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Crime & Punishment

 
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Where is the Counter-CODE?

Author
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#41 - 2014-06-17 19:52:17 UTC
Tengu Grib wrote:
Azov Rassau wrote:
Bronson Hughes,

As an anti-ganker, I will hereby try to make it more clear about how anti-ganking works and why there's a lack of organization.

Several months ago I had written some sunday wall-of-text about the view I have about this subject. There are indeed some dedicated, anti-gankers out there who operate mostly individually and stop ganks almost in daily basis. The problem, and the lack of organization, appears with the gameplay of anti-ganking which comes with its own set of problems. You have to be extremely and obnoxiously patient.
You literally warp to the belt and wait there for hours in this position, while constantly checking local and D-Scan so that maybe some Anathema (ironically named as "salvager") will provide warp-in on top of a Mackinaw which you seek to protect.

blah blah blah and more quality blah


You have taken anti-ganking and given yourself a goal and a purpose. I can tell from your posts that you genuinely do not hate CODE as a group, certainly individuals within it, but not what it stands for and why.

From my experience though, you are a rare specimen of genuine White Knight. The majority of your kin, and all of them that I have run into personally, do nothing but rant and rave and rage in local, then refuse to back up their boasting with action, or when they try to, they fail horribly.

I think the herding cats metaphor is appropriate here. The majority of high sec carebears want to do their own thing, and play eve in their own single player, afk way. When someone interrupts that for them they get angry, but they lack the motivation and determination to actually take the necessary action (for any extended period of time that is, many white knight briefly before going back to their old lives). You might be one of the only sheppards among the cats, though perhaps you know of more.

To you I say, keep it up, you are creating content for yourself, for others, and even for CODE. That's what the New Order is really all about. Content creation is good for all of Eve, not just the people involved.

Agreed, Azov's posts are a breath of fresh air in the stifling mass of stupidity that is most white knights we encounter.

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Cage Man
Comms Black
Pandemic Horde
#42 - 2014-06-17 20:51:52 UTC
CODE is about bullying and extortion.. plain and simple.. clearly CCP support it. I have also recently supported the code by dropping 5 subs.. nice work CODE.. you making CCP rich :/, but I guess CCP do support it. Not complaining btw.. CCP's business to run as they want.
There are other games I can carebear in when I feel like relaxing..
Subject 4927
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#43 - 2014-06-17 23:34:09 UTC
Azov Rassau wrote:
Subject 4927 wrote:
Seeing as you have a collection of screens involving me, It's clear that you are one of my many fans.

I should have known. Quoting me from another thread, and taking out the context entirely, was proof enough that your devotion to me is of high regard.


This was one hilarious post.

I quoted you (and another person) simply as a response to that ganker's typical "tears" bingo response. I believe it's entirely in context.

I remember agreeing with some of your previous statements in these forums and you have some good points in your blog too.

Maybe you should post with your main so that we know who you are.


I'd post on my main but I like being in PL sowy.


F**k.

http://subjectandfriends.wordpress.com

Haedonism Bot
Revolutionary Front
#44 - 2014-06-18 00:32:12 UTC
Subject 4927 wrote:
Azov Rassau wrote:
Subject 4927 wrote:
Seeing as you have a collection of screens involving me, It's clear that you are one of my many fans.

I should have known. Quoting me from another thread, and taking out the context entirely, was proof enough that your devotion to me is of high regard.


This was one hilarious post.

I quoted you (and another person) simply as a response to that ganker's typical "tears" bingo response. I believe it's entirely in context.

I remember agreeing with some of your previous statements in these forums and you have some good points in your blog too.

Maybe you should post with your main so that we know who you are.


I'd post on my main but I like being in PL sowy.


F**k.


PL doesn't allow their people to post on their mains? Wow, I just lost so much respect....Sad

www.everevolutionaryfront.blogspot.com

Vote Sabriz Adoudel and Tora Bushido for CSMX. Keep the Evil in EVE!

NoThisIsntItAtAll MakeIt MorePSSSHHHH
Doomheim
#45 - 2014-06-18 07:35:23 UTC
There is no need for a counter-CODE. Anyone who's been playing for a few months with even half their braincells intact can completely avoid being trolled by CODE.

They typically prey on new players and players with mental illness. Quite sad really... something only past RL victims would be willing to do if ya ask me. There isn't much we can do to help such players other than give them the proper resources to learn from their mistakes.
NoThisIsntItAtAll MakeIt MorePSSSHHHH
Doomheim
Tengu Grib wrote:
Azov Rassau wrote:
Bronson Hughes,

As an anti-ganker, I will hereby try to make it more clear about how anti-ganking works and why there's a lack of organization.

Several months ago I had written some sunday wall-of-text about the view I have about this subject. There are indeed some dedicated, anti-gankers out there who operate mostly individually and stop ganks almost in daily basis. The problem, and the lack of organization, appears with the gameplay of anti-ganking which comes with its own set of problems. You have to be extremely and obnoxiously patient.
You literally warp to the belt and wait there for hours in this position, while constantly checking local and D-Scan so that maybe some Anathema (ironically named as "salvager") will provide warp-in on top of a Mackinaw which you seek to protect.

blah blah blah and more quality blah


You have taken anti-ganking and given yourself a goal and a purpose. I can tell from your posts that you genuinely do not hate CODE as a group, certainly individuals within it, but not what it stands for and why.

From my experience though, you are a rare specimen of genuine White Knight. The majority of your kin, and all of them that I have run into personally, do nothing but rant and rave and rage in local, then refuse to back up their boasting with action, or when they try to, they fail horribly.

I think the herding cats metaphor is appropriate here. The majority of high sec carebears want to do their own thing, and play eve in their own single player, afk way. When someone interrupts that for them they get angry, but they lack the motivation and determination to actually take the necessary action (for any extended period of time that is, many white knight briefly before going back to their old lives). You might be one of the only sheppards among the cats, though perhaps you know of more.

To you I say, keep it up, you are creating content for yourself, for others, and even for CODE. That's what the New Order is really all about. Content creation is good for all of Eve, not just the people involved.

I like you. That is why I am posting to tell you that you are OUT OF YOUR MIND.

The New Order is not about creating engaging content for the benefit of players. The New Order is and always has been about trolling players for the amusement of the perpetrators. The purpose of CODE. today is almost solely to create amusing content for James 315 to blog about on his website.

I will leave my opinions aside this post about what that says about players that are willing to do this (as grown men). The purpose of this response is simply to inform you that you are completely deluding yourself about your fellow brethren and you shame yourself each and every time you defend them under the guise of something that simply isn't true.
Jay Joringer
13.
Enigma Project
#47 - 2014-06-18 07:43:28 UTC
Grunanca
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#48 - 2014-06-19 06:34:54 UTC
Bronson Hughes wrote:
This is not a rant about CODE or other similar suicide gankers. Although I do not (usually) participate in that particular style of gameplay and I can understand why some people would consider it a form of griefing, I think it's perfectly valid and in some ways even useful. They've unified a group of people behind a cause and are proving to be very effective at implementing it. I call that a success story.

I say kudos to them.

No, this post is about the people ranting about suicide gankers. For all the uproar you read here and see in local, you'd figure that someone would have organized a movement against CODE by now to slow down their wave of suicide ganks. Unless said movement is very quiet about their actions, I've seen no sign of it's existence. This could be partly because the most basic counters to a CODE-esque gank are best carried out by individual pilots, not organizations:

Don't autopilot.
Don't haul goods worth more than it would cost to gank you.
Don't fly expensive ships with paper-thin tanks without proper support.

People could go beyond these basic measures, yet few, if any do. Why haven't all these people complaining about suicide ganks banded together and:

Started flying cheap ECM fleets to jam gankers?
Started flying cheap logistics fleets to rep miners/haulers?
Scanning down gank fleets and pre-emptively ganking them?



I am not the person to organize such a movement; I have neither the time nor the inclination. But I do think it would be interesting to see it happen and I'd love to watch it in action.

If you really don't like the impact that suicide gankers are having on your gameplay, try standing up and doing something about it instead of complaining that they ganked your expensive ship.

This is EvE. You are never safe here. Get used to it and take steps to protect yourself.


There is no counter to the CODE as you have to be at your keyboard to oragnize a counter. Their victims are not and the rest of us dont give a damn.
Clara Pond
Never Not Snazzy
#49 - 2014-06-19 07:33:50 UTC
NoThisIsntItAtAll MakeIt MorePSSSHHHH wrote:
The New Order is not about creating engaging content for the benefit of players. The New Order is and always has been about trolling players for the amusement of the perpetrators. The purpose of CODE. today is almost solely to create amusing content for James 315 to blog about on his website.


There is an aphorism about untrustworthy people being unable to trust others - because it simply can't occur to them that people might genuinely be trustworthy.

Just because you can't comprehend being philanthropic in Eve does not mean genuine philanthropy cannot exist in Eve. You are seeing conspiracy and lies because they are the only realities that fit into your tinfoil milieu.

Highsec content creation, player retention and fun are what the New Order is genuinely all about, as anyone who has spent time in the organisation knows. Everything else attributed to us is propaganda and fearful fabrication born out of ignorance.
Azov Rassau
The Hornets Cartel
#50 - 2014-06-19 07:49:15 UTC
NoThisIsntItAtAll MakeIt MorePSSSHHHH wrote:
The New Order is not about creating engaging content for the benefit of players.

Incorrect.

Imagine for a moment a 100% safe highsec without any gankers and “white knights”. I am not talking about Code only, but suicide gankers in general. Wouldn't That be a boring lack of content?

I used to mine a lot in the ice belts of The Forge region, and I can assure you that there's absolutely No action in their gameplay. They don't play EVE. The only possible action for miners were maybe the Gurista rats. Also sometimes they had to make an effort by burning towards a roid to get within optimals (dat action!).

Other than that, it's the usual boring chat about fleet invites, greedy yield calculations and the famous neverending debate between Mackinaw fans and Skiff fans. Most of the miners were AFK anyway and I even remember a Miasmos getting killed by the Guristas at an asteroid belt. Oh God.

From my point of view, the New Order creates engaging content for the benefit of miners. In other words, gankers create the action miners need in order to enjoy EVE. I'm not against mining or anything, but I want to see miners D-Scanning and checking Local.

Tengu Grib wrote:
You have taken anti-ganking and given yourself a goal and a purpose. I can tell from your posts that you genuinely do not hate CODE as a group, certainly individuals within it, but not what it stands for and why.


It's not that I certainly hate individuals within it. But there certainly are some figures of shame inside the CODE. alliance. (trolling, insulting etc). I understand that they want to play the villain digital avatars but there are limits for that too.

The insulters are a minority within the CODE. alliance, but since they are poster boys at the same time, their influence is enough to darken the image of the entire ganker community and the valuable highsec service of that community (hence all the hate gankers get in AG chat or w/e).
I see a strong connection with CODE.'s poster boys' attitude and the inevitable hate it creates.

Tengu Grib: Nice to see that you have succesfully observed my vision of highsec, instead of coming up with the usual “tears” response that I observe on some of your prejudiced ganker mates. I have recently written a short document about my personal notes concerning highsec miners and the importance of d-scan for their survival. I am sure you will fully agree with at least some of my statements.

The more content we have, the better.

Finishing with a quote from a New Order supporter that I partially agree with:

"If we can all raise the standard of our intercourse, we can all help drag highsec out of the cesspit it currently lurks in. Nobody wants to be "that guy" (or girl) that has to resort to petition pvp, but as even the great Kane has discovered, local filth is completely out of control in the highsec community and needs to be checked. Let us, gankers and anti-gankers, be partners in embodying that vital subsection of The Code."

Be the change you want to see in Highsec.

Anti-Ganking Fun: www.gankerjamming.com

Qaping Pi
Doomheim
#51 - 2014-06-22 02:51:13 UTC
Azov Rassau wrote:
"we can all raise the standard of our intercourse, we can all help."


Amen to that
Estella Osoka
Perkone
Caldari State
#52 - 2014-06-23 16:53:32 UTC
To this thread I impart this question.

What is best in life?
Soylent Jade
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#53 - 2014-06-23 22:33:58 UTC
Estella Osoka wrote:
To this thread I impart this question.

What is best in life?


To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women.

Making hisec better...one Catalyst at a time

minerbumping.com

Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#54 - 2014-06-23 22:36:45 UTC
By ganking the gankers, the anti-gankers themselves have become gankers.


So the only logical conclusion is that for the anti-gankers to be true to anti-ganking, they must self destruct their own ships.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?

Ria Nieyli
Nieyli Enterprises
#55 - 2014-06-23 22:53:57 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
By ganking the gankers, the anti-gankers themselves have become gankers.


So the only logical conclusion is that for the anti-gankers to be true to anti-ganking, they must self destruct their own ships.


Ah, a paradox! No matter what they do, somebody is getting ganked.
John E Normus
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#56 - 2014-06-24 02:38:00 UTC
Simple answer is, unless Sarah Flynt is in system there is no Counter-Code. It's all white noise at present.

Between Ignorance and Wisdom

Purity by Fire
Purity Tax Haven
#57 - 2014-06-24 10:52:28 UTC
The only thing I can see coming from CODE is a bunch of gankers that have formed up and are blowing up anything they can. And taking isk in permits not to

I would congratulate them but omg you go on so much about this CODE new order its mind numbing.

Even though Im not in CODE im presuming each time CODE ganks a ship, their own ship is replaced by the alliance wallet?.

Also why has your treasury balance dropped to 23 bill from 68 bill in only a month?

Surely the freighter ganking is providing a decent income?

So like after 76 petitions I still dont have a logical normal answer.   Fly safe and fly true and use your headset on the Loo

Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
#58 - 2014-06-24 11:02:32 UTC
Purity by Fire wrote:
Also why has your treasury balance dropped to 23 bill from 68 bill in only a month?

Surely the freighter ganking is providing a decent income?


Some of the freighters they have been killing in Aufay have been empty. They're not doing it for profit, they're doing it for the Code.

Relatively Notorious By Association

My Many Misadventures

I predicted FAUXs

Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#59 - 2014-06-24 11:07:59 UTC
Bronson Hughes wrote:
Purity by Fire wrote:
Also why has your treasury balance dropped to 23 bill from 68 bill in only a month?

Surely the freighter ganking is providing a decent income?


Some of the freighters they have been killing in Aufay have been empty. They're not doing it for profit, they're doing it for the Code.


set your avoidance list to include aufay, its not a chokepoint. That is the point CODE are making, people are literally lumbering in there without regard to the ship kill rate on the map, the fact that a scout would see a lot of CODE in there, or the fact that they can bypass it, let alone that its been a forum topic for a week.

at this point a freighter dying in there is dumb.
Jove Eden
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#60 - 2014-06-24 11:42:45 UTC
Bronson Hughes wrote:
Purity by Fire wrote:
Also why has your treasury balance dropped to 23 bill from 68 bill in only a month?

Surely the freighter ganking is providing a decent income?


Some of the freighters they have been killing in Aufay have been empty. They're not doing it for profit, they're doing it for the Code.


I would like some clarification on this CODE as well if possible.

As noted from actually reading what CODE are going on about there are a couple of things I would like to clarify.

The CODE itself advises that by purchasing a 10 mill permit and pasting some stuff in there bio they are clear to mine freely for 1 year as you wish?.
As noted in your CODE

You have nothing to fear from the New Order of Highsec coming to your system. Things will largely continue as they have in the past. If you pay me 10 million isk, you can continue to mine ice the same way you always have. If you choose not to pay, you may experience some difficulty. Also, all miners are required to follow some basic rules to ensure the continued vitality of the community.

OK on this part as it states you can mine as your have been prior to paying 10 mill isk. However on another part of the CODE it states you cannot mine like you have been and you have to do this and do that. IE

No excessive mining. Miners should not fall into a routine of mining all day. I want well-rounded people in my system, not ice-mining machines.

It also states that a miner has a 24 hour window to pay 10 mill

If a miner does not wish to purchase a mining indulgence, he may still be granted a one-day reprieve, if he is able to correctly answer the Supreme Protector's Questions Three.

On this point though from listening to local whines nobody is offered this and you guys just blow up there ship.

So as I keep getting replies of its the CODE, we live by the CODE. Shouldn't the CODE be updated as currently is based on just bumping.

As mentioned CODE states its a living breathing thing But are you actually bending the rules of EULA. As noted below

Red Pen. On my desk there is a sheet of paper. In my desk there is a drawer. Inside this drawer is a Red Pen. If a miner commits an egregious offense or series of offenses, his name will be written on the paper with the Red Pen. If your name is written in Red Pen, the cost of an indulgence will be trebled and you will be at increased risk of bumping.

Wouldn't this be classed as a breach as your not really just bumping and actually just perma ganking?.


To understand your ethics more it would be interesting to have a much rebuilt code with your true updated ethics built in.