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EVE has a problem with its reputation. What can or should be done?

First post
Author
Snakes-On-A-Plane
#381 - 2014-07-18 17:41:39 UTC
Ria Nieyli wrote:
Well I guess Tech II tank mods and rigs, which have had their prcies drop markedly over the years don't exist.

DPS per isk has increased much more than EHP per isk, when not counting fleet boosts. Which we really shouldn't be, for this discussion.

But at least now we're talking about balance, rather than dismissing the discussion. That was sort of my point, here.
ChironV
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#382 - 2014-07-18 17:45:15 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
ChironV wrote:
Problem most game developers, including CCP, have is they see the game from a perspective of co-operation and good natured playing. This mostly comes from the fact that as they test it they are familiar with and possibly friends with the other developers. This blindsides them to the actuality of complete anonymity and the d-bag quotient. When people know one another they are polite, due to potential real life consequences.
Take a normal person, give them complete anonymity and an open sandbox game format, and you wind up with some people's inner d-bag having an outlet.
Given that the game has this reputation, it has, over the years, attracted players who are d-bag's, sociopaths and borderline psychopaths. They may be totally stand up people when you meet them in real life but deep in their minds they have that inner d-bag and Eve lets them free it for a time before they have to reign it in to behave in polite society. So in reality they are d-bags pretending to be polite folks.
However the bulk of the players are normal folk who, hop on, pew pew, mine or whatnot and log off. Its only the last 10% who spin elaborate scams, taking pleasure from being able to make other players miserable. Unfortunately the internet community is full of people who like to complain and or tout their latest scam victims so as a result Eve has developed the perception that it is a game full of d-bags.
It is unlikely that CCP will change the game. So the onus is on us as the players to be positive about the game. We should also judge our own actions and make sure we are not behaving like a sociopath sadist due to the anonymity factor.
Since this game is anonymous the ONLY person we have to answer to is ourselves. If you are holding a pod for ransom, are you doing it for the money or are you doing it because you get a thrill taunting and listening to some guy beg for his pod.

In short we need more news of huge battles and less news of scammers and Fan Fests where a potentially suicidal person is trolled and taunted by other players or another fan fest where a sculpture dedicated to the players is defaced by said players.


Being a pirate in a game that advertises you can be a pirate does not make you a d-bag, sociopath or a psycopath.


Missed the point. You can play a pirate, hold pods for ransom, gank miners and generally be a terror. If you play a pirate and spend your time taunting, trolling and making another persons life miserable while they are in the game because you get off on it then yeah you are a minor sadist or sociopath. I've been popped by pirates before and if they catch me flatfooted with a clean gank I will send them a "Ouch, good gank dude. :)" Often times we strike up a chat if they are normal folk. If I encounter a sociopath I will be met with taunts and trolls but I dont bite, which makes them angry because they are doing piracy to drink in the tears and misery of their victims. I don't want the game changed. We as players just need to try and have some empathy and treat each other a little better. That will make the game seem less like a "cyber bully party" and more like an epic contest.
Ria Nieyli
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#383 - 2014-07-18 17:47:19 UTC
Snakes-On-A-Plane wrote:
Ria Nieyli wrote:
Well I guess Tech II tank mods and rigs, which have had their prcies drop markedly over the years don't exist.

DPS per isk has increased much more than EHP per isk, when not counting fleet boosts. Which we really shouldn't be, for this discussion.

But at least now we're talking about balance, rather than dismissing the discussion. That was sort of my point, here.


And ship base hp has increased and barges got buffed and and and and
Snakes-On-A-Plane
#384 - 2014-07-18 18:04:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Snakes-On-A-Plane
Ria Nieyli wrote:
Snakes-On-A-Plane wrote:
Ria Nieyli wrote:
Well I guess Tech II tank mods and rigs, which have had their prcies drop markedly over the years don't exist.

DPS per isk has increased much more than EHP per isk, when not counting fleet boosts. Which we really shouldn't be, for this discussion.

But at least now we're talking about balance, rather than dismissing the discussion. That was sort of my point, here.


And ship base hp has increased and barges got buffed and and and and

Yeah, these are fair points. I'm not really prepared to argue the specific balance issues, to be honest. I'll leave that to someone else. Besides, I think it's more complex than this anyway. The meta can make imbalance out of balance.

The point I was trying to make is that dismissing discussions of balance under the onus of the opposition being carebears that aren't worth listening to, is not really a fair argument. It's actually sort of disingenuous IMO, since HS ganking is fairly carebearish and risk-adverse in it's own right.

IMO anyway. Not like anyone has to agree.

Edit:
I'm going to bow out of the discussion as it's eating too much time.
I've made the point I wanted to make, and either people agree or they don't - as is their right.
Cannibal Kane
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#385 - 2014-07-18 18:09:17 UTC
ChironV wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
ChironV wrote:
Problem most game developers, including CCP, have is they see the game from a perspective of co-operation and good natured playing. This mostly comes from the fact that as they test it they are familiar with and possibly friends with the other developers. This blindsides them to the actuality of complete anonymity and the d-bag quotient. When people know one another they are polite, due to potential real life consequences.
Take a normal person, give them complete anonymity and an open sandbox game format, and you wind up with some people's inner d-bag having an outlet.
Given that the game has this reputation, it has, over the years, attracted players who are d-bag's, sociopaths and borderline psychopaths. They may be totally stand up people when you meet them in real life but deep in their minds they have that inner d-bag and Eve lets them free it for a time before they have to reign it in to behave in polite society. So in reality they are d-bags pretending to be polite folks.
However the bulk of the players are normal folk who, hop on, pew pew, mine or whatnot and log off. Its only the last 10% who spin elaborate scams, taking pleasure from being able to make other players miserable. Unfortunately the internet community is full of people who like to complain and or tout their latest scam victims so as a result Eve has developed the perception that it is a game full of d-bags.
It is unlikely that CCP will change the game. So the onus is on us as the players to be positive about the game. We should also judge our own actions and make sure we are not behaving like a sociopath sadist due to the anonymity factor.
Since this game is anonymous the ONLY person we have to answer to is ourselves. If you are holding a pod for ransom, are you doing it for the money or are you doing it because you get a thrill taunting and listening to some guy beg for his pod.

In short we need more news of huge battles and less news of scammers and Fan Fests where a potentially suicidal person is trolled and taunted by other players or another fan fest where a sculpture dedicated to the players is defaced by said players.


Being a pirate in a game that advertises you can be a pirate does not make you a d-bag, sociopath or a psycopath.


Missed the point. You can play a pirate, hold pods for ransom, gank miners and generally be a terror. If you play a pirate and spend your time taunting, trolling and making another persons life miserable while they are in the game because you get off on it then yeah you are a minor sadist or sociopath. I've been popped by pirates before and if they catch me flatfooted with a clean gank I will send them a "Ouch, good gank dude. :)" Often times we strike up a chat if they are normal folk. If I encounter a sociopath I will be met with taunts and trolls but I dont bite, which makes them angry because they are doing piracy to drink in the tears and misery of their victims. I don't want the game changed. We as players just need to try and have some empathy and treat each other a little better. That will make the game seem less like a "cyber bully party" and more like an epic contest.


oh good.. that means I am just a terror then.

So all those people that called me a sociopath was wrong since I never troll or taunt.

"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk

Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight
The Devil's Warrior Alliance
#386 - 2014-07-18 18:15:23 UTC
ChironV wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
ChironV wrote:
Problem most game developers, including CCP, have is they see the game from a perspective of co-operation and good natured playing. This mostly comes from the fact that as they test it they are familiar with and possibly friends with the other developers. This blindsides them to the actuality of complete anonymity and the d-bag quotient. When people know one another they are polite, due to potential real life consequences.
Take a normal person, give them complete anonymity and an open sandbox game format, and you wind up with some people's inner d-bag having an outlet.
Given that the game has this reputation, it has, over the years, attracted players who are d-bag's, sociopaths and borderline psychopaths. They may be totally stand up people when you meet them in real life but deep in their minds they have that inner d-bag and Eve lets them free it for a time before they have to reign it in to behave in polite society. So in reality they are d-bags pretending to be polite folks.
However the bulk of the players are normal folk who, hop on, pew pew, mine or whatnot and log off. Its only the last 10% who spin elaborate scams, taking pleasure from being able to make other players miserable. Unfortunately the internet community is full of people who like to complain and or tout their latest scam victims so as a result Eve has developed the perception that it is a game full of d-bags.
It is unlikely that CCP will change the game. So the onus is on us as the players to be positive about the game. We should also judge our own actions and make sure we are not behaving like a sociopath sadist due to the anonymity factor.
Since this game is anonymous the ONLY person we have to answer to is ourselves. If you are holding a pod for ransom, are you doing it for the money or are you doing it because you get a thrill taunting and listening to some guy beg for his pod.

In short we need more news of huge battles and less news of scammers and Fan Fests where a potentially suicidal person is trolled and taunted by other players or another fan fest where a sculpture dedicated to the players is defaced by said players.


Being a pirate in a game that advertises you can be a pirate does not make you a d-bag, sociopath or a psycopath.


Missed the point. You can play a pirate, hold pods for ransom, gank miners and generally be a terror. If you play a pirate and spend your time taunting, trolling and making another persons life miserable while they are in the game because you get off on it then yeah you are a minor sadist or sociopath. I've been popped by pirates before and if they catch me flatfooted with a clean gank I will send them a "Ouch, good gank dude. :)" Often times we strike up a chat if they are normal folk. If I encounter a sociopath I will be met with taunts and trolls but I dont bite, which makes them angry because they are doing piracy to drink in the tears and misery of their victims. I don't want the game changed. We as players just need to try and have some empathy and treat each other a little better. That will make the game seem less like a "cyber bully party" and more like an epic contest.

Seems to me, you have an issue with arseholes, not eve.
Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#387 - 2014-07-18 18:23:02 UTC
Hi Snakes,

Just wanted to say that your avatar is a decent doppelgänger of Mr. Jackson. Good job!

Snakes-On-A-Plane wrote:

HS Ganking is not really PVP though, at least not in the sense that it includes the connotations we normally associate with PVP.
It's sort of equivocating.
I mean it's technically player vs player. But it is dissimilar from what most people consider pvp in a number of ways:


  • It has no significant expectation of risk, or unforeseen consequences.
"Expectation of risk" and "unforseen consequences" is not relevant in this case. The HS ganker is the EVE equivalent of a kamikaze pilot. Destruction of the ship and even a pod kill aren't unforseen because the ganker has made the uncharacteristic choice to die as a result of PVP. I think you have to appreciate the opponent who's willing to engage in something that will 100% kill his ship and likely his pod.

You can argue that everyone has clones and infinite lives, but that's true of people fighting in nullsec, too. That's what the game is. The ganker does have risk and consequences. Your statement just marginalizes his choices because the ganker accepts grave consequences as a prerequisite to his style of play.


Quote:
  • It doesn't require a great deal of skill.
  • There is a lower barrier of skill (player skill and SP) to the activity, sure. So does tackling in null or rookie logistics piloting. It's not to say that these "low skill" professions don't have a lot of impact to activities in EVE.

    One could almost argue that it's "efficient" content creation. These guys don't have to fly T3s or caps to have a big impact.


    Quote:
  • It's almost completely safe from the intrusion of other players.
  • This is a choice made by other PVPers in hisec. What is true is that the network of folks looking to prevent ganks and protect non-combat pilots in highsec are often unwilling to go kamikaze or take risks with their ships and pods in order to foil ganks. A lot of folks are more interested in getting free kills when gankers turn flashy.. which has no real impact on the act of ganking itself.

    This is also true because the overwhelming majority of non-combat pilots are often not thankful, don't even communicate in Local, reject conversations, and don't compensate their would-be protectors with a single ISK.

    Ganking is safe from intrusion because:
    1) Ganking is typically a social activity. There is strength in numbers
    2) The social activity of ganking is put in opposition against what is typically solo activity: anti-ganking, hauling, mining


    Quote:
  • It's just a numbers game. You can work out everything you need to be successful as a HS ganker on a spreadsheet.


  • I would say that this statement is not correct with ECM, ECCM involved.

    Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.

    ChironV
    Deep Core Mining Inc.
    Caldari State
    #388 - 2014-07-18 18:54:59 UTC
    Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
    ChironV wrote:
    baltec1 wrote:
    ChironV wrote:
    *SNIP* It is unlikely that CCP will change the game. So the onus is on us as the players to be positive about the game. We should also judge our own actions and make sure we are not behaving like a sociopath sadist due to the anonymity factor.
    Since this game is anonymous the ONLY person we have to answer to is ourselves. If you are holding a pod for ransom, are you doing it for the money or are you doing it because you get a thrill taunting and listening to some guy beg for his pod.

    In short we need more news of huge battles and less news of scammers and Fan Fests where a potentially suicidal person is trolled and taunted by other players or another fan fest where a sculpture dedicated to the players is defaced by said players.


    Being a pirate in a game that advertises you can be a pirate does not make you a d-bag, sociopath or a psycopath.


    Missed the point. You can play a pirate, hold pods for ransom, gank miners and generally be a terror. If you play a pirate and spend your time taunting, trolling and making another persons life miserable while they are in the game because you get off on it then yeah you are a minor sadist or sociopath. I've been popped by pirates before and if they catch me flatfooted with a clean gank I will send them a "Ouch, good gank dude. :)" Often times we strike up a chat if they are normal folk. If I encounter a sociopath I will be met with taunts and trolls but I dont bite, which makes them angry because they are doing piracy to drink in the tears and misery of their victims. I don't want the game changed. We as players just need to try and have some empathy and treat each other a little better. That will make the game seem less like a "cyber bully party" and more like an epic contest.

    Seems to me, you have an issue with arseholes, not eve.


    No, not really. I've been playing eve since 2004, and you learn to not feed the arseholes. However I could see some kid getting cyber-bullied by some arseholes in game and committing suicide. Last thing CCP needs is that sort of negative publicity posted all over the news. Parents would pull their kids out of the game and generally associate CCP with making games that make kids commit suicide. Sound stupid? Yeah, well that's the the way US fear-mongering news rolls.

    Shizuken
    Venerated Stars
    #389 - 2014-07-18 18:57:25 UTC
    Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
    This has been proven false by the massive spikes and lulls in subs of the past. None of which appear to have any reliance on how much money CCP was making at the time, nor did the quality of work reflect it. As an example, Odyssey came on the heels of their most successful expansion ever, Retribution. It was, by nearly every metric, a flop.


    Bad expansions have more to do with management decisions than the quality or quantity of the devs. More people can do more things. That is a fact. While the increase and decrease in subs may not have appeared to you to have any effect I am positive CCP's management noticed. They weren't just giving subs out for free. The fact remains that the more active subs you have the more revenue CCP earns.

    Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
    You had me until the very last sentence. Everything else there sounds solid, assuming it's well done. Voice acting, no, for the love of god, no. That garbage has no place in an mmo, and will just end up being skipped. Just ask all of the people who played SWTOR how their spacebar is faring these days.


    SWTOR was an abject failure. I agree I was hitting spacebar through quest briefings after 20 minutes. However, I never said quests had to be fully voiced. Agent interactions need to be more engaging. Even a live avatar and a simple voice for greetings and farewells will do. You can read the rest until your eyes bleed.

    Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
    I don't think you understand how can-flipping actually works. He isn't flagged for picking up something he dropped. He's flagged for picking up something that someone else dropped. Ganking does not need any further nerfs. To be honest, it's been hit a little too hard with the bat, in my opinion. The Concord idea is at least somewhat stupid, but I am all for Kill RIghts never expiring. You know why? Eventually, everybody is going to end up with one, and high-sec will be like null without bubbles. Twisted


    It is the container I was referring to, not what is in it. There is no reason a dropped container should be effectively neutral territory. If you put something into someone else's container the owner should not be flagged for accessing or taking any contents. That risk should be on you.

    Highsec ganking does need further mitigation. It should always be possible in a narrow sense, but never profitable.
    It drives away players that would otherwise stick around and pay subs. Like it or not, not everyone wants to play against other players all of the time. Forcing them to do so on such bad terms as exist now just drives them out. Low and null will still be available for people to blow each other up. There is no real loss here, other than easy targets for highsec griefers, who will have plenty of targets to shoot outside of highsec. Highsec should actually be high security. Known pirates should be forcibly excluded with prejudice.
    Shizuken
    Venerated Stars
    #390 - 2014-07-18 19:09:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Shizuken
    Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
    So, Shizuken, you want Trammel.

    Do you not know how that went for Ultima Online?


    No, I do not want Trammel. To be clear I think the ISK making opportunities in highsec need to be reduced and the benefits of low null increased. High should be a temporary sanctuary with little riches to be had. It should be for trading and business, and limited PvE. Anything that detracts from that should be strongly discouraged. It shouldn't just be a mirror of low/null. Eve should remain a single shard.
    Shizuken
    Venerated Stars
    #391 - 2014-07-18 19:27:04 UTC
    Remiel Pollard wrote:
    This suggestion is enough for me to say no to everything you wrote, because I know where your ideas come from.


    Wow nice, logical fallacy much?

    Remiel Pollard wrote:
    First of all, I've already explained why more players doesn't necessarily equate to a better game. More players of the right kind on the other hand is a different matter.

    You are not the right kind. Anyone that suggests protection from aggression in any area of New Eden is the very wrong kind, and has already lost EVE by virtue of not being able to protect themselves.


    I never said people should be "protected" from aggression, outside of the noob starting area. I said it should not be profitable and it should not be encouraged. I think you should be able to open fire on the Caldari Navy Assembly Plant in Jita, or anyone for that matter. It's your ship, you should be in control of the trigger. However, there should be consequences for disrupting the security of highsec.

    Remiel Pollard wrote:
    If this is what you want, you are quite simply playing the wrong game, because EVE will never be this pathetic trash that you're suggesting. Your ideas are bad and you should feel bad.


    I enjoy playing EvE just fine. It is remarkably good in many respects, but people like you keep this game severely stunted in its growth in both popularity and quality. Frankly, YOUR ideas are bad and YOU should feel bad for depriving EvE players and all gamers of something better.
    Lady Areola Fappington
    #392 - 2014-07-18 19:57:45 UTC
    Shizuken wrote:
    Remiel Pollard wrote:
    This suggestion is enough for me to say no to everything you wrote, because I know where your ideas come from.


    Wow nice, logical fallacy much?

    Remiel Pollard wrote:
    First of all, I've already explained why more players doesn't necessarily equate to a better game. More players of the right kind on the other hand is a different matter.

    You are not the right kind. Anyone that suggests protection from aggression in any area of New Eden is the very wrong kind, and has already lost EVE by virtue of not being able to protect themselves.


    I never said people should be "protected" from aggression, outside of the noob starting area. I said it should not be profitable and it should not be encouraged. I think you should be able to open fire on the Caldari Navy Assembly Plant in Jita, or anyone for that matter. It's your ship, you should be in control of the trigger. However, there should be consequences for disrupting the security of highsec.

    Remiel Pollard wrote:
    If this is what you want, you are quite simply playing the wrong game, because EVE will never be this pathetic trash that you're suggesting. Your ideas are bad and you should feel bad.


    I enjoy playing EvE just fine. It is remarkably good in many respects, but people like you keep this game severely stunted in its growth in both popularity and quality. Frankly, YOUR ideas are bad and YOU should feel bad for depriving EvE players and all gamers of something better.


    If you feel that there should be more consequences for "disrupting the security of highsec", then go out and make those consequences yourself. Gankers eventually go outlaw status, meaning you can shoot them with impunity.

    I mean, I'm sure you'll toss up examples of how going outlaw status really isn't consequences. Most people would consider being constantly chased by facpo while being an open target to anyone a pretty big consequence, but hey.

    At this point, ganking isn't going to go away. you can make it totally unprofitable, utterly useless, and ganks will STILL happen. A substantial subset of the EVE playerbase enjoys the antics of highsec gankers, and is willing to toss the ISK at us we need to keep going. It's almost like....CCP took away the NPC insurance from gankers, so we just replaced it with an insurance system run by players themselves. A very "EVE" solution.

    As for how you feel about attracting others to EVE, I totally agree. There's a huge untapped market out there, of people who love high-fantasy games. If CCP were to just include some dragons, wizards, and magic into EVE, we could tap that "Skyrim" market! Anyone who says anything about it being "against the spirit of EVE" should just feel bad, for depriving EVE players and all gamers of something better.

    7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. --Eve New Player Guide

    Val'Dore
    PlanetCorp InterStellar
    #393 - 2014-07-18 21:19:53 UTC
    Snakes-On-A-Plane wrote:
    I agree with that BTW. For what it's worth.


    You'll acronymize 'by the way', but not 'for what it's worth'?

    Star Jump Drive A new way to traverse the galaxy.

    I invented Tiericide

    Nathaniel Raynaud
    The Scope
    Gallente Federation
    #394 - 2014-07-18 21:46:49 UTC
    Val'Dore wrote:
    Snakes-On-A-Plane wrote:
    I agree with that BTW. For what it's worth.


    You'll acronymize 'by the way', but not 'for what it's worth'?

    ia wt btw fwiw
    admiral root
    Red Galaxy
    #395 - 2014-07-18 21:47:23 UTC
    Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
    If you feel that there should be more consequences for "disrupting the security of highsec", then go out and make those consequences yourself.


    But effort, bullying, human rights, etc!

    The ridiculous notion that CCP should protect people is ridiculous and those who subscribe to the idea should go play a game that caters to people who don't want risk, competition and having to put in effort to get rewards.

    No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff

    baltec1
    Bat Country
    Pandemic Horde
    #396 - 2014-07-18 21:47:38 UTC
    ChironV wrote:
    Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
    ChironV wrote:
    baltec1 wrote:
    ChironV wrote:
    *SNIP* It is unlikely that CCP will change the game. So the onus is on us as the players to be positive about the game. We should also judge our own actions and make sure we are not behaving like a sociopath sadist due to the anonymity factor.
    Since this game is anonymous the ONLY person we have to answer to is ourselves. If you are holding a pod for ransom, are you doing it for the money or are you doing it because you get a thrill taunting and listening to some guy beg for his pod.

    In short we need more news of huge battles and less news of scammers and Fan Fests where a potentially suicidal person is trolled and taunted by other players or another fan fest where a sculpture dedicated to the players is defaced by said players.


    Being a pirate in a game that advertises you can be a pirate does not make you a d-bag, sociopath or a psycopath.


    Missed the point. You can play a pirate, hold pods for ransom, gank miners and generally be a terror. If you play a pirate and spend your time taunting, trolling and making another persons life miserable while they are in the game because you get off on it then yeah you are a minor sadist or sociopath. I've been popped by pirates before and if they catch me flatfooted with a clean gank I will send them a "Ouch, good gank dude. :)" Often times we strike up a chat if they are normal folk. If I encounter a sociopath I will be met with taunts and trolls but I dont bite, which makes them angry because they are doing piracy to drink in the tears and misery of their victims. I don't want the game changed. We as players just need to try and have some empathy and treat each other a little better. That will make the game seem less like a "cyber bully party" and more like an epic contest.

    Seems to me, you have an issue with arseholes, not eve.


    No, not really. I've been playing eve since 2004, and you learn to not feed the arseholes. However I could see some kid getting cyber-bullied by some arseholes in game and committing suicide. Last thing CCP needs is that sort of negative publicity posted all over the news. Parents would pull their kids out of the game and generally associate CCP with making games that make kids commit suicide. Sound stupid? Yeah, well that's the the way US fear-mongering news rolls.



    I see you have never been on x-box live.
    Kaarous Aldurald
    Black Hydra Consortium.
    #397 - 2014-07-18 21:50:13 UTC
    baltec1 wrote:

    I see you have never been on x-box live.


    I have been thinking of making a documentary about X-box Live.

    The title would be "How I ****ed Your Mother; the X-Box Live Story".

    "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

    One of ours, ten of theirs.

    Best Meltdown Ever.

    baltec1
    Bat Country
    Pandemic Horde
    #398 - 2014-07-18 21:54:19 UTC
    Quote:


    Highsec ganking does need further mitigation. It should always be possible in a narrow sense, but never profitable.
    It drives away players that would otherwise stick around and pay subs. Like it or not, not everyone wants to play against other players all of the time. Forcing them to do so on such bad terms as exist now just drives them out. Low and null will still be available for people to blow each other up. There is no real loss here, other than easy targets for highsec griefers, who will have plenty of targets to shoot outside of highsec. Highsec should actually be high security. Known pirates should be forcibly excluded with prejudice.


    This would kill the game. The people you want to protect would quit anyway for another reason and you would remove the playerbase that does stick around long term. If you want a safe space game go play STO because that is exactly what you want.
    PotatoOverdose
    Royal Black Watch Highlanders
    #399 - 2014-07-18 22:04:00 UTC
    I'm just gonna point out that eve's reputation was the whole reason I started playing. I read about one of the big bank scams (ebank maybe?) in a magazine and was taken with the idea of a sandbox mmo with scamming, piracy, and potential pvp everywhere.
    darmwand
    Repo.
    #400 - 2014-07-18 22:32:45 UTC
    PotatoOverdose wrote:
    I'm just gonna point out that eve's reputation was the whole reason I started playing. I read about one of the big bank scams (ebank maybe?) in a magazine and was taken with the idea of a sandbox mmo with scamming, piracy, and potential pvp everywhere.


    Similar here. I started after reading about the guy who got his 72 (or however many) plex carrying frig blown up (in Jita, IIRC).

    "The pen is mightier than the sword if the sword is very short, and the pen is very sharp."