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Your ideas for isk sinks.
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Amro One
One.
#41 - 2011-11-19 17:46:44 UTC
I can be your ISK faucet.
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#42 - 2011-11-19 17:52:08 UTC
Richard Hammond II wrote:
War

Neat idea huh?


Thats actually only reason why its still out there. To boost the economy afterwards.

Well that and "religious zealots".
C DeLeon
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#43 - 2011-11-19 17:54:20 UTC
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#44 - 2011-11-19 20:56:27 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:


Mr Kidd wrote:
Or, better yet, remove all NPC sources of income making missioning dependent on the market for income.

And what's going to happen when the entirety of the game's ISK gets used up by clone costs, CSPA charges, and skillbook purchases?


I'm surprised you can't make that feat of logic on your own. No isk faucets....no isk sinks?

Don't ban me, bro!
Dbars Grinding
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#45 - 2011-11-19 21:41:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Dbars Grinding
instant pvp arena once or twice a week. Also with NPCs that sell ships and modules that can only be used in the arena to make it balanced. There i just came up with a way to get a ton of subs and money for CCP. There is no reason not to have this.

I have more space likes than you. 
Dibsi Dei
Salamyhkaisten kilta
#46 - 2011-11-19 22:04:31 UTC
The reason we got to this point is because CCP is scared of people not using their new features. I'm talking about Wormholes and incursions. CCP were too scared to just offer people "construction blocks" for new items to trade: T3s, implants, capital modules. So they decided to put a "little" isk on it, sleeper trade goods into wormholes and straight up isk onto incursions.

ISK from those sources are massive compared to missions. Missions might still generate more isk overall because of the amount of people running them but incursions might not be too far behind. People are blitzing them faster and faster and the incursions last for ages even after the revenant spawns because they can delay killing it for quite a while.
Skex Relbore
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#47 - 2011-11-19 22:08:41 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Skex Relbore wrote:
There is no need to worry about isk entering the system. It's a self balancing equation, as the isk supply increases relative to raw materials other activities become more lucrative and people shift their activities to compensate.
…except that as history has shown, they don't, because it's not as self-balancing as that and because people are not willing to switch to other activities.


uhuh once again if this were the case then why aren't prices increasing? Seriously if over supply of isk was such a problem then why don't Domi's cost 200 million isk?

If there really was an over supply of isk then prices would rise across the board. The fact that prices have not done so shows that there is no inflation and most certainly not any hyper-inflation. If anything the actual evidence has suggested a deflationary situation.

Obviously plenty of people are willing to switch to other activities or we would see those price increases I mentioned earlier.

Quote:

Most importantly, those other activities don't become more lucrative, because they suffer from limitations of scale that the ISK-generating activities don't quite adhere to. As a result, people rather flock to the activities that further inflates the ISK supply, since that's the only way to stay ahead of the curve.


You're just simply wrong.

You know why more people aren't out mining? Because there is already an over supply of minerals relative to isk. so it isn't worth most peoples time save on a massive semi-afk (or bot) basis. If mineral prices were to rise to the point where mining Veldspar equaled or surpassed what one could make running L4 missions then you can be damned certain you'd see a shift from missions to mining.



Quote:

Quote:
All this crying on and on about inflation are either idiots who don't understand how currency works
…such as CCP's own economist, who is worried about how the ISK influx is not matched by a corresponding increase in materials generation and production.


Yes such as their own economist who's from what I've seen is a member of the fresh water supply side school of economic thought that's been crying about the threat of inflation in the real economy for years due to quantitative easing (creating money) and have been consistently wrong over said period.

Just your wording tells me you don't really understand whats going on. If the economic activity (all that stuff in the game economy other than farming isk) did not at least match the rate isk was coming into the economy then you'd see evidence of inflation. You don't ergo anyone who insists there is inflation is an idiot.

Evidence always trumps theory those who insist otherwise aren't operating in objective reality.
David Grogan
NerdHerd
#48 - 2011-11-19 22:13:32 UTC  |  Edited by: David Grogan
use 1bil isk to pay the character transfer fees when selling toons

introduce a new Sansha Outpost egg bpc available for LP + 10bil isk in the concord LP store that allows supers to dock in.....

also add all 3 tier upgrades bpcs also available for 1bil tier 1, 5bil tier 2, and 10bil tier 3

give it a bonus to fighter and fighter bomber production

Everytime you buy something that says "made in china" you are helping the rising unemployment in your own country unless you are from china, Buy locally produced goods and help create more jobs.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#49 - 2011-11-19 22:20:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Skex Relbore wrote:
uhuh once again if this were the case then why aren't prices increasing?
Hoarding instincts and loss aversion. Also, the prices of what, exactly? What are your indices?
Quote:
Obviously plenty of people are willing to switch to other activities or we would see those price increases I mentioned earlier.
…except that people have been quite vocal about not wanting to do so. Yes, some might, but a lot of people are so stuck doing the same thing and will seemingly prefer to quit the game rather than do something else. Or, put another way, plenty of people might consider switching, but is it enough?
Quote:
You know why more people aren't out mining? Because there is already an over supply of minerals relative to isk.
No, because there is an over-supply of minerals relative to production, which is what the worry is all about: not enough stuff is being produced, and not enough is being destroyed. They also don't mine because mining has become relegated to a second-tier source of said minerals. You know why more people aren't out running L3s? Because there are L4s.
Quote:
If the economic activity (all that stuff in the game economy other than farming isk) did not at least match the rate isk was coming into the economy then you'd see evidence of inflation.
…which you do, in spite of the mitigating factors of standard MMO hoarding. Idiot. Roll
Arugas Koken
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#50 - 2011-11-19 23:00:52 UTC
Since establishments have been delayed, what about a gambling system on the CQ display with the house being an NPC.

There would finally be something to do in CQ and i guess it would be a substantial isk sink.

Blackjack, poker, slots etc.
Vachir Khan
Rugged Ruff and Ready
#51 - 2011-11-19 23:02:36 UTC
docking tax based on shipsize (pods and frigs are free)
higher taxes on buying/selling/producing
higher contract tax (10k is silly)
increased office tax


On the other end; lower bounties and insurance.
Adunh Slavy
#52 - 2011-11-19 23:21:29 UTC
Skex Relbore wrote:


uhuh once again if this were the case then why aren't prices increasing? Seriously if over supply of isk was such a problem then why don't Domi's cost 200 million isk?

If there really was an over supply of isk then prices would rise across the board. The fact that prices have not done so shows that there is no inflation and most certainly not any hyper-inflation. If anything the actual evidence has suggested a deflationary situation.

Obviously plenty of people are willing to switch to other activities or we would see those price increases I mentioned earlier.



This is not true. An increase in the monetary base does not always reflect in all prices at the same time. Nor does it cause prices to increase at an even rate, they can still bounce around.

The basic rules in an expanding monetary base environment are the same as any other time. Those things which have small supply and those things that are most necessary, tend to reflect the economic environment first and most drastically. One of the differences in Eve from the real world is that there is almost nothing that is necessary. That we see rising prices in some areas, and decreasing in other areas is no surprise.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
Kalicor Lightwind
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#53 - 2011-11-19 23:31:30 UTC
Make production require ISK, maybe slightly reduce mineral cost. That way ship destruction would actually be an ISK sink :P
Capn Orgasmo
Dmacks Minnions
#54 - 2011-11-19 23:56:02 UTC
Let people buy Secure containers that have expired at a set price of 500k
they then get the contents of said containers to keep for themselves.
Basically you gamble with what you buy
Anya Ohaya
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#55 - 2011-11-20 00:32:23 UTC
It's all talk.

There's no actual evidence that this is the case. No evidence of inflation (in fact, the price indexes tend to show deflation), and no actual numbers for the amount of ISK entering and leaving (and similar figures for the amounts of goods). Just speculation, and gossip.

Someone might like to run the numbers on the ISK vs material generated from mission running (and incursions). If you include LP on the material side of the balance sheet (because LP ends up as high value goods) then mission runners are probably pumping in goods to the economy as fast as ISK.

There seems to be a lot of ISK envy in these forums, and a lot of butt-hurt from plex prices, and people are starting to point fingers all over the place (mostly at the usual suspects). This whole thread reminds me of historical populations that have descended into mob mentality and started to blame all their woes on rumours of the unsavory activities of different groups : it's all the fault of the merchants, the 1%, or witches, or the gypsies, or the Jews.
Arthur Frayn
V.O.F.L IRON CORE
#56 - 2011-11-20 00:38:23 UTC
Make Loyalty points buyable from LP store for isk. Suddenly you'll have a HUGE isk sink.
Koronakesh
Seekers of a Silent Paradise
#57 - 2011-11-20 00:46:24 UTC
Charging people to post on the forum would be a fine isk sink.

SASPR Amir al-Mu'minin
Shivus Tao
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#58 - 2011-11-20 00:51:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Shivus Tao
The reason we haven't seen inflation is because most people in this game are misers with their spacewealth. And as easy as it is to compare prices and get the best deal, speculators in everything but plex are quashed. I too have seen nothing but deflation or stagnation over my eve career.

It seems like the spectre of inflation has been looming over eve for years when if anything, prices have reduced relative to the increasing wealth.
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#59 - 2011-11-20 00:58:59 UTC
Ho you want a nice good isk faucet??


That sounds good, make taxes to Concord from alliance benefits -every 5day- touch the excellent level of 15%

Why not 15%

Well, when you mission whatsoever in high sec, if you have nothing else to do of your jurney because of your personal life that no one around give a frack about, you can make about 1.2B you pay 11% taxes right?

In null, low, if you do more than 1.5B a day then you should pay 15% to concord because...there's no real reason but who need it?

Bounty's are high, plex value are high, level 5 are in low/null, why the hell should they pay less when they have hundred times better possibilities income than in high sec?

By the way, wy is in high sec the highest level of killed ships/pods???

If it's really the case, then who cares about null when nothing interesting happens there?

Rabble rabble rabble...
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
#60 - 2011-11-20 05:54:09 UTC
The central design rule of ISK sinks - no matter how big or how onerous you make them, players will simply grind at the ISK faucets longer in order to stay ahead at their desired wealth level. Unless you hit the tipping point where you make it too onerous and suddenly get a mass exodus.

You also have to consider the effect of tacking fees onto everything when a new player comes into the game and only has 5000 ISK to their name. And if you say "anyone under 30 days gets a free pass", then people will just use throwaway alts to get past all of the new taxes and fees.

But since I'm an evil meanie...

- Double the broker fees in Jita CNAP 4-4 (base the surcharge on number of open orders)
- Charge a 0.01% fee of the market order's remaining value if you want to price change.
- Personal hangars with a (generous) size limit, or you can pay per month to have larger (better standings = cheaper)
- Ship hangars in stations with a (generous) size limit and you can pay per month to have larger
- Higher LP store ISK costs
- Higher manuf / research slot fees in station slots (with standings giving a discount)

Yeah, a lot of those are evil / dumb ideas. Far better to turn the ISK faucets down a bit. Replace up to 50% of the existing ISK with drops that can be converted into LP or sold to other players. At which point, the player market takes over and self-regulates it (too many people doing XYZ? less reward per hour until enough people stop doing XYZ).