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[I-RED] "Project Dustbowl" DECLASSIFIED

Author
Elmund Egivand
Biohazard.
#41 - 2014-07-30 06:39:15 UTC
Jinari Otsito wrote:
So it turns out a little Caldari pragmatism can make even the Empire's dodderings useful. That's both scary and reassuring.


Really admirable traits we can learn from.

A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.

Diana Kim
Blue Canary
The Birdhouse
#42 - 2014-07-30 14:48:35 UTC
In short...

While the State wages war and requires all the resources to deal with external threat, or at least to support our own colonies and our own peoples, this I-RED organization prefers to EMBEZZLE Caldari resources on JAIJII outside even of State territorial zones of interest.

I would like to remind everyone, that I-RED were always hiding from serving their duty to the State, and lately - in null security space, and at one point, they were even official blue and flying together with Federal militia.

Everyone who affiliates with this corporation are under direct threat of becoming traitors and enemies of the State, and are strongly advised to review their contracts.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Anslo
Scope Works
#43 - 2014-07-30 14:59:55 UTC
You're already a traitor for your provist association. Your opinion literally means jack ****. Also they're spreading state influence well beyond the bounds of any other group. While you waste time on systems going back and forth, they bypass the pointless war act system and strike out to nul to sow seeds of what may well be future systems of the state.

So yeah they're doing more than you. Nice try though.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]

Jinari Otsito
Otsito Mining and Manufacture
#44 - 2014-07-30 15:04:37 UTC
How can you manage to be raised and educated by the State and still not grasp basic principles like expanding markets, resource exploitation and consolidating territory? What they're doing in Syndicate damn near epitomizes every core value we hold dear in the State, unlike your nutbag "kill the feddies raarrrr!" spiel, seriously.

Among the many duties citizens of the State have, fighting in the militias is somewhere near the bottom.

Prime Node. Ask me about augmentation.

Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#45 - 2014-07-30 15:07:04 UTC
Also, if we're going to talk about embezzling State funds... Who was the guy indicted for the largest case of embezzlement again? Just recently... Hoth.... Hath...

Oh, no. It was Heth.

And didn't he also seize everyone elses Black Rise systems, too?

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.

Katrina Oniseki
Oniseki-Raata Internal Watch
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#46 - 2014-07-30 15:52:23 UTC
Let's be honest. Did any of us expect her to leave an intelligent comment here?

Yes Kimmie Kims, we are the very bads. I-RED not knowings how State! Please teach us the Caldarians!

Katrina Oniseki

Diana Kim
Blue Canary
The Birdhouse
#47 - 2014-07-30 15:58:14 UTC
Anslo wrote:
You're already a traitor for your provist association. Your opinion literally means jack ****. Also they're spreading state influence well beyond the bounds of any other group. While you waste time on systems going back and forth, they bypass the pointless war act system and strike out to nul to sow seeds of what may well be future systems of the state.

So yeah they're doing more than you. Nice try though.

And you are a gallentean ignorant.
First. I never betrayed the State.
Second, they did.
Third, they hide in practically useless nullsec.
Fourth, the State is in war.
Five, I never heard a meaningful opinion from YOU yet.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Diana Kim
Blue Canary
The Birdhouse
#48 - 2014-07-30 16:04:11 UTC
Jinari Otsito wrote:
How can you manage to be raised and educated by the State and still not grasp basic principles like expanding markets, resource exploitation and consolidating territory? What they're doing in Syndicate damn near epitomizes every core value we hold dear in the State, unlike your nutbag "kill the feddies raarrrr!" spiel, seriously.

Among the many duties citizens of the State have, fighting in the militias is somewhere near the bottom.

Oh, I understand principles of expanding markets and resource exploitation very well, and its't not about my grasping of these principles but about your ignorance and lack of awareness about what is going on around the State.
Or it isn't ignorance and just your traitorous behaviour, how you neglect interests of all Caldari peoples and mock at the war, that State fights, and fights for future of our (obviously not your anymore) nation.

Luckily, everything you can do, is just open your mouth and belch that nonsense, while what we do here, is protecting the State and the values of Caldari people by actions. And we will succeed, while your ilk will disappear in time and die out.

Glory to the State!

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Diana Kim
Blue Canary
The Birdhouse
#49 - 2014-07-30 16:05:22 UTC
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
Also, if we're going to talk about embezzling State funds... Who was the guy indicted for the largest case of embezzlement again? Just recently... Hoth.... Hath...

Oh, no. It was Heth.

And didn't he also seize everyone elses Black Rise systems, too?

You are talking like anti-Caldari traitor now.
Heth-haan used money to wage war for future and prosperity of all Caldari.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Diana Kim
Blue Canary
The Birdhouse
#50 - 2014-07-30 16:07:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Diana Kim
Katrina Oniseki wrote:
Let's be honest. Did any of us expect her to leave an intelligent comment here?

Yes Kimmie Kims, we are the very bads. I-RED not knowings how State! Please teach us the Caldarians!

Ms. Oniseki, thank you for you... "intelligent comment".
I would prefer instead talking to someone, who wrote your this report that you posted in this board.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Claudia Osyn
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#51 - 2014-07-30 16:57:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Claudia Osyn
Diana Kim wrote:
Katrina Oniseki wrote:
Let's be honest. Did any of us expect her to leave an intelligent comment here?

Yes Kimmie Kims, we are the very bads. I-RED not knowings how State! Please teach us the Caldarians!

Ms. Oniseki, thank you for you... "intelligent comment".
I would prefer to instead talking to someone, who wrote your this report that you posted in this board.

Honest question, Kimmy, and I'm not trying to be offensive. What do you gain from this? I-RED basically just indebted several colonies to their corporations, and thus the state. There are more ways to beat your enemy then just shooting them, and I-RED employ them very well.

A little trust goes a long way. The less you use, the further you'll go.

Diana Kim
Blue Canary
The Birdhouse
#52 - 2014-07-30 17:51:29 UTC
Claudia Osyn wrote:

Honest question, Kimmy, and I'm not trying to be offensive. What do you gain from this? I-RED basically just indebted several colonies to their corporations, and thus the state. There are more ways to beat your enemy then just shooting them, and I-RED employ them very well.

Ms. Osyn, neither Intaki, nor Syndicate, nor even pirates Serpentis are at war with the State, while the Federation is. And the State fights for Caldari people, not for people of Syndicate. They are already free from Federal occupation, while many other Intakis are still held as federal puppets.

What do I want to gain? This is rather simple. I want for every available personnel and resource was used in interests of the State and Caldari people, and not in interests of semi-criminal jaijii and paramilitary mercenary corporation, that claims to be "Caldari", while in fact evading service to the State and making ties to enemies of the State.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Claudia Osyn
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#53 - 2014-07-30 20:22:43 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
Claudia Osyn wrote:

Honest question, Kimmy, and I'm not trying to be offensive. What do you gain from this? I-RED basically just indebted several colonies to their corporations, and thus the state. There are more ways to beat your enemy then just shooting them, and I-RED employ them very well.

Ms. Osyn, neither Intaki, nor Syndicate, nor even pirates Serpentis are at war with the State, while the Federation is. And the State fights for Caldari people, not for people of Syndicate. They are already free from Federal occupation, while many other Intakis are still held as federal puppets.

What do I want to gain? This is rather simple. I want for every available personnel and resource was used in interests of the State and Caldari people, and not in interests of semi-criminal jaijii and paramilitary mercenary corporation, that claims to be "Caldari", while in fact evading service to the State and making ties to enemies of the State.

The Intaki are part of the Federation, so warring with the Feds means warring with the Intaki. That aside, from my perspective, I-RED has done more to hurt Gallente war efforts then the entirety of the FW fleets by befriending our allies and internal factions, thus taking the proverbial wind from our sails on the battlefield. Their PR department has kept at least as many Federation assets of the field to begin with as you have destroyed. So, are they traitors because they don't serve in the same capacity as you?

A little trust goes a long way. The less you use, the further you'll go.

Diana Kim
Blue Canary
The Birdhouse
#54 - 2014-07-30 21:38:19 UTC
Claudia Osyn wrote:

The Intaki are part of the Federation, so warring with the Feds means warring with the Intaki.

Ms. Osyn.... should I put on my professor glasses and make some educational lectures again for gallenteans, who are taught nothing but vote in their schools?
Or maybe we could make a gallentean actually think? Lets make an experiment.

Okay, Ms. Osyn. Could you answer a set of easy question:
Who are Syndicate?
What are main nationality of peoples in Syndicate?
Is Syndicate part of Federation?

Who are Mordu legion?
What are their nationality?
Whom Mordu fight with and against during previous Caldar-Gallente war two hundred years ago?

Claudia Osyn wrote:
That aside, from my perspective, I-RED has done more to hurt Gallente war efforts then the entirety of the FW fleets by befriending our allies and internal factions, thus taking the proverbial wind from our sails on the battlefield. Their PR department has kept at least as many Federation assets of the field to begin with as you have destroyed.

Ms. Osyn... I feel you have a bit too vivid imagination.
The only thing what I-RED did, is pulling resources to null security space.

We need ships, we need weapons, we need pilots, we need capsuleers, and we need loyal citizens.
Whatever they do, Caldari do not need.

And I would recommend looking at things straight, as they are, with... proper... perspective, and not through broken mirror. Thanks.

Claudia Osyn wrote:
So, are they traitors because they don't serve in the same capacity as you?

*sigh*
No, Ms. Osyn.
They are traitors, because they were flying under banner of gallente militia.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Bryen Verrisai
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#55 - 2014-07-30 21:49:05 UTC
Claudia Osyn wrote:
That aside, from my perspective, I-RED has done more to hurt Gallente war efforts then the entirety of the FW fleets by befriending our allies and internal factions

All due respect to I-RED, that's giving them a little too much credit here. They helped out a few down-in-the-dumps planetary colonies that Syndicate couldn't be moved to give a damn about. That's certainly very nice and speaks well to the character of the corporation, but it doesn't really do much more than that.
Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#56 - 2014-07-30 22:07:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Fredfredbug4
Katrina Oniseki wrote:
Access denied. Oh, and, stay out of Syndicate for the safety of yourself and crew.

There is no crisis. There is only progress.


Translation: Everything is fine! Nothing to see here! Everything is fine! Nothing to see here!

The choice of the word "sterilized" does have some interesting connotations. Are you referring to the destruction of pirate entities? Those would certainly be noble and just. Though, one does have to consider the negative implications of the word. Did you render the settlement infertile so they will die out in a generation? Or are they already all dead?

The fact that you are acting quite hostile to a Federal investigation, be it an independent capsuleer or a government agency suggest that there is something to hide.

From what I'm reading, this is a takeover of an area under the guise of humanitarian aid. Expunging local culture? Check. Destabilizing local economies for your benefit? Check. Forced religious conversions? Check. Violent suppression of those who "breached the contract"? Check.

I can see the inevitable counter to my accusations already. "Doesn't the Federation do the same thing?" No, not at all. While the Federation is quite imperialist, we do things differently. We bring people to the Federation, rather than bring the Federation to them. You'll find that Jin Mei, Matari, Mannar, and even Loyal Intaki retain their culture, values, and in some cases, their own politics and currencies. These wonderful things are added to the Federation, instead of removed from these States.

Of course, it's impossible to deny that you helped these people in a lot of ways. I applaud I-RED for taking the initiative to make the lives of (some) people better. However, I condemn you for having ulterior motives behind it.

Usually I'm quite fond of I-RED, though this time I'm having uneasy feelings about what has happened. Hopefully, time will prove me wrong as I normally consider I-RED to be the model of what being a good Caldari corporation is. Though that opinion will certainly change if more Caldari military vessels begin to appear in the region, or if reports of Gallenteans being attacked by Syndicate groups armed with Caldari weaponry start to surface.

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!

Bryen Verrisai
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#57 - 2014-07-30 22:15:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Bryen Verrisai
The only thing that struck me as particularly sketchy in the announcement was the fact that I-RED was aware that the contracts they were having signed were not actually valid, and that they withheld that information from the signers.

And on second review, the apparent mocking of freedom and liberty by Ms. Oniseki seems rather petty and, frankly, ill-informed to the point that I'm wondering whether it is simply meant to be taken in jest.

And further, the announcement notes that the colonies that failed to comply to the standards set by the contracts signed were penalized. But because the contracts were null and void in the first place, what grounds did I-RED actually have to take legal punitive action against the "offending" parties? Perhaps I'm mistaken, but from where I'm standing I-RED has just confessed to engaging in piracy, extortion, and likely murder.
Claudia Osyn
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#58 - 2014-07-30 22:26:12 UTC
Bryen Verrisai wrote:
Claudia Osyn wrote:
That aside, from my perspective, I-RED has done more to hurt Gallente war efforts then the entirety of the FW fleets by befriending our allies and internal factions

All due respect to I-RED, that's giving them a little too much credit here. They helped out a few down-in-the-dumps planetary colonies that Syndicate couldn't be moved to give a damn about. That's certainly very nice and speaks well to the character of the corporation, but it doesn't really do much more than that.

Ok, it is a bit exaggerated, but not by too much. Looking at what happens in the FW zone, and the impact it has on the cluster, I-RED has had a larger impact on the relationships of our empires then all of that just by making the Caldari look good. Nobody but the capsuleers involved in that war care about it. I never hear about stunning victorys one faction achieved over the other, or what it means for the empires. A couple of gatecamps is all I have ever seen of it. I-RED on the other hand I hear about more frequently, and it's normally involving deals brokered by them to bring our empires closer together. (Even if the endgame is improving their bottom line.)


As for Kimmy, the Intaki are part of the Federation. A portion of them did support the Caldari when they ceded from the Federation, but they as a people remain citizens. A Galnet search can verify this if you don't believe me. As for comparing them to the syndicate and Mordu's legion, those are both privately owned corps, not comparable to a race of people.

A little trust goes a long way. The less you use, the further you'll go.

Nicoletta Mithra
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#59 - 2014-07-30 22:58:11 UTC
Fredfredbug4 wrote:
The fact that you are acting quite hostile to a Federal investigation, be it an independent capsuleer or a government agency suggest that there is something to hide.

It might alternately simply suggest that they don't treat hostile governments and their citizens as if they'd deserve to be recieved with a red carpet rolled out for them. I-RED is under no obligation to allow Federal investigations and you demanding tsuch instead of e.g. requesting a tour, is certainly not putting them in the mood to cater to your wishes. Quite understandably so.

Having had a look at some of these colonies, I got the impression that those that held up their sides of the contracts benefitted admirably. These places were not the kind of easily romanticised civilizations the Federation likes to put as feathers on it's hat. They did real work there to improve the situation of the average joe, who previously was at the mercy of criminals. I mean, it's not like there was much of a 'local economy' to destabilize, unless you mean pirate-run extortion rings. Sure, if you ask me I'd say I-RED benefitted as well, but why do you Federals have this idea that humanitarian aid is only okay if the side providing it doesn't make a profit? The best aid is mutually beneficial.

And it's not like I-RED just financed the economical build-up of those previously God-forsaken places, they also provided aid in civilizing these former pirate holes by bringing in help for developing the cultural and ethical foundation necessary for any civilized society to thrive.
Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#60 - 2014-07-30 23:17:43 UTC
Nicoletta Mithra wrote:

It might alternately simply suggest that they don't treat hostile governments and their citizens as if they'd deserve to be recieved with a red carpet rolled out for them. I-RED is under no obligation to allow Federal investigations and you demanding tsuch instead of e.g. requesting a tour, is certainly not putting them in the mood to cater to your wishes. Quite understandably so.


Would they be open to an investigation from a Caldari or Amarr source then? I'm sure that could easily be arranged. For a report labeled as "Declassified" there appears to be a lot of censorship.

Quote:
Having had a look at some of these colonies, I got the impression that those that held up their sides of the contracts benefitted admirably. These places were not the kind of easily romanticised civilizations the Federation likes to put as feathers on it's hat. They did real work there to improve the situation of the average joe, who previously was at the mercy of criminals. I mean, it's not like there was much of a 'local economy' to destabilize, unless you mean pirate-run extortion rings. Sure, if you ask me I'd say I-RED benefitted as well, but why do you Federals have this idea that humanitarian aid is only okay if the side providing it doesn't make a profit? The best aid is mutually beneficial.


It's wonderful that they removed pirate influence, don't get me wrong. However, not all of these places were at the mercy of pirates. Oh sure, this starts off as "mutually beneficial", but as time goes on, not so much. Now I-RED has several colonies of indentured servants who will do their bidding whenever they play the "look at how much we helped you!" card.

Quote:
And it's not like I-RED just financed the economical build-up of those previously God-forsaken places, they also provided aid in civilizing these former pirate holes by bringing in help for developing the cultural and ethical foundation necessary for any civilized society to thrive.


From the report, it looks the the "civilizing" was done by the Amarrians. That excuse hasn't ended well for the people being "civilized" in the past.

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!