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[Hyperion Feedback Thread] Mass-Based Spawn Distance After WH Jumps

First post First post First post
Author
Velia Canus
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1521 - 2014-08-27 00:32:47 UTC
I don't like this change and neither do 95%+ of wormholers.
Pandorath
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1522 - 2014-08-27 00:33:45 UTC
I don't like this change and neither do 95%+ of wormholers.
Naglerr
235MeV
#1523 - 2014-08-27 00:34:33 UTC
I don't like this change and neither do 95%+ of wormholers.
OMEGA REDUX
Last Resort Inn
#1524 - 2014-08-27 00:36:11 UTC
copy pasting the same thing using your alts doesn't help anything
Pandorath
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1525 - 2014-08-27 00:39:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Pandorath
OMEGA REDUX wrote:
copy pasting the same thing using your alts doesn't help anything

I'm trying to start something. The last one already isn't my alt.

I don't like this change and neither do 95%+ of wormholers.
Copy paste it if you agree, lets see the count.
Spryt3
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#1526 - 2014-08-27 00:41:14 UTC
I don't like this change and neither do 95%+ of wormholers.
Senji Vuran
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1527 - 2014-08-27 00:44:34 UTC
I don't like this change and neither do 95%+ of wormholers.
Arya Regnar
Darwins Right Hand
#1528 - 2014-08-27 00:47:15 UTC
I don't like this change and neither do 95%+ of wormholers.

EvE-Mail me if you need anything.

Kelaian Stareine
Regime Change Artists
#1529 - 2014-08-27 00:49:16 UTC
As someone who occasionally goes into a WH to die horribly I don't really see the point of the changes.
Andiedeath
We Aim To MisBehave
Strictly Unprofessional
#1530 - 2014-08-27 00:53:31 UTC
OMEGA REDUX wrote:
copy pasting the same thing using your alts doesn't help anything


LOL free intel! We all know his alts now...

Director

Sefem Velox

INGAME CHANNEL: Sefem Public

Andiedeath
We Aim To MisBehave
Strictly Unprofessional
#1531 - 2014-08-27 00:55:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Andiedeath
Pandorath wrote:
OMEGA REDUX wrote:
copy pasting the same thing using your alts doesn't help anything

I'm trying to start something. The last one already isn't my alt.

I don't like this change and neither do 95%+ of wormholers.
Copy paste it if you agree, lets see the count.


Use your main, as a toon in an NPC Corp means nothing other than just another troll...

EDIT: I would rather copy and paste the following...

'KEEP THE CHANGES THEY ARE !ALL! AWESOME'

Director

Sefem Velox

INGAME CHANNEL: Sefem Public

Katerin Archer
Total.
#1532 - 2014-08-27 00:55:23 UTC
I don't like this change.
Arya Regnar
Darwins Right Hand
#1533 - 2014-08-27 01:08:02 UTC
Quote:
It'll be "oh, it's Hard Knocks, everyone afk because we can't take that fight."

Your mistake here is that there's some level of risk in jumping a capital through a wormhole in the proposed system. You're wrong. Jumping a capital into any decent group's home system whilst they have any players online would mean that you are going to lose that capital. Not possibly, not maybe, but definitely.

The time it takes for you to get an interceptor to a ping to let the dread warp back to a hole is enough time for them to secure hole control, which is all it takes for your dread to be dead in the water.

We all have ping or alert systems, and "cap tackled" gets a response. Generally fast, generally overwhelming and generally expensive for you.

The proposed system is not "providing risk", it's ensuring that the only people that use dreadnoughts to collapse holes away from fights that they can't take because they lack numbers are now unable to do so. The end result of that change isn't "more risk" it's "less content", because people will just AFK and POS spin all day when they roll into a bigger fish until they do have the much larger gang that is now required to safely collapse.

And god forbid that you try to take a nullsec fight with your 15 T3s and a Triage Archon against their 80 man cruiser gang. You're now guranteed to have that Archon dropped on, because it's 30km from safety and in their space. Whereas before you had some chance of backing away from the nullsec/losec cyno (which brings more caps than you ever could get through a wormhole) when they decided to try to blap you, you're now racing against time: you have to complete the fight and get your Archon back into the hole before they type "Archon tackled 30km from wormhole in [system]" in their intel channel.

This system benefits larger groups of people over smaller groups of people for no apparent reason, whether it's nullsec over wormsec, or larger wormsec entities over smaller wormsec entities.

What wormholes need isn't changes to fundamental mechanics that are, for the most part, fine. We need reasons for smaller groups to get involved, a consistent difficulty ladder from C1-C6 that reflects in the income earnt, maybe even buffs to C6 income so that they're worth the extra hassle. We need small-mid sized fish to swim alongside the groups that can consistently bring 30-40+ ships to every fight.

Wormspace needs incentives to live in it, not barriers to surviving in it.


I think this captures it nicely.

EvE-Mail me if you need anything.

Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1534 - 2014-08-27 01:12:33 UTC
I don't like this change and neither do 95%+ of wormholers.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout

BeanBagKing
The Order of Atlas
#1535 - 2014-08-27 01:16:42 UTC
CCP Falcon wrote:
It seems like things have gotten a bit out of hand in this thread.

I can fully appreciated that some of you are unhappy with the changes that have gone out.

If you feel strongly about these changes, then give civil and concise feedback in the Hyperion feedback thread, and I'll point the development team in that direction.

Please don't make personal attacks on eachother, or employees of CCP, otherwise you'll lose the ability to post on the forums, and neither us nor you want it to come to that.

While you may see our development staff as avatars on a forum, please be aware that there are in fact people behind these faces, and abuse of CCP and our volunteers will not be tolerated.



Fair enough, you've had your (100+ combined pages) of feedback, do what you must...

Quote:
"Currently we are seeing _very predictable feedback_ on what we are doing. Having the perspective of having done this for a decade, I can tell you that this is one of the moments where we look at what our players do and less of what they say. Innovation takes time to set in and the predictable reaction is always to resist change."
Rei Moon
Perkone
Caldari State
#1536 - 2014-08-27 01:25:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Rei Moon
I don't like this change and neither do many many wormholers.
Also I was so fool to set subscription to auto-pay. I innocently wanted to support CCP. When all they want to support is CFC.
Well. Mistake solved. Will pay for accounts with ingame plex from now on. And let the other ones deactivate. 10 toons tbh. I don't see where wspace is gonna have a future anyway. .. Unless it's a blob future.

Down the pole podcast "Annhhh"

Naglerr
235MeV
#1537 - 2014-08-27 01:29:15 UTC
BeanBagKing wrote:


Fair enough, you've had your (100+ combined pages) of feedback, do what you must...

Quote:
"Currently we are seeing _very predictable feedback_ on what we are doing. Having the perspective of having done this for a decade, I can tell you that this is one of the moments where we look at what our players do and less of what they say. Innovation takes time to set in and the predictable reaction is always to resist change."


Is there a link to the OP for your quote BeanBagKing? I'd like to believe that better words were chosen in response to this issue than what you quoted.
BeanBagKing
The Order of Atlas
#1538 - 2014-08-27 01:38:45 UTC  |  Edited by: BeanBagKing
Naglerr wrote:
BeanBagKing wrote:


Fair enough, you've had your (100+ combined pages) of feedback, do what you must...

Quote:
"Currently we are seeing _very predictable feedback_ on what we are doing. Having the perspective of having done this for a decade, I can tell you that this is one of the moments where we look at what our players do and less of what they say. Innovation takes time to set in and the predictable reaction is always to resist change."


Is there a link to the OP for your quote BeanBagKing? I'd like to believe that better words were chosen in response to this issue than what you quoted.


The quote is from CCP Hilmar back in 2011 in a leaked email regarding "monoclegate". The playerbase was angry with the way the way that expansion was handled (Incarna I believe), the features in it, and were very vocal about it. CCP sent an internal mail that basically said we know what we're doing, don't listen to the players, the metrics will speak for themselves. When they players saw the email, they rioted outside Jita (thus the monument, if you look at the description), the actions did indeed speak for themselves.

Now, I don't think this is nearly as big of a deal, but I quoted it for the same reason. I believe you have the vast majority of the players reacting negatively to this change, and quite a few explaining why. This includes the wormhole CSM. However, CCP is shrugging off all the comments and going ahead with the change.

Here is a very quick google that, I believe, is the full original mail. http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=1537708
Pah Cova
Made in Portugal S.A.
#1539 - 2014-08-27 01:48:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Pah Cova
Well just my 2 cts and i´m not an wormholer.

Few days before this release I saw small corps leaving their wormhole, my mates saw that too in other wormholes.
With this ranges it is impossible for small corps residents to live where they used too.
More, with more wormholes respawn and the new one figate size wich is impossible to close, small corps aren´t do anything on there.

So now what you CCP left for small corps in wormholes?
Let me guess, you left for them one hand full of nothing.

All the wormholes are now like swiss cheese, we like cheese but...

Why didnt you give them moons to mine? They dont deserve it?
Why didnt you give them anomalies respawn like at least in hs sec and low sec?
Why some of them have to wait days for one sig ou two?
The wormholes are not dangerous on your point of view?


This was like the previous expansion and the industry, i see guys selling yons of minning chars, because you CCP broke their hability to refine, and BTW tons of structures on a pos and pay tons of isks for teams even if you manufacture in your pos, lol i love that part, thats why i left industry.

When are you CCP admit that you are only interested on destruction and you dont care about the rest of the eve professions that you´ve created once?
I understand that changes are needed, but you are pushing this to far.
One day when you guys wake up, theres only pvpeers on eve and that is the day when you going to say: Thanks god those miners pve guys and industry guys have leaved us alone forever, they was a pain in the ass. Now the guys that left can really fight, we should reduce the game map to 1/4 so they can reach the red side quickly.
Naglerr
235MeV
#1540 - 2014-08-27 01:52:21 UTC
Thanks for the post BeanBagKing. I was around for the monoclegate thing and actually shot the Jita monument for a while. I apparently did not see/don't remember that response though. It's somewhat sad that I assumed it applied to the current situation. The inability of CCP to respond to the ample feedback already provided on this issue just led me to assume we'd already gotten to the stage where they just tell us to deal with it because it isn't changing.