk, disruption and increased logistics burden. What you'll get with your proposal is the big null guys organizing mining ops in their safe sov-null enclaves (maybe) and the high-sec miners quitting because they can't make a buck anymore (surely).

As it should be.

Also are you saying that people who carve out their own space in NullSec, fighting daily to defend it, spamming DScan, working together, organizing, etcetc.... shouldn't be rewarded more than HiSec people because "miners will quit the game!"?

I'm seeing a lot of mentions of a "mining mini-game", and I've been seeing mentions of such a thing for quite a while.

As someone who splits his time between industry and combat depending on mood, such a thing would be more obnoxious than helpful.

I think we need to really analyze a few things to really reach some kind of conclusion.

Firstly, why do people mine? I know that in my own case, and a few others that I know, and possibly many others that I do not know, it's to relax and/or socialize. So before we entertain any real proposals to a "mining mini-game", if such a proposed mini-game gets in the way of relaxation and socialization, it will just annoy people and drive them away from it. I know that I myself would stop mining and just buy ores and minerals exclusively for any production pursuits I may engage in. The best part of mining is the mindlessness of it.

Secondly, how do we want rewards to scale based on the numbers of people (either characters or actual people)? With regards to alternate characters, CCP gets tons of money based on multiboxing miners, and anything that makes this gameplay style impossible or more trouble than it's worth will result in a substantial loss of revenue. A "scatter" mechanic would allow for more individuals to increase earning potential, but would be a penalty to multiboxers. As a matter of personal preference, and as one who does not use multiple characters, this would be acceptable to me, but not for many others.

So what's a solution? I can't really pin anything down myself, but the things that need to be considered are retaining the relaxing and social aspects that are currently present in mining, and give scaling benefits for group play.

Just a few thoughts before we all get on the clickfest mini-game bandwagon.

EDIT: As an addendum, if such a mini-game were to be implemented, you'd need much more than a 10% boost (like a previous poster suggested), since the change in effort from the current mining system (basically none) to a full-blown mini-game is very large. Much more effort for not much more reward is a bad design move.

Veldspar is the 2nd least profitable ore in HiSec, and one of the least profitable ores in the entire game (out of 16 ores, only 5 are less profitable than Veldspar).

And you may be right! The changes I propose may or may not affect the profitability of Veldspar. But they're not meant to. At least not directly.



Yes, people would have to jump through gates to find good spots. That's how you move from system to system in EVE, sans WHs or cynos.

Anyway I'm sorry you don't like my ideas. I knew it would upset a few AFK miners. I'm just surprised so few have shown up to rage.

For the record I find the idea of a minigame terrible, but interesting.

The purpose of my piece was to liven up mining as a profession. As far as what to do with mining itself... you got me there.

This has been an interesting discussion with lots of food for thought.

Stay tuned for my next few upcoming pieces that will touch upon:

• Stealth Bombers
• Local Chat/Intel (Dun dun dun!)
• The Pirate's Life!