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External Station Spinning / External Station View while docked
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Takara Mora
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2014-06-14 01:11:58 UTC

Wouldn't it be cool to be able to view the exterior of the station while docked? Maybe watch all the cool and exotic ships coming and leaving .... being able to enjoy the outside solar scenery while station trading, etc.?

Why not just add another option button while docked (Ship Hangar / Captain's Quarters / Exterior Station View)?
Komi Toran
Perkone
Caldari State
#2 - 2014-06-14 01:19:00 UTC
As cool as it would be, it would have large implications for station camps. So, not supported.
Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#3 - 2014-06-14 02:14:22 UTC
Komi Toran wrote:
As cool as it would be, it would have large implications for station camps. So, not supported.


Ya wouldn't want to lose that "fun" gameplay of quickly docking/undocking to see who's in or out of the station. Big smile

+1 to idea. Pretty sure it's been brought up a thousand times before.

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Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#4 - 2014-06-14 02:43:57 UTC
I don't mind watching the station outside, however I wouldn't let you see what's out there. Just something different to spin.
Saisin
Chao3's Rogue Operatives Corp
#5 - 2014-06-14 03:43:57 UTC
It seems silly to have to resort to an alt to see what is outside of a station, and to imagine that from within a station you can't even know what ships are around., but you can when you are in a tiny pod...
Most of the people will already have the intel.
What is the point of not being able to check what is going on?

If the timer for re docking was set to a length creating a real risk for undocking I would understand that there is a game design behind it, but the way it is Indicates that this is an heritage of shuffled priorities and probably one of the higher hanging dev fruit...

After 10 years, it would be nice to see this fixed, one way (allow checking outside the station from within) or the other (increase the re-docking time to commit an undocking ship to a blind fight if playing without alt or intel)

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Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2014-06-14 04:41:23 UTC
Saisin wrote:
It seems silly to have to resort to an alt to see what is outside of a station, and to imagine that from within a station you can't even know what ships are around., but you can when you are in a tiny pod...
Most of the people will already have the intel.
What is the point of not being able to check what is going on?

If the timer for re docking was set to a length creating a real risk for undocking I would understand that there is a game design behind it, but the way it is Indicates that this is an heritage of shuffled priorities and probably one of the higher hanging dev fruit...

After 10 years, it would be nice to see this fixed, one way (allow checking outside the station from within) or the other (increase the re-docking time to commit an undocking ship to a blind fight if playing without alt or intel)

the second one though would lead to a majority of lowsec stations being camped, afterall, it means your sebo'd tornados with a sebo'd inty on the undock get free kills, which would lead to no one undocking if there were other people in local.

hell, the whole station system is a pain in the ass, because the entire system discourages fights, because once your at the point where your station camping, the fights just stop happening, since the docked people have no clue WHAT is outside or how badly they are outnumbered/outmatched, they just wont undock, or they completely outnumber the enemy, so undock, adn the enemy leaves before a shot is even fired.

Kinda why, in my darkest EVE wishes, i wish ships and everythign else in EVE, were visible, if thyre docked, theyre IN a dock, you can see out, they can see in, everyone can fight mid-docking to inside the station. you know, the full star wars experience.

Star Citizen was supposed to be this but star citizen dropped that ball a week or two after it was announced with every other bad design decision they made (read as almost everything theyve decided). and even then its not the "full experience".

I eman yes this is a rant, just in my most wonderous dreams I wish EVE hada mind control helmet and was matrix style in ingame realism, thatd be fun. unfortuenately we cant even get away from lag with the system we have now.

and before anyone says anything about how incoherent this post is, i know, im stuck between being half asleep and drugged up on pain killers, so im just hoping im hitting the tright keyz.
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#7 - 2014-06-14 08:40:07 UTC
Komi Toran wrote:
As cool as it would be, it would have large implications for station camps. So, not supported.


As cool as it would be, it would have large implications for station camps, So definitely supported.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#8 - 2014-06-14 08:43:10 UTC
Nariya Kentaya wrote:
Saisin wrote:
It seems silly to have to resort to an alt to see what is outside of a station, and to imagine that from within a station you can't even know what ships are around., but you can when you are in a tiny pod...
Most of the people will already have the intel.
What is the point of not being able to check what is going on?

If the timer for re docking was set to a length creating a real risk for undocking I would understand that there is a game design behind it, but the way it is Indicates that this is an heritage of shuffled priorities and probably one of the higher hanging dev fruit...

After 10 years, it would be nice to see this fixed, one way (allow checking outside the station from within) or the other (increase the re-docking time to commit an undocking ship to a blind fight if playing without alt or intel)

the second one though would lead to a majority of lowsec stations being camped, afterall, it means your sebo'd tornados with a sebo'd inty on the undock get free kills, which would lead to no one undocking if there were other people in local.

hell, the whole station system is a pain in the ass, because the entire system discourages fights, because once your at the point where your station camping, the fights just stop happening, since the docked people have no clue WHAT is outside or how badly they are outnumbered/outmatched, they just wont undock, or they completely outnumber the enemy, so undock, adn the enemy leaves before a shot is even fired.

Kinda why, in my darkest EVE wishes, i wish ships and everythign else in EVE, were visible, if thyre docked, theyre IN a dock, you can see out, they can see in, everyone can fight mid-docking to inside the station. you know, the full star wars experience.

Star Citizen was supposed to be this but star citizen dropped that ball a week or two after it was announced with every other bad design decision they made (read as almost everything theyve decided). and even then its not the "full experience".

I eman yes this is a rant, just in my most wonderous dreams I wish EVE hada mind control helmet and was matrix style in ingame realism, thatd be fun. unfortuenately we cant even get away from lag with the system we have now.

and before anyone says anything about how incoherent this post is, i know, im stuck between being half asleep and drugged up on pain killers, so im just hoping im hitting the tright keyz.


Sorry to hear about t he pain killers, get well soon. And your post was good enough for me.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...
Takara Mora
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2014-06-14 14:59:42 UTC
Komi Toran wrote:
As cool as it would be, it would have large implications for station camps. So, not supported.


Hey Komi, would you mind describing more of the implications for station camps (Pro's/Cons as you see them)?

Not sure I understand fully .... wouldn't any serious campers or camp breakers have spy alts available anyway?

So far I see this less of a war mechanic issue (since there are so many ways to counter it), and more just as a way to add more visual wonder & experience to EVE ....
Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#10 - 2014-06-14 15:10:41 UTC
/supported

If too many pliots have compalins about it *sigh*, then it could be implemented as see only, no overview, no mouse over, no brackets, just 'look at', rotation and 'zoom'.
Bohneik Itohn
10.K
#11 - 2014-06-14 15:43:29 UTC
Nariya Kentaya wrote:

Star Citizen was supposed to be this but star citizen dropped that ball a week or two after it was announced with every other bad design decision they made (read as almost everything theyve decided). and even then its not the "full experience".



Elite: Dangerous is going to be a step closer to that. There's hope.

As far as station spinning goes, I'd like to see it done as a holographic model in the captain's quarters. The idea of conflicting with station camping is moot. Undocking, Ctrl+space and re-docking has always made station camping a trivial annoyance, unless you didn't know Ctrl+space doesn't break your invulnerability and get shot because of it. But that's your fault.

You could also implement it in such a manner that the station cam is an "object" (quotations because having the movement of the object tied to the field of view would ruin the whole free movement appeal of "spinning" ) on grid around high sec stations only, justification being that in low sec and null sec the criminals are quick to shoot them for obvious reasons. Maybe make it so that in null sec a station owner can choose to deploy a camera but anyone camping the station can pop it as easily as any low-skilled drone. Low sec NPC station owners just have no interest in throwing out free target practice for the hooligans. Better if they find something else to catch their attention.

This makes it less boring to sit in a trade hub offloading all of your crap, makes no changes to low sec, and gives null sec a useless feature to go along with all of their other useless features, because that's what they're used to by now.

Seems reasonable.

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Komi Toran
Perkone
Caldari State
#12 - 2014-06-14 15:49:39 UTC
Takara Mora wrote:
Not sure I understand fully .... wouldn't any serious campers or camp breakers have spy alts available anyway?

The serious will always be prepared, that's why they're "serious." This shifts the balance towards the unprepared. So, not supported.
Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#13 - 2014-06-14 15:50:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Fer'isam K'ahn
The only issues I really see is the impact on the server when 1500 jita trader practically 'undock' when they change the scenery for the entertainment. - The holo sim with the holo station and just dots for ships plus zoom might be an improvement. Maybe colorcoded dots for the security rating/standings.

That way you know numbers and tags, but no names or ship types and cant see weapon modules, that shoudl satisfy the 'too much free intel', 'use an alt', 'be prepared' crowd.
Bohneik Itohn
10.K
#14 - 2014-06-14 16:11:49 UTC
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:
The only issues I really see is the impact on the server when 1500 jita trader practically 'undock' when they change the scenery for the entertainment. - The holo sim with the holo station and just dots for ships plus zoom might be an improvement. Maybe colorcoded dots for the security rating/standings.

That way you know numbers and tags, but no names or ship types and cant see weapon modules, that shoudl satisfy the 'too much free intel', 'use an alt', 'be prepared' crowd.


Server impact could be completely minimal if it was just one view being generated and shared with anyone who wanted to view it, without putting any sort of extra phantom objects on grid. Camera control has always been client-side, this wouldn't be any different.

The rest of the stuff everyone else needlessly dragged into the conversation doesn't need to exist. Taking the OP at it's face value - Straight station spinning for some extra eye candy - you do not need to include any intel beyond what someone can already safely gather, period. Anyone can already get on grid outside of a station safely to gather all of the information they want about any hostiles outside, almost effortlessly. This feature, should it become a feature, doesn't need to have anything beyond art assets shown, and that's why I support it.

Wait, CCP kills kittens now too?!  - Freyya

Are you a forum alt? Have you ever wondered why your experience on the forums is always so frustrating and unrewarding? This may help.
Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#15 - 2014-06-14 16:46:36 UTC
Bohneik Itohn wrote:
....

.... all of the information they want about any hostiles outside, almost effortlessly. This feature, should it become a feature, doesn't need to have anything beyond art assets shown, and that's why I support it.


Agreed.
Komi Toran
Perkone
Caldari State
#16 - 2014-06-14 16:47:09 UTC
Bohneik Itohn wrote:
Anyone can already get on grid outside of a station safely to gather all of the information they want about any hostiles outside, almost effortlessly.

This is news to me. How do I, who has no alt accounts, get on grid *safely* outside of a station I'm docked at, when that station has an insta-undock point? In 0.0. With 30 unknowns in system. I would like to know, because I could have used that information yesterday.
Bohneik Itohn
10.K
#17 - 2014-06-14 17:46:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Bohneik Itohn
Komi Toran wrote:
Bohneik Itohn wrote:
Anyone can already get on grid outside of a station safely to gather all of the information they want about any hostiles outside, almost effortlessly.

This is news to me. How do I, who has no alt accounts, get on grid *safely* outside of a station I'm docked at, when that station has an insta-undock point? In 0.0. With 30 unknowns in system. I would like to know, because I could have used that information yesterday.



Undock.

You now have 30 seconds of invulnerability until you take any action, including clicking on your overview or objects in space, with one exception.

Ctrl+space, which stops your ship, can be pressed without breaking invulnerability, and you will stop within docking range. Look at your overview to learn what you need to learn, right click the station and dock.

Easiest scouting maneuver ever.

Edit: If by insta-undock you mean you immediately gain distance on that station after undocking, why were you docking at a dangerous station in a no-sec area where hostiles frequent? That's not a game flaw, that's a player's mistake.

Wait, CCP kills kittens now too?!  - Freyya

Are you a forum alt? Have you ever wondered why your experience on the forums is always so frustrating and unrewarding? This may help.
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2014-06-14 17:50:49 UTC
Some stations kick you out too fast, test it first Blink
Bohneik Itohn
10.K
#19 - 2014-06-14 17:52:35 UTC
afkalt wrote:
Some stations kick you out too fast, test it first Blink


I use it regularly, and there is a discrepancy in what you're flying in using this method. If you're in a ship that gets kicked out doing 1km/sec or better you're going to have problems doing this yes, but you also shouldn't have problems aligning and warping to a safe undock bookmark before getting blapped if you're in a ship that is that agile.

Wait, CCP kills kittens now too?!  - Freyya

Are you a forum alt? Have you ever wondered why your experience on the forums is always so frustrating and unrewarding? This may help.
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#20 - 2014-06-14 17:53:36 UTC
Yes, I wasn't trying to disagree per-se, just urging people to test it BEFORE they are trapped Smile
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