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Teamsters Union
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Scottish Play
Major Kong Freight
#1 - 2011-11-16 22:21:02 UTC
Is there any interest in a Teamster's Union? A group of haulers and freighters with an eye on controlling the pricing of courier contracts. Smashing in those that don't unionize, Jimmy Hoffa-style.
Kalmanaka
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#2 - 2011-11-16 22:26:17 UTC
Major lack of information here.
Do you want to do this because couriers are priced too high or too low?
How will you "smash" players in npc corps or those who rarely or never undock?

Unions were created so that workers could organize and force their employers to fix problems with safety and bargain for pay and benefits. Who exactly is this employer you'd be unionizing against?
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
#3 - 2011-11-16 22:42:05 UTC
Scottish Play wrote:
Is there any interest in a Teamster's Union? A group of haulers and freighters with an eye on controlling the pricing of courier contracts. Smashing in those that don't unionize, Jimmy Hoffa-style.


It's called Red Frog?
Adunh Slavy
#4 - 2011-11-16 23:05:15 UTC
Scottish Play wrote:
Is there any interest in a Teamster's Union? A group of haulers and freighters with an eye on controlling the pricing of courier contracts. Smashing in those that don't unionize, Jimmy Hoffa-style.



How are you going to enforce it with out the help of a government?

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
Poetic Stanziel
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2011-11-17 06:57:41 UTC
Interesting idea. Not anything that could be policed. Perhaps a set of principles that people sign on with ... an oath of sorts ... of course, it would not be binding ... but it would be in the best interests of all haulers. There's nothing to join. No common bond between haulers other than the principles.

A Twelve Statements of Principle. Start off with some ethical stuff. Some stuff about what prices won't be accepted.

I like the idea. It has some possibilities.
Zions Child
Higashikata Industries
#6 - 2011-11-17 07:59:01 UTC
I swear to the gods if you link your blog...


At the OP: That sort of thing exists, its called Red Frog. Unions require trust and implicit consequences of violating said trust, something EVE doesn't have.
Poetic Stanziel
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2011-11-17 08:59:18 UTC
Zions Child wrote:
I swear to the gods if you link your blog...

Are my LATEST POSTS your home page or something? You're following me around, sniffing my ass, like a little lost dog.
Zions Child
Higashikata Industries
#8 - 2011-11-17 15:40:18 UTC
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
Zions Child wrote:
I swear to the gods if you link your blog...

Are my LATEST POSTS your home page or something? You're following me around, sniffing my ass, like a little lost dog.

No, I just have the good fortune of having clicked on like three of your threads. I now avoid them, but yeah, this was an accident.
Zaxix
State War Academy
Caldari State
#9 - 2011-11-17 17:58:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Zaxix
Scrapyard Bob wrote:
Scottish Play wrote:
Is there any interest in a Teamster's Union? A group of haulers and freighters with an eye on controlling the pricing of courier contracts. Smashing in those that don't unionize, Jimmy Hoffa-style.


It's called Red Frog?

Red Frog is not a hoffa style organization. There's plenty of hauling for everyone. We have a strict no-combat policy, we don't take sides in conflicts, and we have even hauled stuff for people who have wardecced us while we're under the dec. We haul. That's all. Over the long term its the best possible policy for success.

OP, I think there isn't much of a use for a hoffa style organization. You'll find that over time very, very few people stick with hauling as a career. In the 3 or so years I've been with Red Frog, there have only been approximately 7-10 players who did it for more than a year (we've had hundreds of pilots during that time). A few more have come and gone or done it irregularly over a long period. Other freight companies and public contract haulers come and go with amazing frequency. I don't think I've seen one (or at least know of one) that lasted a full year. No one needs to "break legs" or that sort of thing, because in a month or two they discover hauling is a thankless, boring task.

If you're interested in joining Red Frog, send an evemail to Locin Weeda. If you're going out on your own, best of luck! Just remember not to let the queue control you. It will very quickly ruin the game for you.

Bokononist

 
Scottish Play
Major Kong Freight
#10 - 2011-11-17 19:25:13 UTC
Zaxix wrote:
If you're interested in joining Red Frog, send an evemail to Locin Weeda. If you're going out on your own, best of luck! Just remember not to let the queue control you. It will very quickly ruin the game for you.
Thank you. I think I will apply to Red Frog. I already have 579 hauling jumps to my name and made 150,000,000 ISK. In 1 day and 10 hours I will be able to haul that magical 860,000 number in my obelisk (Gallente Freighter III). I am just looking for a more stable income with more stable routes. I looked at the Red Frog website and the service seems really good. What percentage of the contracts do the haulers for Red Frog earn?
Dorian Wylde
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2011-11-17 20:08:53 UTC
Kalmanaka wrote:

How will you "smash" players in npc corps or those who rarely or never undock?




If they don't undock, they can't exactly haul anything, and thus earn the ire of the union.
Zaxix
State War Academy
Caldari State
#12 - 2011-11-17 21:52:01 UTC
Scottish Play wrote:
Zaxix wrote:
If you're interested in joining Red Frog, send an evemail to Locin Weeda. If you're going out on your own, best of luck! Just remember not to let the queue control you. It will very quickly ruin the game for you.
Thank you. I think I will apply to Red Frog. I already have 579 hauling jumps to my name and made 150,000,000 ISK. In 1 day and 10 hours I will be able to haul that magical 860,000 number in my obelisk (Gallente Freighter III). I am just looking for a more stable income with more stable routes. I looked at the Red Frog website and the service seems really good. What percentage of the contracts do the haulers for Red Frog earn?

Red Frog makes no money. There are no % of contracts or fees. Pilots earn everything. Even the CEO works for his own ISK.

Bokononist

 
Montevius Williams
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2011-11-18 05:15:03 UTC
I was with Red Frog for a bit, that Corp is GREAT if you are a freighter pilot. No better way to make that Freighter work for you then with Red Frog. Steady supply of work, some days it can be overwhelming. I had a blast there. But like others have said, its strickly Hauling.

"The American Government indoctrination system known as public education has been relentlessly churning out socialists for over 20 years". - TravisWB
Dark Privateer
Unreal Darkness
#14 - 2011-11-18 18:28:21 UTC
Well, if its anything like the current Teamsters Union I am in now:

- People would make contracts for what would seem fair, and the union would all sit around doing nothing but complain how they are losing out on wages and complain more when someone actually takes the contract and is making the isk and being useful at the same time.

- Would take a contract and not get around to delivering it till they got around to it because they were doing it to stick it to the contractor for not charging enough and trying to inconvenience them in any way shape and form. (known as : doing your job, but not really)

- Would afk travel the whole way napping on the job and say they were not responsible and couldn't in any way shape or form avoid getting suicide ganked slow boating to the gate.

- Would insist that anyone NOT in the union still pay dues equivilent to 98% of their normal dues and not have any protection from the union. And at the end of the year, the isk put into those funds would be equally divided among the drivers because "it's only fair" to get isk for doing no work.
Voogru
Massive Damage
We Are John Galt
#15 - 2011-11-26 10:47:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Voogru
Dark Privateer wrote:
Well, if its anything like the current Teamsters Union I am in now:

- People would make contracts for what would seem fair, and the union would all sit around doing nothing but complain how they are losing out on wages and complain more when someone actually takes the contract and is making the isk and being useful at the same time.

- Would take a contract and not get around to delivering it till they got around to it because they were doing it to stick it to the contractor for not charging enough and trying to inconvenience them in any way shape and form. (known as : doing your job, but not really)

- Would afk travel the whole way napping on the job and say they were not responsible and couldn't in any way shape or form avoid getting suicide ganked slow boating to the gate.

- Would insist that anyone NOT in the union still pay dues equivilent to 98% of their normal dues and not have any protection from the union. And at the end of the year, the isk put into those funds would be equally divided among the drivers because "it's only fair" to get isk for doing no work.



This.

Thankfully, EVE is very close to a free market where you don't have this kind of nonsense.

Union thugs are the worst, I've had some real life experiences with them. I like it when they thread bodily injury or property damage.

Stay classy, scumbag.

Long story short, unions would never work in EVE, because you will always have people undercutting you and you can't force them to join you against their will.

Unlike most unions in reality that force people to join against their will.