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Which amarr battleship for lvl 4 mission

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Arien Atani
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2011-11-21 13:54:32 UTC
Hello

What would be the reccomended fit\ship for me doing missions in amarr space. I'm limited to tech 1 guns at the moment. So far I have these 2 candidates :


[Armageddon Navy Issue, Armageddon Navy Issue fit long range]

Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Drone Link Augmentor I
Drone Link Augmentor I

Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range

Large Armor Repairer II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
N-Type EM Hardener I
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
Capacitor Power Relay II

Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Hobgoblin I x5
Garde I x5

or

[Abaddon, PvE - Low-skill beam fit]

Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L

Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Tracking Computer II

Large Armor Repairer II
Capacitor Power Relay II
Heat Sink II
N-Type EM Hardener I
N-Type EM Hardener I
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
N-Type Thermic Hardener I

Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Hobgoblin I x5
Hammerhead I x5
Azver Deroven
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2011-11-21 14:39:11 UTC
I will admit that Im by no definition an expert anymore, since I've grown to love my paladin and therefore too distant from the reality of t1 stuff, I will say that you can scrap the geddon as you wont have the tank nor the punch.

As for the rest of the options, what sort of support skills are we looking at? Gunnery / armour / cap ...?

DISCLAIMER: My views do not represent those of my alliance, my corporation or myself. Yes, I can even confuse myself from time to time.
Oxeu
Perkone
Caldari State
#3 - 2011-11-21 15:02:00 UTC
pulse apoc hands down :)

less nice with t1 guns, but still good enough (get those t2 guns asap) good range on the pulses good dps, good tracking.
Nalha Saldana
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2011-11-21 15:04:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Nalha Saldana
If you are going to fly battleships get t2 drones, killing those tackling frigates can be very important sometimes.

I used to fly something like this, its easy to get into, got lots of tank, is cheap and it just works, the dps just aint that great.

[Armageddon, pve t1]
Large Armor Repairer II
Large Armor Repairer II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II
Capacitor Power Relay II
Capacitor Power Relay II
Heat Sink II
Tracking Enhancer II

Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

Dual Modulated Heavy Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L
Dual Modulated Heavy Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L
Dual Modulated Heavy Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L
Dual Modulated Heavy Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L
Dual Modulated Heavy Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L
Dual Modulated Heavy Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L
Dual Modulated Heavy Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L
Drone Link Augmentor I

Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Hobgoblin II x5
Hammerhead II x5
Kristoffon Ellecon
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2011-11-21 15:37:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Kristoffon Ellecon
Both ships aren't suitable for PVE as they lack the capacitor stability.

Best Amarr BS for PVE is the Apoc. Period, end of discussion. Get Navy Issue if you can afford, then the Paladin.

My current PVE fits, swap hardners as necessary:

[Apocalypse, pve beam]

Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Multifrequency L

Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
N-Type Kinetic Hardener I
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
Large 'Accommodation' Vestment Reconstructer I
Damage Control II

Large Ancillary Current Router I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Semiconductor Memory Cell I



[Apocalypse, pve pulse]

Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L

Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Optical Tracking Computer I, Tracking Speed

Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
N-Type Kinetic Hardener I
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
Large 'Accommodation' Vestment Reconstructer I
Damage Control II

Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Gally Alita
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#6 - 2011-11-21 16:03:56 UTC
I use old banana for missioning :o
(Navy Apoc)
Aamrr
#7 - 2011-11-21 18:18:00 UTC
The Apocalypse really excels for low-SP pilots. By the time you've got enough SP to justify flying an Abaddon instead, you should be able to afford a nicer ship anyway.
Anselm Cenobite
Gold Ring Enterprises
#8 - 2011-11-21 18:48:22 UTC
Don't listen to the armageddon haters--at least not if you have good drone skills. The 'geddon works nicely as a sniper ship if you have access to T2 sentries and warp to 70 km of target mission. I'd say a geddon is fine as an L4 mission boat for any mission where you can get some range and blow up scrambling frigates at range. Once you train up to use Large T2 guns with scorch though, the Abbadon will probably displace it in your heart, though.
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#9 - 2011-11-21 18:57:22 UTC
Aamrr wrote:
The Apocalypse really excels for low-SP pilots. By the time you've got enough SP to justify flying an Abaddon instead, you should be able to afford a nicer ship anyway.


This. So much this. The Abaddon is a wonderful, wonderful ship -- if you have the skills to make it work. Which means, more or less, every cap skill in the game plus BS5 and both large energy weapon specs to 4, and probably some excellent tanking skills to top it off. And then you're in either a Nightmare or a Paladin anyhow.

Apocalypse, despite looking patently absurd, is a better mission ship short of that.

Armageddon really does require solid drone skills to even compete, and then you face a choice of exactly how much to focus on those drones versus maintain some modicum of mobility (which is sort of the same issue you face jumping into a Megathron). In some missions it works well. In others, not so much.
Azver Deroven
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2011-11-21 19:22:22 UTC
Well its been said but low-sp, 'poc is the queen (Remember, its a ship. Ergo, she), followed by abaddon. Abaddon is basicly a flying brick that'll facemelt things, but pulsepoc is peanuts to fit and very easy to fly.

And dont go dismissing baddon just because there's paladin and stuff. I still like to hop on baddon just for the sex appeal of its non-bananish looks. And the fact that it looks like a battleship should, so generally its awesome, pretty space-pixels.

Far as the queen is considered, used to fly dual LAR II setup, not sure how it'd pan out these days but basicly overtanks like mofo to the point that you can do missions with your eyes closed, after you get the gist you can rip some tank off, fit for gank and facemelt stuff.

DISCLAIMER: My views do not represent those of my alliance, my corporation or myself. Yes, I can even confuse myself from time to time.
Arien Atani
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2011-11-21 19:50:18 UTC
Thank you for all your replies. Guess I'll go for an apoc then. What would you reccomend - pulse or beams? Why not tacyons? How much different is the navy apoc compared to the regular one?
Aamrr
#12 - 2011-11-21 19:58:09 UTC
Until you have access to T2 pulse lasers (and scorch crystals), use beam lasers. Tachyons consume too much powergrid and capacitor for a reasonable fitting, and their poor tracking coefficients are ill-suited to new pilots anyway.

Navy Apocalypse is really better suited to PvP than PvE, as one of its primary advantage is more hit points. Nevertheless, it will offer an additional slot over its T1 counterpart, and I think has modestly improved capacitor regeneration.
Alara IonStorm
#13 - 2011-11-21 20:44:12 UTC
Arien Atani wrote:
Thank you for all your replies. Guess I'll go for an apoc then. What would you reccomend - pulse or beams? Why not tacyons? How much different is the navy apoc compared to the regular one?

Megabeam for now, Megapulse when you have T2 Turrets as Scorch is your range.

If you can not fit a whole Rack then fit 7 Beam or add a Axillary Current Router Rig for more grid.
Buzzmong
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2011-11-21 20:52:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Buzzmong
Anyone else think it's odd that OP is planning on using a Navy ship but can't use T2 guns?

I know you can grow into them, but I would suggest a normal T1 apoc first, fit with megabeams until you get T2 Pulses.


Also, while I'm talking about Apocs, here's a pretty much cookiecutter T2 Pulsepoc:

Highs:
8x Mega Pulse II

w/ Imp Navy Multfreq + Scorch. I also carry around a set of Imp Navy X-Ray for the awkward ships that sit at 35-45k where Scorch is a waste to use.

Meds:
3x Cap Charger II
1x Tracking Comp (Range script)

Lows:
3x Heatsinks
3x Active Hardener II
1x Faction Rep (Dark Blood or Imp Navy, both identical, I tend to find DB is ~95 mil and ImpN ~115mil on Contracts)

Rigs:
1/2 Large CCC to get stable.


Faction Rep is needed on this fit even with max fitting skills due to CPU shortage. Can use T2 LAR and a faction heatsink or two if you want though.

Of course, rather than spending 100m on a rep, you could just sink it into a Navy Apoc instead. Horses for courses.
Alara IonStorm
#15 - 2011-11-21 21:08:14 UTC
Buzzmong wrote:

Faction Rep is needed on this fit even with max fitting skills due to CPU shortage. Can use T2 LAR and a faction heatsink or two if you want though.

Of course, rather than spending 100m on a rep, you could just sink it into a Navy Apoc instead. Horses for courses.

You can cut a couple CCC Rigs for Nano Pumps and use a Domination Large Armor Repair. They don't repair as much as a T2 Rep but they use much less cap freeing up rig slots for Nano Pumps.

They only cost 20mil or 25% the cost of an Imp Navy Repair.
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#16 - 2011-11-21 21:12:22 UTC
Arien Atani wrote:
Thank you for all your replies. Guess I'll go for an apoc then. What would you reccomend - pulse or beams? Why not tacyons? How much different is the navy apoc compared to the regular one?


As has been mentioned, beams work better until you get T2 pulses and can use Scorch for range. The Apoc comes into its own with that setup.

Megabeams are usually the best balance between fitting and damage. Tachs work but almost require a Reactor Control II -- which in turn requires Energy Upgrades 5, which is often something newer pilots are lacking (which makes sense considering the only thing you get from it is the RCU II). They also consume metric assloads of cap, which can be problematic.

This is a sample megabeam setup. It's cap stable with my skills (barely):

[Apocalypse, Missions beams mega?]
Large 'Accommodation' Vestment Reconstructer I
Armor EM Hardener II
Armor EM Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II

Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L

Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I


Hammerhead II x5

Though you don't need cap stability. An Imperial Navy LAR would do just as well on fitting. Swapping a rig for an ACR would also help if you run short on grid.

I haven't played with the NApoc (I'm serious: I hate the hull design) but it should work similarly, but the extra low will help you a bit on fitting. Might as well try it if you can afford one.
Arien Atani
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2011-11-21 21:13:03 UTC
Buzzmong wrote:
Anyone else think it's odd that OP is planning on using a Navy Apoc but can't use T1 guns?

I know you can grow into them, but I would suggest a normal T1 apoc first.


Hello, thanks for your reply.

I have actually been using an regular apoc on lvl 4 missions for some time, and I can now afford (and if so, afford to loose it), and it seems that the extra hp and slots is a nice addition.

Its seems i get more dps with megabeams - have to use one pdu.

Is this a decent fit? 462 dps + drones and 55k ehp


[Apocalypse Navy Issue, Apocalypse Navy Issue fit copy]

Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L

Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Optical Tracking Computer I, Tracking Speed

Large Armor Repairer II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
N-Type EM Hardener I
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
Power Diagnostic System II

Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Hammerhead I x5
Hobgoblin I x5
Alara IonStorm
#18 - 2011-11-21 21:35:38 UTC
You can replace a CCC Rig with a ACU and the PDU with a Cap Power Relay, same effect but you get more Cap out of the Power Relay. It might free up enough to allow you to add another TC or an Aux Nano Pump.
Buzzmong
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2011-11-21 21:42:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Buzzmong
I feel I need to add an addition to what I said about using an imp Navy/Dark Blood LAR:

Apart from the CPU gain needed for my fit and the added 100HP per cycle, they do also free up a good 300 PG over the T2 variant, obviously that might let you squeeze mega beams on without the PDU/PDS/ACR.

Possibly. I'm not going to dl EFT just to check that one out.

If you can't tell, I'm quite taken with them, as cost is the only downside.
Arien Atani
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2011-11-21 22:03:17 UTC
Thanks again good people of New Eden

This is what ive gotten thanks to all your help

cap stable at 42% - 462 dps without drones - 54.4k ehp - with 150 power to spare - just need to get AWU one lvl higher Smile


[Apocalypse Navy Issue, Apocalypse Navy Issue fit]

Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Modulated Energy Beam I, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L

Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Optical Tracking Computer I, Tracking Speed

Large Armor Repairer II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
N-Type EM Hardener I
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
Capacitor Power Relay II

Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Hammerhead I x5
Hobgoblin I x5
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