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Drone Regions
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Zimmy Zeta
Perkone
Caldari State
#61 - 2011-11-18 14:12:35 UTC
Rykuss wrote:
-wall of text -


Hey, I am not your enemy here. I, too, think that mining should be worthwhile and already said that several times. But cutting off 74% of your vital supplies (still don't know if this number is correct) before you have any feasible idea how to compensate for that is just utter madness.

I'd like to apologize for the poor quality of the post above and sincerely hope you didn't waste your time reading it. Yes, I do feel bad about it.
Acac Sunflyier
The Ascended Academy
#62 - 2011-11-18 15:50:33 UTC
David Grogan wrote:
Acac Sunflyier wrote:
You know, I think the drones should be left alone. Yeah they don't give isk, they give alloys. So, it doesn't make the alliance isk rich by ratting directly, but it ups their production capabilities. And, if they want good isk, they can just export them to high sec to sell. Putting a bounty on the drones just devalues the isk even more and causes a rise in inflation even more. The thing about the drone regions is that they're not creating too much new isk like, say for example, fountain.


the problem is drones completely devalue the mining industry...

give them a bounty and the occasional augmented Or integrated or harvestor drone and mining laser and ice mining laser upgrades as loot drops.



No bots do it more. Besides, I'd rather have minerals remain as they are than devalue the isk at a faster rate than already.
Rellik B00n
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#63 - 2011-11-18 16:06:40 UTC
+1 for removing drone poop and replacing with bounties.


also, some of the reasons ive seen against doing this in this very thread are actually supporting it!

eg: "pvpers will not be happy when they have to pay double for their ships and mods" - guess what? That makes killing ships and looting them worth something again. If your ship is worth twice as much there is twice the buzz to a fight.

and so on..
[Of a request for change ask: Who Benefits?](https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=199765)
Sirius Cassiopeiae
Perkone
Caldari State
#64 - 2011-11-18 17:22:28 UTC
Acac Sunflyier wrote:
David Grogan wrote:
Acac Sunflyier wrote:
You know, I think the drones should be left alone. Yeah they don't give isk, they give alloys. So, it doesn't make the alliance isk rich by ratting directly, but it ups their production capabilities. And, if they want good isk, they can just export them to high sec to sell. Putting a bounty on the drones just devalues the isk even more and causes a rise in inflation even more. The thing about the drone regions is that they're not creating too much new isk like, say for example, fountain.


the problem is drones completely devalue the mining industry...

give them a bounty and the occasional augmented Or integrated or harvestor drone and mining laser and ice mining laser upgrades as loot drops.



No bots do it more. Besides, I'd rather have minerals remain as they are than devalue the isk at a faster rate than already.



Yea, bots that are grinding drones do ti the most!!!
Why do you think that much of minerals are from drones?
The most of bots are there...

Removing mineral drops from drones will solve the biggest part of botting problem and mineral devaluation because of it...
bornaa
GRiD.
#65 - 2011-11-18 21:45:43 UTC  |  Edited by: bornaa
Acac Sunflyier wrote:
David Grogan wrote:
Acac Sunflyier wrote:
You know, I think the drones should be left alone. Yeah they don't give isk, they give alloys. So, it doesn't make the alliance isk rich by ratting directly, but it ups their production capabilities. And, if they want good isk, they can just export them to high sec to sell. Putting a bounty on the drones just devalues the isk even more and causes a rise in inflation even more. The thing about the drone regions is that they're not creating too much new isk like, say for example, fountain.


the problem is drones completely devalue the mining industry...

give them a bounty and the occasional augmented Or integrated or harvestor drone and mining laser and ice mining laser upgrades as loot drops.



No bots do it more. Besides, I'd rather have minerals remain as they are than devalue the isk at a faster rate than already.



Just say it straight...
I don't give a **** about no one, nor EVE itself, but myself...

And yea... we know...
[Yes, I'm an Amateur](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRa-69uBmIw&feature=relmfu)
Rykuss
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#66 - 2011-11-18 23:04:37 UTC
Zimmy Zeta wrote:
Rykuss wrote:
-wall of text -


Hey, I am not your enemy here. I, too, think that mining should be worthwhile and already said that several times. But cutting off 74% of your vital supplies (still don't know if this number is correct) before you have any feasible idea how to compensate for that is just utter madness.


The only thing that makes us enemies is your inability to accept that someone could have an opinion that differs from your own on the subject. Compensate for what exactly? Do you want to make mining more "interesting" and offer yet another alternative to aquiring minerals? If so, what would be the point? Those vital supplies are there, have been there and will always be there. Your assessment that "the sky is falling" is utter madness. Since my responses have been longer than five words, which you seem to have a problem with, I'll sum up.

You: "Stuff will cost more!"

Me: "So?"

You, too, can be a Solid Gold dancer.
Sezdro
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#67 - 2011-11-19 00:24:30 UTC
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Razin wrote:
Nothing wrong with a simplistic opinion. Adds variety.

Better a simple solution that gets things done then a unique one that has negative effects.

There is a reason were flying around in 747's instead of really cool Zeppelins. There is no Reason a Raven should be able to out mine a Hulk.


Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I could of swore it took more skill points to kill rats/drones than sit around and watch your strip miners extract minerals.

I don't use a Raven, but I do solo drone patrols in a battleship for a decent bit of cash, and it took me a lot longer to get to that point than it would to train for a Hulk.
Rykuss
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#68 - 2011-11-19 02:06:08 UTC
Sezdro wrote:
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Razin wrote:
Nothing wrong with a simplistic opinion. Adds variety.

Better a simple solution that gets things done then a unique one that has negative effects.

There is a reason were flying around in 747's instead of really cool Zeppelins. There is no Reason a Raven should be able to out mine a Hulk.


Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I could of swore it took more skill points to kill rats/drones than sit around and watch your strip miners extract minerals.

I don't use a Raven, but I do solo drone patrols in a battleship for a decent bit of cash, and it took me a lot longer to get to that point than it would to train for a Hulk.


No, it didn't. Even remapped INT/MEM you can get a BS up and running faster than a hulk. Unless of course, you think you need large[insert specialisation of weapon V here] with all the bells and whistles. Why is it, do you suppose, that people go that route in the first place? Hmmm? It isn't just because they hate mining, although that's part of the reason.

You, too, can be a Solid Gold dancer.
Sezdro
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#69 - 2011-11-19 03:06:06 UTC
Rykuss wrote:
Sezdro wrote:
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Razin wrote:
Nothing wrong with a simplistic opinion. Adds variety.

Better a simple solution that gets things done then a unique one that has negative effects.

There is a reason were flying around in 747's instead of really cool Zeppelins. There is no Reason a Raven should be able to out mine a Hulk.


Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I could of swore it took more skill points to kill rats/drones than sit around and watch your strip miners extract minerals.

I don't use a Raven, but I do solo drone patrols in a battleship for a decent bit of cash, and it took me a lot longer to get to that point than it would to train for a Hulk.


No, it didn't. Even remapped INT/MEM you can get a BS up and running faster than a hulk. Unless of course, you think you need large[insert specialisation of weapon V here] with all the bells and whistles. Why is it, do you suppose, that people go that route in the first place? Hmmm? It isn't just because they hate mining, although that's part of the reason.


ALL the bells and whistles, no, but just bare-bones requirements to use a BS would have you making less money through alloys than a hulk pilot through mining. Believe me, I was one of those bare-bones pilots for a bit.

Also, I figured people would tend to take their career in a more combat-oriented path rather than mining because it really is boring (although I could take some enjoyment in being productive in some way through mining), and because combat serves more purpose than just money-making. (I only have 1 account, so I decided to just go for combat on this one character rather than getting mining and then combat.)
rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
#70 - 2011-11-19 10:22:47 UTC
I was also thinking how the market has no reflection sometimes of the drones existing. Well just remembered the mineral contribution to the market drones have. But they have no modules that drop, like officer or faction ones. ie rogue tracking enhancer or such. Maybe drones could be given a new mineral drop that is like worth million is to make up for that. Or an officer version spawns and get 2 bilion worth of minerals from it, or a low cargo capacity alloy that is worth a billion or so.

Signature removed for inappropriate language - CCP Eterne
Avila Cracko
#71 - 2011-11-19 10:54:47 UTC
Sezdro wrote:
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Razin wrote:
Nothing wrong with a simplistic opinion. Adds variety.

Better a simple solution that gets things done then a unique one that has negative effects.

There is a reason were flying around in 747's instead of really cool Zeppelins. There is no Reason a Raven should be able to out mine a Hulk.


Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I could of swore it took more skill points to kill rats/drones than sit around and watch your strip miners extract minerals.

I don't use a Raven, but I do solo drone patrols in a battleship for a decent bit of cash, and it took me a lot longer to get to that point than it would to train for a Hulk.


How I "love" ppl that write things that are lie only to prove their point...
or just don't want to check and write everything only to feel important...
And i know that for what you use/think/have/do is the longest path... allways... Roll

Try to use a little EVE-mon and see... then you write...
You will see that that your BS you got into is not so hard to get...
Even that "lame Hulk" is ship that you need more effort to drive... yea, even that ****** ship that give you 4 times less isk... and in mining... like you use your BS for.. mining... mining by killing...
And... who won the reward for the biggest carebear...
congratulations... ppl that MINE IN BS won it!!!



And about that your thesis that more SP you need for something more different things you have to do..

Logic of all other ppl in all games would be that that thing your ship is for with more SP you do better and better and not spreading their usage...

But with that yours logic...

With that yours logic... for example... Titan should do everything in game because you need the most SP in game...
- so it should be the best killing beast for frigates/cruisers/BC/BS/Dreads/carriers and SC and do it better then any other ships on eve... it shulkd kill 10000000 frigates with one shoot...
- so it should be the best miner... at least 10000X better yield then hulk... in few minutes you mine for production of another titan... thats only fair...
- so it should be the best indy platform... because you need so much SP Titan must do research of Blueprints, copying of blueprints, productions all all things in eve (from ammo and t1/t2 things to capitals), invention... and i have to invest no minerals or time in it... because i am soooo cool with having so much SP in titan that i should all get free and without waiting...
- well... if i need so much SP for it... i must be the best trader when i have it... i must have have access to all markets in the same time... and i need at least get 90% discount for all things (if not free)...
- I am so cool with my all bunch of SP and titan that i must not haul anything because i am ultimate hauler... so all things that i need appear in my cargo right away...
- I am the best scanner then too... all that i want is on my overview in i just appear there where i want...

so why would you play eve then???

and then Hulk needs to kill things the same as BS...
because you need around the same amount of SP...
Make Hulk DPS/tank on the range of BS and you don't need change nothing on this subject...

But you know... that your thesis would kill EVE... but... who cares... "I have that much SP i should do all"...



p.s.
That your BS is ****... CCP need to delete all others ships from EVE because the only ship that you need is Titan...



truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.
Freyya
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#72 - 2011-11-19 11:11:43 UTC
If i recall correctly drones also dropped drone parts used in manufacturing right?
How about you drop the minerals and put it into full drone drops, add bp's or copies for rogue drones re-engeneered for capsuleer use with specific properties not found in regular or faction drones.
Sure at first the prices would be quite high but seeing high/low and nullsec has drone plexes there wouldn't be a huge advantage for only the drone regions.

It would give a new manufacturing "mini game" much like invention for t2 did. Hell, make it like invention requiring more work than just plain manufacturing.
Freyya
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#73 - 2011-11-19 11:14:10 UTC
Freyya wrote:
If i recall correctly drones also dropped drone parts used in manufacturing right?
How about you drop the minerals and put it into full drone drops, add bp's or copies for rogue drones re-engeneered for capsuleer use with specific properties not found in regular or faction drones.
Sure at first the prices would be quite high but seeing high/low and nullsec has drone plexes there wouldn't be a huge advantage for only the drone regions.

It would give a new manufacturing "mini game" much like invention for t2 did. Hell, make it like invention requiring more work than just plain manufacturing.


it might be extraction from salvaging, not drops, haven't been shooting drones in a long long time.
Crap, ment edit, sorry.
dischordia
wiggle Tech.
#74 - 2011-11-19 11:54:45 UTC
Freyya wrote:
Freyya wrote:
If i recall correctly drones also dropped drone parts used in manufacturing right?
How about you drop the minerals and put it into full drone drops, add bp's or copies for rogue drones re-engeneered for capsuleer use with specific properties not found in regular or faction drones.
Sure at first the prices would be quite high but seeing high/low and nullsec has drone plexes there wouldn't be a huge advantage for only the drone regions.

It would give a new manufacturing "mini game" much like invention for t2 did. Hell, make it like invention requiring more work than just plain manufacturing.


it might be extraction from salvaging, not drops, haven't been shooting drones in a long long time.
Crap, ment edit, sorry.


the drone parts come from the "commander" spawns and tbh you cant GIVE them away as they are worth fudge all due to the stuff they make sucking so bad and costing so damn much

What we're actually doing is removing both hisec and PvP from the game entirely. It seems like the fairest way to solve this problem. - CCP Grayscale  - CCP troll BEST troll <3
Jacabon Mere
Capital Storm.
#75 - 2011-11-19 11:55:13 UTC
Sentient drones drop the drone parts.

Capital Storm is recruiting Aussies for Lowsec pvp and money making. Join "Capital Storm Pub" channel ingame. www.capitalstorm.net
Freyya
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#76 - 2011-11-19 12:42:26 UTC
dischordia wrote:
Freyya wrote:
Freyya wrote:
If i recall correctly drones also dropped drone parts used in manufacturing right?
How about you drop the minerals and put it into full drone drops, add bp's or copies for rogue drones re-engeneered for capsuleer use with specific properties not found in regular or faction drones.
Sure at first the prices would be quite high but seeing high/low and nullsec has drone plexes there wouldn't be a huge advantage for only the drone regions.

It would give a new manufacturing "mini game" much like invention for t2 did. Hell, make it like invention requiring more work than just plain manufacturing.


it might be extraction from salvaging, not drops, haven't been shooting drones in a long long time.
Crap, ment edit, sorry.


the drone parts come from the "commander" spawns and tbh you cant GIVE them away as they are worth fudge all due to the stuff they make sucking so bad and costing so damn much



Well it could then be a good incentive to make it less suck, distribute drone parts more to make it cost less and uhmmm....uhmmm. EPA?No... Damn, can't remember the 3rd thing, sorry.....oops.
dischordia
wiggle Tech.
#77 - 2011-11-19 12:49:40 UTC
Freyya wrote:
dischordia wrote:
Freyya wrote:
Freyya wrote:
If i recall correctly drones also dropped drone parts used in manufacturing right?
How about you drop the minerals and put it into full drone drops, add bp's or copies for rogue drones re-engeneered for capsuleer use with specific properties not found in regular or faction drones.
Sure at first the prices would be quite high but seeing high/low and nullsec has drone plexes there wouldn't be a huge advantage for only the drone regions.

It would give a new manufacturing "mini game" much like invention for t2 did. Hell, make it like invention requiring more work than just plain manufacturing.


it might be extraction from salvaging, not drops, haven't been shooting drones in a long long time.
Crap, ment edit, sorry.


the drone parts come from the "commander" spawns and tbh you cant GIVE them away as they are worth fudge all due to the stuff they make sucking so bad and costing so damn much



Well it could then be a good incentive to make it less suck, distribute drone parts more to make it cost less and uhmmm....uhmmm. EPA?No... Damn, can't remember the 3rd thing, sorry.....oops.


the prob is that the "faction" drones are not as good as compared to there t2 counterparts for the bang for your Isk ratio style analogy hell even the empire faction drones are worse than there t2 counterparts for isk spent, this is something that needs to be looked over asap imho

What we're actually doing is removing both hisec and PvP from the game entirely. It seems like the fairest way to solve this problem. - CCP Grayscale  - CCP troll BEST troll <3
Elanor Vega
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#78 - 2011-11-19 14:49:51 UTC
dischordia wrote:
Freyya wrote:
dischordia wrote:
Freyya wrote:
Freyya wrote:
If i recall correctly drones also dropped drone parts used in manufacturing right?
How about you drop the minerals and put it into full drone drops, add bp's or copies for rogue drones re-engeneered for capsuleer use with specific properties not found in regular or faction drones.
Sure at first the prices would be quite high but seeing high/low and nullsec has drone plexes there wouldn't be a huge advantage for only the drone regions.

It would give a new manufacturing "mini game" much like invention for t2 did. Hell, make it like invention requiring more work than just plain manufacturing.


it might be extraction from salvaging, not drops, haven't been shooting drones in a long long time.
Crap, ment edit, sorry.


the drone parts come from the "commander" spawns and tbh you cant GIVE them away as they are worth fudge all due to the stuff they make sucking so bad and costing so damn much



Well it could then be a good incentive to make it less suck, distribute drone parts more to make it cost less and uhmmm....uhmmm. EPA?No... Damn, can't remember the 3rd thing, sorry.....oops.


the prob is that the "faction" drones are not as good as compared to there t2 counterparts for the bang for your Isk ratio style analogy hell even the empire faction drones are worse than there t2 counterparts for isk spent, this is something that needs to be looked over asap imho




Then boost faction drones... non empire faction little more then empire faction... and you have one nice boost to prices of that parts... that would be one part of compensation for removed minerals...
Crucis Cassiopeiae
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#79 - 2011-11-19 17:58:51 UTC
Elanor Vega wrote:
whats the difference about monetary inflation and devaluation of some goods???
I don't see a difference...
minerals ARE isk for indy ppl!!!



+1

Vote Issler Dainze for CSM7! http://community.eveonline.com/council/voting/Vote.asp?c=470 
BigCountry
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#80 - 2011-11-19 21:07:25 UTC
Freyya wrote:
If i recall correctly drones also dropped drone parts used in manufacturing right?
How about you drop the minerals and put it into full drone drops, add bp's or copies for rogue drones re-engeneered for capsuleer use with specific properties not found in regular or faction drones.
Sure at first the prices would be quite high but seeing high/low and nullsec has drone plexes there wouldn't be a huge advantage for only the drone regions.

It would give a new manufacturing "mini game" much like invention for t2 did. Hell, make it like invention requiring more work than just plain manufacturing.





This is a horrible idea, I'm sorry......

The way PvE makes money in drone region is this ....

1. Rat and loot Drone Battleships...
2. Decide whether you want to just sell alloys or refine and manufacture something to sell
The good thing about this choice is that your options are plentiful... either someone will buy your alloys for the minerals for themself to build something , OR you build something that others will want to buy ...

With your idea the options are reduced to almost nothing ... Either i sell the drone parts or I build the special drones and sell them... The problem is that both options are very limited in customer base...

Other space PvE --- You go kill battleships and use ISK to buy whatever you want ... and you dont have to loot and haul anything to make it...

The only ones affected by alloys are miners and last I looked Trit and other low ends are higher then they have been in a long time so there is still money to be made in mining ..... high ends prices have nothing to do with alloys...