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Nestor A "Combat Hole roller" a practical and useful new role.
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epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#1 - 2014-05-20 17:13:01 UTC  |  Edited by: epicurus ataraxia
rollem, Rollem, Rollem, Raw Hide!

The nestor is lacking a role in wormhole space, and finding trouble elsewhere unfortunately.

There is a potential opportunity to provide a significant improvement to a very common Wormhole activity.

One of Rolling wormhole entrances.

Almost always, a combination of Orcas and double bubblers are used, the Orcas for high mass and HIC double bubbles used to reduce mass to almost zero and coming back "Hot" to finish the hole off.

Works fine, if a little slow.

However if the Hole is contested, either one can fight on the hole, or just POS up if it does not go well, as putting an orca through under fire, is just not going to happen.
This restricts opportunities unless the scenario is VERY clear cut.
No one rolls the hole unless the majority of the team is on.

An opportunity then exists for a COMBAT ship to undertake this role, Fights will still take place, and more often.

The nestor with the ability to increase it's mass to orca levels (or greater) and reduce it's mass to double bubbled hic levels, will allow wormholes to be rolled without waiting for larger numbers to sign in, and holes to be rolled in the "off period"

This means rolling a hole is less russian roulette and more an opportunity for action under fire.

As it seems the only other roles in WH are ruled out through the lack of a Covert Cloak.
This might provide a truly useful opportunity to let it Shine.

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE
Daoden
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2014-05-20 18:11:31 UTC
Nestor was designed with low mass on purpose to allow it to NOT kill a WH when jumping into it. It takes about half the mass of a regular BS thus allowing you to potentially bring in a stronger force without breaking the hole.
What your suggesting is almost the same thing as a HIC breaking a hole only on a larger scale.
Also WHs aren't meant for solo play typically so get more friends or stop going into WHs.
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#3 - 2014-05-20 21:46:53 UTC  |  Edited by: epicurus ataraxia
Daoden wrote:
Nestor was designed with low mass on purpose to allow it to NOT kill a WH when jumping into it. It takes about half the mass of a regular BS thus allowing you to potentially bring in a stronger force without breaking the hole.
What your suggesting is almost the same thing as a HIC breaking a hole only on a larger scale.
Also WHs aren't meant for solo play typically so get more friends or stop going into WHs.

<<< Hint:- PVP wormhole Corp.

Um Yes.
That is exactly right, I am suggesting A battleship that can have high (increased Mass) and low mass selectable.
A combat wormhole closer, so they can be closed under fire.
I thought I had made that as clear as possible?

Do you really use your Orca under Heavy fire to close a hole?
If so you must spend a lot of time out of wormholes climbing out of your clone vat.

I have friends, Good friends, they and I live in wormholes, every day, And none of them IS crazy enough to close a hole in the middle of a pitched battle with an ORCALol.Shocked Unless it is a final desperate act.Sad A suicide to protect the home hole.
And that is the only practical way in a high class Wormhole.
I believe that a combat capable ship can do so leading to interesting interaction.

This ship, the modded nestor, can fight it's way in light and fight it's way back Heavy, rolling the hole and supporting the battle with logistics as it goes.

Some will die, Some will give good fights, and take others with it, some will live and help kill the remaining invaders locked away from a way home.

The Orca is a poor tool for the job, Wormholers are resourceful and we always find a tool, no matter how unlikely.
So this is what we have, We make do, but there could be so much better. Smile

If this ship was available EVERY wormhole corp would own at least one. Most a minimum of two.

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE
Doggy Dogwoofwoof
Space Mob
#4 - 2014-05-21 05:23:02 UTC
I hate this idea, And yet, i kinda want to see what would happen if this change were to be implemented
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#5 - 2014-05-21 05:39:11 UTC
The Nestor should really be called the Dante. As in Dante's Inferno, and more specifically - abandon all hope that any of the shortcomings will ever be addressed...

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#6 - 2014-05-21 09:30:31 UTC  |  Edited by: epicurus ataraxia
The nestor, currently does not have a lot going for it, whilst it does not excel at any particular thing, it is not actually bad.
In wormholes, we needed to find a way of rolling our static connections, otherwise we were stuck with it for the day.
The method is to stick mass through until it collapses.
We have got this down to a fine Art now, and although the amount of mass is variable, we know pretty much what is required.

There was no combat ship capable of doing this well, and we discovered the orca had suitable mass to work reasonably well,
It is a hammer, where we have no screwdriver, not the right tool but good enough mostly.

I thought what else could do the job better and realised that the nestor, with the capabilities of it's technology to reduce it's mass would be absolutely amazing if that could be variable and selectable.

If it's mass could be dialed up to an orca's and down to a pod's then that would not only do the job of the orca and The Hic, it could do it under combat conditions, fighting it's way to the hole, supporting it's sisters and battling it's way back from hostile space trapping the enemy away from home.

This would then become a MUST have purchase for every wormhole corporation, If there was a wormhole with an active pos, there would be a Nestor or two.

It would have absolutely no downside to the overall game balance, it would be absolutely the right tool for the job, without being in any way overpowered, and still vunerable to good tactics and good fights. More than one pass will be still required as currently to prevent it being an easy mode as polarization timers will still apply.

Lots will be used, lots will be lost, and no one would regret using it as it would be the perfect tool, and winning or losing just part of epic combat, and a good play/use experience.

So recommendation:-
The lore exists currently for this ship to have different mass.
Make this mass selectable
Setting one standard Nestor mass.
Setting two minimal mass similar to a HIC double bubble.
Setting three maximum mass similar to an Orca coming through "HOT"

I Strongly recommend this as it will be of value to EVERY wormhole Corp and a Major improvement to the quality of play experience of EVERY Wormhole Corp with Absolutely NO downside.

CSM please pick up on this, look at it and recommend this. PLEASE!

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE
Velicitia
XS Tech
#7 - 2014-05-21 10:24:13 UTC
Suppose this could be useful ... but it would need a downside, such as sig bloom.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#8 - 2014-05-21 10:36:39 UTC


Velicitia wrote:
Suppose this could be useful ... but it would need a downside, such as sig bloom.


I would NOT expect the signature to change when in the different modes, after all a battleship is not exactly hard to lock.
I agree that Reducing the sig to pod size when in low mass mode would not be reasonable.
Thanks for pointing out that consideration.

This is not intended in any way to be an easy mode. It is about having a tool for the job, nothing more, and a tool that can support and encourage effective combat in a wormhole environment whilst managing a daily task.

This simply means that when a hostile hole is opened, that the opportunity occurs for the hole to be effectively managed as part of the combat landscape, allowing combat to occur in a practical manner, and permitting new tactics.

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE
Tchulen
Trumpets and Bookmarks
#9 - 2014-05-21 10:58:54 UTC
This actually seems like quite a good idea. +1
Velicitia
XS Tech
#10 - 2014-05-21 11:27:28 UTC
epicurus ataraxia wrote:


Velicitia wrote:
Suppose this could be useful ... but it would need a downside, such as sig bloom.


I would NOT expect the signature to change when in the different modes, after all a battleship is not exactly hard to lock.
I agree that Reducing the sig to pod size when in low mass mode would not be reasonable.
Thanks for pointing out that consideration.

This is not intended in any way to be an easy mode. It is about having a tool for the job, nothing more, and a tool that can support and encourage effective combat in a wormhole environment whilst managing a daily task.

This simply means that when a hostile hole is opened, that the opportunity occurs for the hole to be effectively managed as part of the combat landscape, allowing combat to occur in a practical manner, and permitting new tactics.



Super-awesome-technology thing that stores mass as energy (thus reducing the effective mass of the ship) ... and making your sig bloom.
Conversely, it sucks down cap like Rockefeller Square on Christmas Eve when you wanna make the Nestor heavier (would do loads more than MWD).

Thing is, I'm not dead-set on sig bloom - was just the first penalty I could think of when posting. So by all means, if you have a better drawback, I'm all ears.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#11 - 2014-05-21 11:35:15 UTC  |  Edited by: epicurus ataraxia
Velicitia wrote:
epicurus ataraxia wrote:


Velicitia wrote:
Suppose this could be useful ... but it would need a downside, such as sig bloom.


I would NOT expect the signature to change when in the different modes, after all a battleship is not exactly hard to lock.
I agree that Reducing the sig to pod size when in low mass mode would not be reasonable.
Thanks for pointing out that consideration.

This is not intended in any way to be an easy mode. It is about having a tool for the job, nothing more, and a tool that can support and encourage effective combat in a wormhole environment whilst managing a daily task.

This simply means that when a hostile hole is opened, that the opportunity occurs for the hole to be effectively managed as part of the combat landscape, allowing combat to occur in a practical manner, and permitting new tactics.



Super-awesome-technology thing that stores mass as energy (thus reducing the effective mass of the ship) ... and making your sig bloom.
Conversely, it sucks down cap like Rockefeller Square on Christmas Eve when you wanna make the Nestor heavier (would do loads more than MWD).

Thing is, I'm not dead-set on sig bloom - was just the first penalty I could think of when posting. So by all means, if you have a better drawback, I'm all ears.


I am not sure why you feel it needs more of a penalty, than putting itself in extreme harms way?
Going into combat, and jumping into hostile space alone, is quite a severe penalty already?
It already is a neon lit target, as it cannot warp cloaked. It has slow lock time against ships that can instalock it,it aligns like a slug, and it is not exactly an overpowered ship currently.

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE