EVE General Discussion

Well I've been far deeper than you and let me tell you, it ain't worth it. **** everyone and **** everything.

Can't say I shared the same experience. I found other people to be a waste of time and you know why?

Yesterday I was arrested and held in police custody, they asked me to speak to a drugs and alcohol advisor. I agreed. We talked and I told him it was a waste of time. He asked me why I thought that and I said, because of thisddd

Do you remember the last person you gave advice to? Do you remember the person before that? Or the person before that or the person before that? He told me he couldn't.

So I said Exactly! It's a waste of time because no one gives a ****. You don't give a ****, you can't even remember the people you're supposed to give meaningful support to. That's why it's a waste of time.

That's depressing.

You're right, that is depressing. But to me, that just illustrates the point that it is important to get help from a professional, and someone you feel you can build trust with. When you go to see someone who has been training for years in treating what ails you, and you know they will remember you week after week, it makes all the difference in the world.

+1 - to you both.

Riot Girl, I'm not here to change your mind. Just to say, f***, I've been there. A few times. I'm way better these past few years, and it's only because I have a few close people that anchor me. I don't know if I'd be here without them.

James is right, this thread of white-knighters and cutthroat bas****s - we'd all be here to listen.

This is why I love EVE. You have all your pirates, scammers, and trolls, but then you magnificent bastards show your true colors and help people out when they need it.

*hugs for everyone*

Awesome thread. So great to see how amazing this community is.

To be fair, I'd shoot you in Null/Low, but I'm all carebear at heart!!

Now, the rest of General Discussion, on the other hand....

We have a very serious problem in this country with how we understand and deal with the high correlations between addiction, depression, and suicide.

Our typical assumption of a causal chain is a bit like a yoda-ism. Depression leads to abuse, abuse leads to addiction, and addiction leads to suicide.

Part of this causal fallacy is that people get hopped up on whatever they are addicted to . . . drugs, alcohol, sex, whatever, and when they are beyond making a rational decision because of the high they are feeling, they make an irrational choice to end things.

Anecdotally, I don't find this to be true. And I think there is enough data extant to find out if this is true. I think that addiction finds its own reason. There are some genetic components to it and some social. Certainly some depressed people turn to abuse and abuse leads to addiction, but the story just isn't that simple.

The biggest problem with addiction is the way that some addicts are treated by society. No matter where your addiction came from, genetic predisposition or intentional abuse, addiction leads to depression. Once you realize that society says that you have no choice and no control over your life, that no one trusts you to behave responsibly in the presence of whatever it is you are addicted to, that you have a disease with no cure, and that society looks down on you for having it, you will become depressed.

When everyone in your life, everyone who loves you says at the same time, "It's not your fault, but we fault you for it." When everyone you love looks at you and says, "I understand you have a problem. But I can't be with you anymore." When everyone in the job world says, "You're great! We love you! But we can't hire you because of this thing that is out of your control."

That, my friends, is the definition of depression. When society's only response to your plight is, "We don't blame you for who you are, we just blame you for who you are." what rational option is there left in the world? What sane person wants to live in a world like that? Who wants to live in a world where you have been defined as a failure, no matter what you do or don't do? What person wants to live in a world where basic logic has no meaning?

No one wants to live with that. It is particularly frustrating to see people addicted to all kinds of nonsense that is NOT looked down on by society. The reality is that peer-approval is a more powerful drug than anything any of us addicts smoke, shoot, have sex with, or shove up our butts. And the self-righteous masses sit around basking in the glow of their shared high of moral superiority, as though that's not a drug, and you aren't addicted to it.

Meanwhile, we feel sorry for or demonize or criticize those people who take their own lives to get away from the madness of being an addict in a world full of hypocritical addicts.

I'm not saying that I'm in favor of suicide. I'm saying that suicide is the ever-present shadow of a society that treats addicts like criminals, and I'm saying that it is a rational response to some kinds of treatment. We desperately need to understand this. It's not irrational, it's not crazy, and it's not because someone is messed up on drugs. It's a completely rational response to an unending situation that has no positive outcome.

I won't ever do it because two people have affected my life by doing it in all the most horrible ways. Every time it crosses my mind I think about my family and my brothers and my friends and how much that would hurt them. But I have a shadow that says to me every morning when I wake up, "Really? You want to go through this again?"

And I say, "Yes."

Agreed, but you need to be sure the professionals are fully engaged before you disengage - just sending a message and hoping they act on it isn't enough.

And yes, even then you might need to be available on and off down the line but, hey, that's what being human's about.

This is an especially poignant and relevant thread given the recent news about the death of Robin Williams and his long battle with depression and addiction.

If I could like the OP multiple times I would.