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[Hyperion] Jump Drive Economizer Modules

First post First post
Author
Voyager Arran
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#81 - 2014-08-01 15:38:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Voyager Arran
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Sigras wrote:
Please make the modules capital sized (>=4000 m^3) otherwise you may as well just reduce the jump fuel cost of all ships by 25% and call it a day...

If these modules are allowed to be 5 m^3 like most other modules not specifically tied to a ship class then every carrier will just carry around 4-5 of them and insta switch them out when they land.


The currently planned volume of these modules is 3500m3


People need to pay more attention to this detail.

At best, a carrier can tote around two, and that leaves them without room for any other capital modules in their fleet hangar and also gives up 7,000 m3 that could have just been more fuel. Dreads won't be able to carry any of them at all.
Kane Fenris
NWP
#82 - 2014-08-01 16:15:14 UTC
Voyager Arran wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Sigras wrote:
Please make the modules capital sized (>=4000 m^3) otherwise you may as well just reduce the jump fuel cost of all ships by 25% and call it a day...

If these modules are allowed to be 5 m^3 like most other modules not specifically tied to a ship class then every carrier will just carry around 4-5 of them and insta switch them out when they land.


The currently planned volume of these modules is 3500m3


People need to pay more attention to this detail.

At best, a carrier can tote around two, and that leaves them without room for any other capital modules in their fleet hangar and also gives up 7,000 m3 that could have just been more fuel. Dreads won't be able to carry any of them at all.



yeah this makes em even more awefull....

power blocks will have them lying around in their infrastructure so if they have a 4 jump way theyll jump 3 jumps with those mods then refit and make final jump fitted with normal combat fit

smaler corps who do not have this infrastructure are the ones who are ***** by this change
Strata Maslav
Captain's Quarters
#83 - 2014-08-01 16:22:45 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Sigras wrote:
Please make the modules capital sized (>=4000 m^3) otherwise you may as well just reduce the jump fuel cost of all ships by 25% and call it a day...

If these modules are allowed to be 5 m^3 like most other modules not specifically tied to a ship class then every carrier will just carry around 4-5 of them and insta switch them out when they land.


The currently planned volume of these modules is 3500m3


There doesn't seem to be any specification currently with the fitting to any specific ship. Theoretically you could take a frigate, fit these modules to it and store it inside your carrier. It would still be very difficult to fit these in space still but allow you to refit easily in a station.
Wrecked Angle
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#84 - 2014-08-01 16:43:23 UTC
Strata Maslav wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Sigras wrote:
Please make the modules capital sized (>=4000 m^3) otherwise you may as well just reduce the jump fuel cost of all ships by 25% and call it a day...

If these modules are allowed to be 5 m^3 like most other modules not specifically tied to a ship class then every carrier will just carry around 4-5 of them and insta switch them out when they land.


The currently planned volume of these modules is 3500m3


There doesn't seem to be any specification currently with the fitting to any specific ship. Theoretically you could take a frigate, fit these modules to it and store it inside your carrier. It would still be very difficult to fit these in space still but allow you to refit easily in a station.


Please stop thinking outside the box breaking CCPs meticulous design
Karash Amerius
The Seven Shadows
#85 - 2014-08-01 17:31:03 UTC
TheButcherPete wrote:
LOL guys, this fuel nerf wasn't meant for the coalitions. It's just CCP's way of kicking the little guys in the balls and making them have to join blocs just to stay in low/null.

one step forward, two steps back.

MeBiatch wrote:
it would be cool if you guys also added a cpuless version of a downgraded damage control unit.

make it only add 30% resists to hull. but that couppled with 2 bulkheads should make a ganker think twice.


Have you seen what deadspace adaptive nano platings with good skills do to Freighters? It's hilarious.


Only reason you would use any platings on a freighter is if you have guardians on grid (and more than just a few). Otherwise, it is always better to put T2 Reinforced Bulkheads to increase your overall EHP.

Karash Amerius Operative, Sutoka

CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#86 - 2014-08-01 18:08:06 UTC
Strata Maslav wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Sigras wrote:
Please make the modules capital sized (>=4000 m^3) otherwise you may as well just reduce the jump fuel cost of all ships by 25% and call it a day...

If these modules are allowed to be 5 m^3 like most other modules not specifically tied to a ship class then every carrier will just carry around 4-5 of them and insta switch them out when they land.


The currently planned volume of these modules is 3500m3


There doesn't seem to be any specification currently with the fitting to any specific ship. Theoretically you could take a frigate, fit these modules to it and store it inside your carrier. It would still be very difficult to fit these in space still but allow you to refit easily in a station.


Good point, and easy enough to solve. We have the technology.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie

Aerie Evingod
Midwest Miners LLC
#87 - 2014-08-01 19:58:01 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Strata Maslav wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Sigras wrote:
Please make the modules capital sized (>=4000 m^3) otherwise you may as well just reduce the jump fuel cost of all ships by 25% and call it a day...

If these modules are allowed to be 5 m^3 like most other modules not specifically tied to a ship class then every carrier will just carry around 4-5 of them and insta switch them out when they land.


The currently planned volume of these modules is 3500m3


There doesn't seem to be any specification currently with the fitting to any specific ship. Theoretically you could take a frigate, fit these modules to it and store it inside your carrier. It would still be very difficult to fit these in space still but allow you to refit easily in a station.


Good point, and easy enough to solve. We have the technology.


Stronger? Faster?
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
SONS of BANE
#88 - 2014-08-01 20:08:31 UTC
Aerie Evingod wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Strata Maslav wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Sigras wrote:
Please make the modules capital sized (>=4000 m^3) otherwise you may as well just reduce the jump fuel cost of all ships by 25% and call it a day...

If these modules are allowed to be 5 m^3 like most other modules not specifically tied to a ship class then every carrier will just carry around 4-5 of them and insta switch them out when they land.


The currently planned volume of these modules is 3500m3


There doesn't seem to be any specification currently with the fitting to any specific ship. Theoretically you could take a frigate, fit these modules to it and store it inside your carrier. It would still be very difficult to fit these in space still but allow you to refit easily in a station.


Good point, and easy enough to solve. We have the technology.


Stronger? Faster?

Most likely by restricting the fitting to jump capable ships only.

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.

PotatoOverdose
Royal Black Watch Highlanders
#89 - 2014-08-01 21:49:17 UTC  |  Edited by: PotatoOverdose
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Strata Maslav wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Sigras wrote:
Please make the modules capital sized (>=4000 m^3) otherwise you may as well just reduce the jump fuel cost of all ships by 25% and call it a day...

If these modules are allowed to be 5 m^3 like most other modules not specifically tied to a ship class then every carrier will just carry around 4-5 of them and insta switch them out when they land.


The currently planned volume of these modules is 3500m3


There doesn't seem to be any specification currently with the fitting to any specific ship. Theoretically you could take a frigate, fit these modules to it and store it inside your carrier. It would still be very difficult to fit these in space still but allow you to refit easily in a station.


Good point, and easy enough to solve. We have the technology.

When you solve this problem, will they still be able to fit to a blops? Just making sure....

Also I wasn't clear on this: Will the modules affect blops bridges which use normal fuels instead of stront?
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#90 - 2014-08-01 22:39:21 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Strata Maslav wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Sigras wrote:
Please make the modules capital sized (>=4000 m^3) otherwise you may as well just reduce the jump fuel cost of all ships by 25% and call it a day...

If these modules are allowed to be 5 m^3 like most other modules not specifically tied to a ship class then every carrier will just carry around 4-5 of them and insta switch them out when they land.


The currently planned volume of these modules is 3500m3


There doesn't seem to be any specification currently with the fitting to any specific ship. Theoretically you could take a frigate, fit these modules to it and store it inside your carrier. It would still be very difficult to fit these in space still but allow you to refit easily in a station.


Good point, and easy enough to solve. We have the technology.

When you solve this problem, will they still be able to fit to a blops? Just making sure....

Also I wasn't clear on this: Will the modules affect blops bridges which use normal fuels instead of stront?

The last answer I saw was no affects to any bridging. Just the jump-druve
phalanx III
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#91 - 2014-08-01 22:55:38 UTC
Your offering pleases me Fozzie.....
Caleb Seremshur
Naked Oiled Bodybuilders
Parasitic Legion.
#92 - 2014-08-01 23:28:52 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hello everyone. As we mentioned a while back, I've been working on a set of low-slot modules that decrease the fuel requirements of jump drives.

The primary goal here is to provide an interesting set of choices to capital pilots (especially Jump Freighter pilots) in how to fill up their low slots for any given activity.

These modules will require 1 PG and 0 CPU, there will be no limit in how many you can fit to one ship but they are stacking penalized with each other.

Like the Hyperspatial Accelerators, we are starting with three versions of this module. Also like the Accelerators the blueprints for these modules will be found exclusively in Besieged Ghost Sites in low security space.
The rarity will increase with the power between the three modules, and all of them will have a skill requirement of Jump Fuel Conservation 1. These modules all have a volume of 3500m3.

The fuel reduction per module is:
Limited Jump Drive Economizer - 4%
Experimental Jump Drive Economizer - 7%
Prototype Jump Drive Economizer - 10%

I'll let you guys know when these babies hit SISI for your testing pleasure.
Feel free to post your feedback in the thread below.
Thanks!


So instead of addressing things like invincible instadocking JF's or huge migrating cap fleets contributing to power projection we at CCP instead make it easier and cheaper for bigger groups to travel either faster, further or with more stuff over the guy just starting out. Saying that the 'new guy' has the same toolset is a back-handed compliment really - yes the big players naturally have better funding and will never be limited in any serious way towards having what they need but you aren't doing anything to address the fact that the biggest and most expensive ships in the game which are meant to be focal points for fleets and not fleets in and of themselves are the fastest and most versatile.

Here's a suggestion for your pidgeon hole: jump drives now illicit a 10 minute weapons timer. Now capital fleets must commit to a travel fit to travel, or take an entire spare load of combat modules in their cargo bays.

next: capitals cannot use mobile depots to refit (simple, the modules themselves are too big to be handled by such a small depot).

Finally: jump drive consumption should be relative to the size of the vessel. If carriers are used as a base, dreads are 1.5x and titans are an extreme 14x more isotopes per jump.

Remove bridging from the game and/or as another poster said, space out the universe more to further gimp rapid redeployments of entire capital fleets. A cap under the new system jumps optimally 2 systems not 25.
Emma Muutaras
State War Academy
Caldari State
#93 - 2014-08-01 23:59:20 UTC
while i have nothing against the modules saving fuel in my gf/dread hell i'm game.

but i would be a lot more impressed if you re-balanced freighters/jumpfreighters completely, give them highs (highs not vital though at times i do wish i could cloak my JF :p), mids and lows and of cause rigs like every other ship in the game (shuttles/pods not included) and give players the choice to fit there ships properly the 3 lows was a nice start but really it dont give u many options even with a extra module type options are still very limiting
Oxygen o2
Thunderwaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#94 - 2014-08-02 00:02:24 UTC
God this is awful.
Regan Rotineque
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#95 - 2014-08-02 00:24:55 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Altrue wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Sigras wrote:
Please make the modules capital sized (>=4000 m^3) otherwise you may as well just reduce the jump fuel cost of all ships by 25% and call it a day...

If these modules are allowed to be 5 m^3 like most other modules not specifically tied to a ship class then every carrier will just carry around 4-5 of them and insta switch them out when they land.


The currently planned volume of these modules is 3500m3


There should be a smaller subcap version for black ops and maybe future subcap jump capable ships.


Blackops are free to fit them, but they won't be able to swap them into their cargo holds. This is by design.



You had me through this whole thread until this one post Fozzie

I think that there should be a blops version - im not saying we can fit 4 of em and carry them around - but at least one - sized appropriately for a sub capital. But a module that 3500m3 is a capital sized module not something for sub capitals. It basically makes it useless on anything under a capital sized hull.

Please reconsider - as i noted before im not saying make em 5 m3 but something maybe in the 400-500 m3 specifically for the blops would use up over 1/2 of the cargo capacity and still make them a useful and interesting choice.

Current design is not useful for sub caps
Twizted3
Did he say Jump
Dock Workers
#96 - 2014-08-02 01:13:11 UTC
I don't see how others are not saying this module is a terrible idea, at 3500 m3 no one is going to use it, can't carry extra fittings or extra fuel, can't justify using them on blackops because you can't take them off and refit using a depot.

This is basically admitting the fuel change was a bad idea then releasing a module to supposedly fix it, but making the module so huge it isn't worth using, again doesn't effect the big bloc alliances at all because they have the isk to pay for all their pilots fuel, and the resources to put carrier refits at the last jump before getting into combat.

Just put fuel back the way it was and leave it alone. You are making it much much worse.
Skia Aumer
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#97 - 2014-08-02 06:36:40 UTC
Twizted3 wrote:
I don't see how others are not saying this module is a terrible idea, at 3500 m3 no one is going to use it, can't carry extra fittings or extra fuel, can't justify using them on blackops...

Then just dont use them on blackops.
These are designed for JFs.
xplosiv
Doomheim
#98 - 2014-08-02 08:56:24 UTC  |  Edited by: xplosiv
typical CCP ignore the overall picture and only comment on the tiny little thing they are doing. You have screwed with small corps and individuals in 0.0 by making fuel more expensive and the pure amount of it you need to move around and in fact Given the large coalitions help with this change.

Seriously these modules are a kick in the teeth because the people who will get most out of them are yet again the big alliance who can bridge industrials with backup fits or have secondary fits in their forward bases to swap out to.
You guys are making pointless changes that have no effect but bad ones.

You have now encouraged more renters being taken on to mine ice as there rent.
You have screwed up the ability to supply nullsec.
And you taunt some grand plan for making null self sufficient ect but you can't do industry in null because it's now crawling with interceptors, insta lock thrashers, dictors and cloaky camper cyno ships in any high use system.. You want industry in null make it at least possible you complete tards. please for the love of god before you change anything else go and play the game and get some understanding of what is actually happening.
Carniflex
StarHunt
Mordus Angels
#99 - 2014-08-02 09:59:00 UTC
Mariner6 wrote:
Lowsec again? No issue with that I guess but it would be nice if something like this could be seeded in NPC Null only. Might spice things up a bit down here. Some extra small gang incentive would be nice like your doing in lowsec with your clone tags, mordus legion etc etc. But you know....amp it up a bit down here for some more risk/reward aspects. Its been getting quiet around here in Syndicate of late and not much better in other NPC null.


It is indeed a bit odd that CCP is ignoring the NPC null. For all practical purposes NPC null is low sec with bubbles and bombers and titan doomsday's. So CCP should act towards it like a subset of low sec instead of putting it in the same bin with sov null which is a lot different beast.

Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... THWONK! GOT the bastard.

Carniflex
StarHunt
Mordus Angels
#100 - 2014-08-02 10:02:17 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Strata Maslav wrote:

There doesn't seem to be any specification currently with the fitting to any specific ship. Theoretically you could take a frigate, fit these modules to it and store it inside your carrier. It would still be very difficult to fit these in space still but allow you to refit easily in a station.


Good point, and easy enough to solve. We have the technology.



Does it mean that the carrier will need to carry a BLOPS fitted with these to store them Bear?

Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... THWONK! GOT the bastard.