Player Features and Ideas Discussion

To be quite frank, there is absolutely no reason for these ships to require as many near-deadweight SP as they do right now. Capital ships had their SP requirements massively lowered, I have no idea why this precedent was not applied to these ships. The only source of timesink, benefit-less SP left for undocking a Dreadnought is Advanced Spaceship Command, there's no reason for a subcap to have over twice as much of an SP timesink, in Charisma skills no less.

In addition, older characters have a disgusting advantage when it comes to getting into these ships. It takes over five times as many SP as it used to just to undock these ships. You used to be able to just train Battlecruisers V and Warfare Link Specialist IV, and then you could inject Command Ships and fly every command ship. Now to fly them all you have to train four seperate BC skills to V, as well as training all the link skills to V.

I don't really understand the rationale behind lowering the timesink for capital ships so much while at the same time massively increasing it for this ship line. You used to need Battleship V and Jump Drive Operation V for a dread, now you don't. There are so many interesting potential uses for many of these ships in large scale PvP, especially with the new MMJD, that we'll never see realized because of the sheer impossibility of finding more than a handful of pilots that can fly the ships.

Perhaps if command ships become more common, the availability of links will go up, not just through alts but also active command ships, and people will stop complaining about links.

there SP rec is not bad considering the progression of command ships you have T1 battle cruisers that are very easy to get into then you have T3 cruisers that are a bit harder but still not to bad and considering most of the skills for T3 ships players should have trained anyway so its not a poor sp investment to skill into for a command ship pilot then you have the command ships that then only take a little longer to get into then it did to get from BC to T3.


This isn't WoW and you don't just get everything after a few months of playing. most things in eve that are worth while happen slowly and shortening training times can also be a bad thing on newer players look at how they lowered the time it takes to get into a BS takes less then 5 days now and i come across a lot of new players who don't fully understand how this games works causing them to train straight w/o getting the skills they need to use one even for missions. This leads to them getting frustrated and quitting.

And if you actually read the skills you would know that they DON'T NEED TO TRAIN LINK SKILLS (Other than the Link Specialist to IV).
They only need to train the LEADERSHIP skills that work without any modules on the ship, in any ship you are flying.

Additionally since Links are on a Cha map, the Leadership skills are not a wild off-map for any serious leadership pilot, they are part of the actual map plan.

Finally, you didn't just need to train BC V before to fly CS. You needed the correct Cruiser V as well for each race. So you actually had to train even more skills to V before.

So.... No, your an idiot, normally I wouldn't be so blunt but you are berating others for something you are failing at even more.
Command Ships are fine as they are.

Please show me which LINK skills are on the list.
There is..... One.

Not the five you are trying to pretend are there. ONE!

The other four skills are leadership skills which benefit any gang.

Because it's a Leadership skill, not a link skill. Because it works WITHOUT links.
Jeez, I thought Goons who were permitted to post on the forums actually knew how the game worked.

1) The post I was replying to specifically mentioned links.
2) The idea that armored warfare is somehow so much significant, never mind essential, on the likes of a vulture pilot is a nothing short of a joke.
3) That is correct with respect to the old skills, a new player would be skilling up in useful combat ships, not locked into a life of OGB mucking about with useless skills for their racial ship. This leads me to:
4) Things like weapons upgrades, mechanics, engineering and so forth - the old skills - are generically useful and most people have them pretrained. Acting like these are in any way analogous to the leadership tree is utterly disingenuous.


My post was hardly berating, you may need develop thicker skin if you thought that was somehow harsh.


Edit: And I post this as one of the fortunate players who skilled up before it changed - I can fly anything in that class but don't have the LD skills. That said, my sleipnir is still a force to be reckoned with and the LD boni are meaningless as any serious fleet has a dedicated OBG, allowing that sleip to be on field tearing things up.

Poorly presented as a whole and not well explained, but I feel there's room for improvement in the requirements for the ships too.

Any single command ship only has bonuses to any two warfare link types. These are obviously the skills I would like to prioritize as those two boosts are what I'm going to anticipate using the ship for the majority of the time. If I'm just looking to get into a single command ship for the time being the rest of the leadership skills needing V looks like a huge waste of time to me. Every other ship requires skills necessary to pilot it well in combat, but those extra leadership skills are not necessary to pilot that particular race's command ship well, so why are they a requirement?

I would much prefer the same amount of training time be required in core skills that improves the ships combat efficacy. If I'm going to spend 3-4 months training skills for a hull, I'd like for every skill to apply to using that ship in an active role, and not as an off-grid boosting alt.

So yeah, it wouldn't hurt to trade out the non-bonused warfare skills for skills such as Energy Grid Upgrades V, Capacitor management V, Sharpshooter V, Missile Projection V, etc...

And I suppose this is going a bit against the OP, because you'd end up with a higher training time to be able to fly all of the command ships, but would have more combat effectiveness in those you trained assuming you were working your way up from scratch.

Less booster alts and more command ships pewing faces, I say.

you act like links is the only use for command ships? i agree with the OP i can fly every combat ship except dictors and heavy dictors and ofc command ships it is ******** that i should train almost all leadership skills to 5 just to sit in it, there is realy no defence for this.

and speaking of this why isnt mining director 5 needed to inject orca or rorqual skills????? because lvl 1 is enough for those ships! i would love to fly command ships without links so tell me why i need to train a **** ton of skills that i dont want/need ???

i am talking about DIRECTOR learn to read

to specify as reading isnt your strong suit:
for orca and rorqual you only need mining foreman 5 and mining director 1 for a command ship you need 2 leadership skills @5 and the link skill also @5 that is over 3 times the time sink