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[Crius] Manufacturing and general UI feedback

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Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#221 - 2014-07-03 09:24:29 UTC
The Ironfist wrote:
CCP Greyscale wrote:

Entirely my fault, nothing to do with Nullarbor who I may have mistakenly fingered as the culprit earlier :)

-Greyscale


1% ME per Upgrade level that means you pay 25b for the step from 2% to 3% how is that ever worth it? Especially when you compare it to minmatar outpost refining upgrades. It is not in line at all. Its a downright boring and coward change. If you want localized industry in null-sec you're going to have to do better then that.

At minimum a fully upgraded amarr outpost should have a reduction of 15% anything below that is plain pointless.


Only to export your Made in China stuff to High sec and sell it there? Roll 5% is good enough to give your local industry an edge over importers, but also prohibit exports to High sec and thus forces encourages you to use your stuff locally.

I don't see a problem here if you do it as intended, and not in the way you want to exploit the system. Blink

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
The Ironfist
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#222 - 2014-07-03 10:50:36 UTC
Rivr Luzade wrote:
The Ironfist wrote:
CCP Greyscale wrote:

Entirely my fault, nothing to do with Nullarbor who I may have mistakenly fingered as the culprit earlier :)

-Greyscale


1% ME per Upgrade level that means you pay 25b for the step from 2% to 3% how is that ever worth it? Especially when you compare it to minmatar outpost refining upgrades. It is not in line at all. Its a downright boring and coward change. If you want localized industry in null-sec you're going to have to do better then that.

At minimum a fully upgraded amarr outpost should have a reduction of 15% anything below that is plain pointless.


Only to export your Made in China stuff to High sec and sell it there? Roll 5% is good enough to give your local industry an edge over importers, but also prohibit exports to High sec and thus forces encourages you to use your stuff locally.

I don't see a problem here if you do it as intended, and not in the way you want to exploit the system. Blink


5% for 60b you don't see the problem with that? 1% per upgrade is next to no return on your investment. Also 5% will not give you an edge over importers because for T2/T3 you will still need to import materials...

Again look at the Minmatar outpost were you get 19,6% more efficient refining for 60b and then compare it to 3% you get for 60b for upgrading a amarr outpost to Tier3. You don't see an issue here?
But there is literally no point in ever upgrading an amarr outpost after this. Because an investment is only sound if you can recope it in a reasonable amount of time now do tell me how long it'll take to recope 60b with 3% material bonus.. best case you build capitals meaning you get the bonus twice once on the parts once on the ship itself. So thats 6% below what everyone else can build right? WRONG because lowsec got their new CAA. Which means the real difference shrinks to 4%..
But lets just do the math with 6% so it doesn't look like complete ****.

Lets go with Naglfar's they cost about 2b in minerals to build 6% from that is 120mil so thats 120mil "safed" per dread.
Which means you'll have to build 500 naglfars to recope your investment can you sell 500 naglfars local? nop never not a chance in hell so you'll have to move em to a lowsec system. Thats gonna again cut into your profit. Can you get the minerals for 500 dreads local? Nop not a chance again gotta import thats gonna cost you money.

You see the problem here now? Essentially there is no point in changing it to an ME bonus if its only 1% per level. Thats utterly pointless. Because hoping to hold the outpost for years its gonna take you to recope that is not realistic. How long do you think it takes to recope the cost of upgrading a minmatar outpost to Tier3? Lemme tell you 2 months or 4 titan builds to be more precise.
Telleran Ossadour
Heimatar Enhanced Fleet Industries
#223 - 2014-07-03 11:00:35 UTC
Generally liking the new UI. Most issues have already been raised by other posters many times already, but there's one that needs a little more love:

Regan Rotineque wrote:
3 - Under the facitilites tab you see a list of the different facilities....one of the columns is "SYSTEM COST INDEX" however there is no hover over - no value associated with this column except "it gets filled with more color" as the system get's busier. My question is why not give us the value ? Why not show us what the actual figure used to calculate is here ?


Very much this, and even more true since there's no indication of what the bar itself represents -- no units, no scale. What does that one pixel difference between two facilities actually mean? And, speaking as a geriatric industrialist with failing eyes (and colourblind to boot!), that's assuming I can even see the difference! Not to mention the problems comparing across different regions...

In an expansion that pushing the importance of player decision making rather than character skills in attaining industrial success, it seems strange that one of the primary influences on where you build is being so obfuscated. Show us the numbers! And, while you're at it, why not include the Manufacturing Cost Index and Research Cost Index in the "Solar System: Information" window?
Jarnis McPieksu
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#224 - 2014-07-03 11:00:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Jarnis McPieksu
If the goal was to have a good enough Manufacturing UI that third party programs & spreadsheets would not be as required, this one fails at least for T2 building.

When building off invented T2 BPC, input costs = costs of *components*, not their materials. Makes sense, but also is highly misleading. T2 component market is commonly manipulated to hell & back and no T2 builder actually buys pre-built components unless there is some major disturbance in reaction material markets (at which point the thin component market goes *poof* in a hurry as underpriced stuff is hoovered up). So the input prices are meaningless.

So only way to build T2 is to have a spreadsheet/third party app which calculates the costs of components and then sums those up.

Also invention costs are highly misleading as the cost of the Data Interface is summed up even if it is not consumed in the process. So the UI cannot be used for determining cost of invention either.

Also both input cost and output value estimates are IN MOUSEOVER TOOLTIPS which is beyond stupid...

So the UI estimates are useless and you still need a speadsheet or third party application to build anything (unless you feel like building stuff blindly with no clue as to profit/loss - plenty of people like that in EVE, I know..)

So we get a clumsy, slow (and, I admit, somewhat pretty) UI that does nothing useful, is slower and in some ways more complicated and I still need a third party application to do any T2 production.

Way to go guys... Mission accomplished.

Could you perhaps get someone to design the interface who has actually built anything in EVE in an industrial scale? Pretty please?

Also at least the values present on SISI today lead me to believe that all the hubub about teams is effectively hot air. The bonuses are irrelevantly small unless you are cranking out multi-billion ISK jobs. Yes, Teams, job installation costs and station vs. POS differences allow for dedicated players to eke out additional percentage or three of profit, but the profit vs. effort equation is completely out of whack. Who cares about a few percentage points. Optimization of playtime vs. output volume / ISK/hr is the name of the game.
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#225 - 2014-07-03 13:10:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Rivr Luzade
The Ironfist wrote:
Blah


You name it yourself: The Minmatar Outpost provides you with ridiculously cheap minerals, and on top of that you still want an even more ridiculous reduction on manufacturing. Are you out of your mind? Roll

And you don't need to import nearly as many items as you want to make the world believe. You have tons of moon minerals locally in your Sov 00, let alone ice and normal minerals. The only thing you absolutely need to import are moon minerals and their products that don't grow on your moons. That is all there is to import. And if you followed that lead (use your local resources, actually mine in your space instead of using outsourced Made in Bangladesh minerals, you have a very big edge over the importers.

Get your act together and start living in your space and not just cherry-pick what like to do. That is not what Sovereignty is supposed to be. All you 00 dwellers want to make it a holiday resort with massive benefits, instead of a home turf with all sorts of labor, activities and resulting benefits. This is a disgusting attitude. If people would actually do that, there would be a slight chance of actually giving the outpost a better than it currently is bonus to ME; however, as people are only after exploiting the system, giving the outpost more than 5% is absolutely wrong.

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
Aaron Raven
De Likedeelers
#226 - 2014-07-03 13:26:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Aaron Raven
I don't know if this is already a know issue, but the Industrial-UI looks a bit wired after resizing the column width, please see http://i.imgur.com/kgmONrB.png for details.

The fist impression of the new UI is great, the Idea behind it also ... but a fixed size (not resizeable) is IMHO a bad idea.
Firvain
Wildly Inappropriate
Wildly Inappropriate.
#227 - 2014-07-03 14:56:15 UTC
The Ironfist wrote:
Rivr Luzade wrote:
The Ironfist wrote:
CCP Greyscale wrote:

Entirely my fault, nothing to do with Nullarbor who I may have mistakenly fingered as the culprit earlier :)

-Greyscale


1% ME per Upgrade level that means you pay 25b for the step from 2% to 3% how is that ever worth it? Especially when you compare it to minmatar outpost refining upgrades. It is not in line at all. Its a downright boring and coward change. If you want localized industry in null-sec you're going to have to do better then that.

At minimum a fully upgraded amarr outpost should have a reduction of 15% anything below that is plain pointless.


Only to export your Made in China stuff to High sec and sell it there? Roll 5% is good enough to give your local industry an edge over importers, but also prohibit exports to High sec and thus forces encourages you to use your stuff locally.

I don't see a problem here if you do it as intended, and not in the way you want to exploit the system. Blink


5% for 60b you don't see the problem with that? 1% per upgrade is next to no return on your investment. Also 5% will not give you an edge over importers because for T2/T3 you will still need to import materials...

Again look at the Minmatar outpost were you get 19,6% more efficient refining for 60b and then compare it to 3% you get for 60b for upgrading a amarr outpost to Tier3. You don't see an issue here?
But there is literally no point in ever upgrading an amarr outpost after this. Because an investment is only sound if you can recope it in a reasonable amount of time now do tell me how long it'll take to recope 60b with 3% material bonus.. best case you build capitals meaning you get the bonus twice once on the parts once on the ship itself. So thats 6% below what everyone else can build right? WRONG because lowsec got their new CAA. Which means the real difference shrinks to 4%..
But lets just do the math with 6% so it doesn't look like complete ****.

Lets go with Naglfar's they cost about 2b in minerals to build 6% from that is 120mil so thats 120mil "safed" per dread.
Which means you'll have to build 500 naglfars to recope your investment can you sell 500 naglfars local? nop never not a chance in hell so you'll have to move em to a lowsec system. Thats gonna again cut into your profit. Can you get the minerals for 500 dreads local? Nop not a chance again gotta import thats gonna cost you money.

You see the problem here now? Essentially there is no point in changing it to an ME bonus if its only 1% per level. Thats utterly pointless. Because hoping to hold the outpost for years its gonna take you to recope that is not realistic. How long do you think it takes to recope the cost of upgrading a minmatar outpost to Tier3? Lemme tell you 2 months or 4 titan builds to be more precise.



You do know you get a 5% bonus right not 3%? there are 2 diffrent upgrades that aid in manufacturing, plant and factory, so you can have 5 of them for a total of 5% ME reduction.

Also if you think 5% is nothing then you shouldnt invest 60 bill in teh upgrades. My usual turn over is between 500 and 700 billion ISK. Saving 5% on that means i save 25 billion ISK every month. So that station pays for itself in 2 months. Not bad. Considering I am not alone that station will pay for itself alot faster then 2 months. So pretty much the same time as your minmatar station. Guess we are good then
Firvain
Wildly Inappropriate
Wildly Inappropriate.
#228 - 2014-07-03 15:01:18 UTC
Rivr Luzade wrote:
The Ironfist wrote:
Blah


You name it yourself: The Minmatar Outpost provides you with ridiculously cheap minerals, and on top of that you still want an even more ridiculous reduction on manufacturing. Are you out of your mind? Roll

And you don't need to import nearly as many items as you want to make the world believe. You have tons of moon minerals locally in your Sov 00, let alone ice and normal minerals. The only thing you absolutely need to import are moon minerals and their products that don't grow on your moons. That is all there is to import. And if you followed that lead (use your local resources, actually mine in your space instead of using outsourced Made in Bangladesh minerals, you have a very big edge over the importers.

Get your act together and start living in your space and not just cherry-pick what like to do. That is not what Sovereignty is supposed to be. All you 00 dwellers want to make it a holiday resort with massive benefits, instead of a home turf with all sorts of labor, activities and resulting benefits. This is a disgusting attitude. If people would actually do that, there would be a slight chance of actually giving the outpost a better than it currently is bonus to ME; however, as people are only after exploiting the system, giving the outpost more than 5% is absolutely wrong.



The problem with 0.0 is there arent enough miners around to supply all the builders with lowends. I personally use 5 billion trit every week, thats a fuckton of miners to supply just my needs, let alone the other guys who are building stuff in deklein.

The problem with aquiring minerals in 0.0 is that you have a lot smaller pool of miners to grab from compared to empire. even if miner density was the same in 0.0 as its in empire i still only have acces to 1 or 2 regions realisticly to buy minerals in. Compared in empire where I can just buy them in every region because shipping is retardly safe in there.
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#229 - 2014-07-03 15:06:09 UTC
Rivr Luzade wrote:
A thing that just now jumped to my mind again:

Will the years-old error be fixed that BPO have the Invention tab and BPC the Copy/TE-/ME-Research tab even though neither nor is possible for them? The tabs need to be interchanged.


I have to pleasantly admit that this was fixed very elegantly with the industry tab and the symbols. The BPO now only show Manufacturing, ME-Research, TE-Research and Copying as possible activities. BPC now only show Manufacturing or Manufacturing and Invention when this is actually possible. Very good. Big smile

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#230 - 2014-07-03 15:47:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Rivr Luzade
Just out of curiosity:

There is no way in-game to see the outcome of your BPO-Research? When I research I'd like to know at a glance what my result is going to be with the different levels. Instead of knowing "Outcome: ⌛ +20%", I'd much rather see:

Quote:
Outcome:
Original time: | Output time:
20H 25M 47S | 18H 21M 32S

⌛ -20%


Same for minerals

Quote:

Material | Original materials: | Output materials:
Trit | 250 | 225

♦ -10%


Also, notice the -10%. I am not sure how others think about that, but if I see a +20% as research result, I don't think (and I actually did not when I tried it on Sisi) of an improvement on the BPO, but rather that the time is 20% longer now or that I require 10% more material. Call it irrational, but this is going to cause a lot of confusion.

And another thing, which I already mentioned somewhere, is the "Job Runs". The research levels are not Job Runs, they are Research Levels...

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
Logicycle
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#231 - 2014-07-03 15:53:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Logicycle
Would it be possible to make the Industry UI window collapse up,, so that we can look at the tabs in the bottom half of the window using the full size of the window? That Blueprint calculator thing usess a LOT of window space and is completely unmovable at all. This would help in being able to look at a long list of build/invent jobs easily or finding a facilty without having to look at the blueprint thingy every single time.

You have the ability to collapse the tabs already, same thing, but for the top half of the window.

Also the input / output selector does not remember the location previously used. This needs to remember which corp hanger i used last time when building.
Pic'n dor
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#232 - 2014-07-03 17:31:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Pic'n dor
Dareth Astrar wrote:


- On the Accept Quote? screen previously, you could press CTRL+C to copy the information, and paste it outside of the game. This was regularly useful when buying minerals, as you could see the exact install requirements and copy them else where to consolidate. The new 'Pretty' UI screen is less useful/practical as you cannot see a complete list of the materials unless you hover over a > icon or you can see the items icons, but the quantities are abbreviated (useless).


As you said, there is a mouse-over feature (blue arrow) : http://i.imgur.com/Q1apIqk.png
If you right click there, you hjave a "copy material" and you get something like that :

Quote:
Planetary materials
typeID Item Available Required Est. Unit price
2868 Integrity Response Drones 0 6 1367760.3845
2869 Nano-Factory 0 11 603158.5279
2870 Organic Mortar Applicators 0 11 687405.3778
2875 Sterile Conduits 0 16 731255.7516

Components
typeID Item Available Required Est. Unit price
21037 Capital Construction Parts 0 1 7329757.1703



With little effort, you can make it useful :) and it perfectly paste on a spreadsheet :)

COUCOU TOUCHE TOUCHE
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
#233 - 2014-07-03 18:35:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Bugsy VanHalen
I noticed something on SiSi I did not see mention of in the patch notes. I have not seen any mention of it anywhere else.

I was debating whether to even mention this as it could be a profitable venture if it makes it to TQ.

As we all know, the ship assembly arrays have had some name changes and updates.

What I noticed is the capital ship assembly array, formerly the X-large ship assembly array, which used to only be anchor able in space below 0.4. which used to mean 0.3 or lower. It was stated that this was changed so that the former below 0.4 space no means 0.4 or lower.

However the capital ship assembly array on SiSi now says "Restricted to security level of at most 0.5"

Does this mean these assembly arrays, which can build not only freighters, jump freighters, and orca's, (these can be built in the large ship assembly array), but the capital ship assembly array can also build Roqual, dreadnaughts, and carriers, can it now be anchored in high sec 0.5 space?

I am thinking maybe this was changed before the code was updated allowing 0.4 restriction to actually mean 0.4. if it was changed before the code update 0.5 would have meant 0.4 or lower, but with the code update this should be anchorable in 0.5 space, in high sec, which would allow carriers and dreads to be built in high sec.

Is this an intended change, or just a oversight nobody caught yet?

I have tested this on SiSi, and it did let me anchor the capital ship assembly array in 0.5 high sec.
Yinmatook
Skilled Refugees
#234 - 2014-07-03 18:36:56 UTC
I notice that when I am setting up an Industry job that if I am missing input materials on the left, I can right click the image and select to buy or view market - if I select buy, it opens up a window to purchase the number of the item I am missing. However, (at least on SiSi) that is frequently a lot of hops away, and I'm doing my testing in a system that has a seeded station.

Can we get the option to buy cheapest or buy closest?

Thanks for your consideration.
The Ironfist
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#235 - 2014-07-03 19:19:44 UTC
Firvain wrote:
The Ironfist wrote:
Rivr Luzade wrote:
The Ironfist wrote:
CCP Greyscale wrote:

Entirely my fault, nothing to do with Nullarbor who I may have mistakenly fingered as the culprit earlier :)

-Greyscale


1% ME per Upgrade level that means you pay 25b for the step from 2% to 3% how is that ever worth it? Especially when you compare it to minmatar outpost refining upgrades. It is not in line at all. Its a downright boring and coward change. If you want localized industry in null-sec you're going to have to do better then that.

At minimum a fully upgraded amarr outpost should have a reduction of 15% anything below that is plain pointless.


Only to export your Made in China stuff to High sec and sell it there? Roll 5% is good enough to give your local industry an edge over importers, but also prohibit exports to High sec and thus forces encourages you to use your stuff locally.

I don't see a problem here if you do it as intended, and not in the way you want to exploit the system. Blink


5% for 60b you don't see the problem with that? 1% per upgrade is next to no return on your investment. Also 5% will not give you an edge over importers because for T2/T3 you will still need to import materials...

Again look at the Minmatar outpost were you get 19,6% more efficient refining for 60b and then compare it to 3% you get for 60b for upgrading a amarr outpost to Tier3. You don't see an issue here?
But there is literally no point in ever upgrading an amarr outpost after this. Because an investment is only sound if you can recope it in a reasonable amount of time now do tell me how long it'll take to recope 60b with 3% material bonus.. best case you build capitals meaning you get the bonus twice once on the parts once on the ship itself. So thats 6% below what everyone else can build right? WRONG because lowsec got their new CAA. Which means the real difference shrinks to 4%..
But lets just do the math with 6% so it doesn't look like complete ****.

Lets go with Naglfar's they cost about 2b in minerals to build 6% from that is 120mil so thats 120mil "safed" per dread.
Which means you'll have to build 500 naglfars to recope your investment can you sell 500 naglfars local? nop never not a chance in hell so you'll have to move em to a lowsec system. Thats gonna again cut into your profit. Can you get the minerals for 500 dreads local? Nop not a chance again gotta import thats gonna cost you money.

You see the problem here now? Essentially there is no point in changing it to an ME bonus if its only 1% per level. Thats utterly pointless. Because hoping to hold the outpost for years its gonna take you to recope that is not realistic. How long do you think it takes to recope the cost of upgrading a minmatar outpost to Tier3? Lemme tell you 2 months or 4 titan builds to be more precise.



You do know you get a 5% bonus right not 3%? there are 2 diffrent upgrades that aid in manufacturing, plant and factory, so you can have 5 of them for a total of 5% ME reduction.

Also if you think 5% is nothing then you shouldnt invest 60 bill in teh upgrades. My usual turn over is between 500 and 700 billion ISK. Saving 5% on that means i save 25 billion ISK every month. So that station pays for itself in 2 months. Not bad. Considering I am not alone that station will pay for itself alot faster then 2 months. So pretty much the same time as your minmatar station. Guess we are good then


It wont because the more you use it and everyone else the higher your installation cost.. so its actually counter-productive.
5 upgrades for a mare 5% is still really really bad.
Nalha Saldana
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#236 - 2014-07-03 20:14:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Nalha Saldana
There needs to be a bpo/bpc filtering system when looking at blueprints tab in the industry UI. Especially when looking in List view its hard to tell them apart.

The UI doesnt update nearly as much as it needs to, even when you jump it doesnt update to the station you are in and the blueprint list set to "current station" shows you the blueprints in the station you were last in.

Sure you have made tons of updates to make this fancy good looking UI, it saves a ton of clicks for sure but it doesnt give me any new information. I want a UI that can at least help me a tiny bit to know which option is better for me.

I want a estimated profit by comparing your average unit price of input and output minus production fees, its all there and would be super easy for you to implement.

This should not only be there for manufacturing but the super complex invention system could really need some simple built in math for the resulting blueprint.
Ranamar
Nobody in Local
Deepwater Hooligans
#237 - 2014-07-03 21:51:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Ranamar
The Ironfist wrote:
Firvain wrote:
You do know you get a 5% bonus right not 3%? there are 2 diffrent upgrades that aid in manufacturing, plant and factory, so you can have 5 of them for a total of 5% ME reduction.

Also if you think 5% is nothing then you shouldnt invest 60 bill in teh upgrades. My usual turn over is between 500 and 700 billion ISK. Saving 5% on that means i save 25 billion ISK every month. So that station pays for itself in 2 months. Not bad. Considering I am not alone that station will pay for itself alot faster then 2 months. So pretty much the same time as your minmatar station. Guess we are good then


It wont because the more you use it and everyone else the higher your installation cost.. so its actually counter-productive.
5 upgrades for a mare 5% is still really really bad.


I consume about a billion ISK of materials per day on one of my characters doing manufacturing. I don't know if this is high or low, so let's use a conservative figure saying that an industrialist consumes 50M ISK worth of stuff per slot per day.

A 500k ISK (1% savings on 50M ISK) per slot per day savings doesn't sound like much, but that's about 10000 slot-days for 25B ISK. One character pays that off in about 3 years, which isn't great. 10 characters, though, running full-tilt, would pay it off in about 3 months... and if they're instead consuming materials more like the way I do, it ends up being closer to paying off in a month and a half for 10 characters.

Admittedly, you'll lose some of this in transportation, but you won't lose more in transportation by upgrading, if you were already planning to build at that station. (In fact, due to input volume decreasing, you may save a little on transportation, depending on whether your inbound transport is already saturated.) This transportation issue is probably going to make Minmatar stations the station of choice for manufacturing capitals, but for things that don't use T1 minerals? That Minmatar station bonus doesn't do anything at all for T2 mods, rigs, or deployables, which are mostly built out of moongoo products, salvage, and PI stuff.
constructum
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#238 - 2014-07-04 00:43:29 UTC
Is there anyway you can make it so you can deliver multiple selected jobs with 1 click but not ALL the jobs.

Currently on tranquility you can ctrl or shift + select multiple jobs to deliver at once without delivering all jobs

On sisi with the new interface every job has to be individually delivered which results in a significantly larger number of clicks

Delivering all jobs at once is not always desirable because sometimes you want to leave a corp member's jobs up if they are in a different time zone or so you dont haveto deal with sorting out which delivered items belong to which person.
Dareth Astrar
Astrar Logistics and Engineering
#239 - 2014-07-04 06:18:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Dareth Astrar
Pic'n dor wrote:
Dareth Astrar wrote:


- On the Accept Quote? screen previously, you could press CTRL+C to copy the information, and paste it outside of the game. This was regularly useful when buying minerals, as you could see the exact install requirements and copy them else where to consolidate. The new 'Pretty' UI screen is less useful/practical as you cannot see a complete list of the materials unless you hover over a > icon or you can see the items icons, but the quantities are abbreviated (useless).


As you said, there is a mouse-over feature (blue arrow) : http://i.imgur.com/Q1apIqk.png
If you right click there, you hjave a "copy material" and you get something like that :

Quote:
Planetary materials
typeID Item Available Required Est. Unit price
2868 Integrity Response Drones 0 6 1367760.3845
2869 Nano-Factory 0 11 603158.5279
2870 Organic Mortar Applicators 0 11 687405.3778
2875 Sterile Conduits 0 16 731255.7516

Components
typeID Item Available Required Est. Unit price
21037 Capital Construction Parts 0 1 7329757.1703



With little effort, you can make it useful :) and it perfectly paste on a spreadsheet :)


Sadly we've rarely found these things useful, but I know when I've helped people get into manufacturing in the past they have found it useful, as when they are starting out they are focusing on one or two item builds. We have our own software to help us, so for us the formulae changes are much greater importance to know.

Good to see for some of the newer characters, but again it's hidden information. It's only intuitive if people know those facilities exist. Whilst I'd already found them, thank you for pointing out there was a means to copy the data.

I do so wish they would also consider people that use keyboards as well though, CTRL+C is much faster then hover over - right click and copy. :)

Perhaps a pulsing colour changing border around these (>) icons to encourage people to find out what they are, or have some kind of pop-up first time the new UI is opened or in the tutorials, so that people will learn the information they contain. :)
Drak d'Amral
Necrotic Dancer Cartel
#240 - 2014-07-04 08:21:05 UTC
i testet it yesterday and i think there is a mistake in the calculation for invention

if you want to start a invention, and you wanna know what cost you have with this shiny new mouseover, then i counts the data interface to the cost. i think thats not correct because the data interface will not cosumed trou the process, so it's should not be calculatet