Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Again im not suggesting give new players every thing.
Even level of those skill can be adjusted - this don't have to be the lvl 5.

Not all gamers come from an online gaming community, so to assume this might be expecting too much.

Eve does, but it depends on what you consider to be fun. Entertainment value is not the same for all. Fun for a trader may not be the same as a combat person or an explorer.

If i'm included in the list of multi-million SP players then bear in mind that this char is only ~7 months old (and never played Eve before this) ...training in eve just isn't that slow and how much fun you have depends on what you as a player consider to be fun and your willingness to jump in and get on with it

The Truth About Eve.

So I am just going to come out and say it because it seems that everyone is afraid to admit it. Eve is a MMORPG / RTS / Space Sim.

Basically Eve is split in half.

One Half:
The fighting aspect of eve screams RTS. Fighting in eve is about strategy. It comes down to Ship class, tactical advantage, ship fits, and in fleets, fleet comps, and ability to work as a team. These are all aspects of a dynamic strategy game.

RTS games are not for everyone. RTS takes short term and long term strategy in order to achieve goals and requires players to sometimes lay in wait for an opportunity to present itself. This makes the game "Slow" to some people and is simply not for them.

Other Half:
Its a Space Sim. Does everyone you know like Sim City.....of course they do and that's why they are playing eve. The Sim half of eve has an even smaller audience then the RTS gamer.

What can we do?
We can't and honestly don't want to change the game fundamentally to cater to instant gratification gaming. This is not why we play eve. The learning curve has always been a barrier to eve, and CCP is actively working to eve lessen the cliff we call the eve learning curve but simply eve is a highly in-depth game that takes a lot knowledge and strategy to be victories. This is why most of us play eve and it will never go away and should never EVER be lessened.

Because it serves very little.

If a player is frustrated in their first couple of months due to training, then in many ways they are already lost.

If any EVE player has the mindset that they cannot do anything until they have sit ship spinning for XX time (days,weeks,month) then they are missing the fundamental point of EVE.

If a new player has this mindset, giving them free SP isn't going to change it. At best it kicks the can down the road a ways. In many cases it will make things worse.

Next step would be 2 Million SP, then 3, then 4 and then you can buy an expension and get LVL 90 instand...

if u think having someone on grid to help him is the issue, then be on grid to help him. Or, failing that, find someone who can be on grid to help him.

Ur corp cant take him in?
eve uni? RvB?

I come from the days before Attribute Remaps.

I spent the first couple hours learning to fly my ship, shooting NPC's in asteroid belts, and taking on L1 combat missions. It was difficult, and I lost several ships. This was before a skill que existed, so I would train short skills while I was online, and train learning skills while I was offline, sometimes alarm clocking to change skills. I know this sounds like gramps telling tails of walking to school in 6-feet of snow, uphill both ways, but EvE was much, much less noob friendly back then.

Skill Queue
Annual+ Attribute Remaps
No more learning skills
Better handouts from tutorial agents
Better skill progression design
More viable ships (instead of 1-2 viable frigates, 1-2 viable cruisers, etc, per racial class).

CCP is constantly improving the user experience, and we all appreciate that. On to your proposal:

Give away Skillpoints after completing Tutorial Agents:

I have a ton of mixed feelings about your suggestions:
♦ Giving out Racial Frigate V:
You dont NEED this skill at 5 to be competent with the ships they unlock. Absolutely NO. Level 5 simply unlocks T2 Frigates, which absolutely don't need to be instantly unlocked for a brand new player. They can and should learn the benefits of t1 frigates, which are now

♦ Giving out Racial Weapon V:
While t2 weapons do give a decent performance boost, they are hardly necessary. I was killing t2 fit ships in t1, low meta fit ships long before I trained up T2 weapons and modules. The key was learning how combat works, what the strengths and weaknesses of ships are, and learning how to engage. You ABSOLUTELY do NOT need to give this out!

♦ Giving out ME 4:
I understand why you'd want to give this out. I would claim that doing so is unnecessary with the upcoming indy changes though. In the current scheme of things, at ME 0, extra materials are needed to produce almost everything, including low-entry items like small rigs. However, with the new industry mechanics, this skill is being dramatically repurposed, and low entry items will no longer need such skills to be produced profitably.

♦ Giving out Industrial 4:
Why? The repurposed industrials are unlocked at Indy 1, and many have specialized bays that are instantly accessible.

♦ Giving out Hacking / Archeology / Astronemetrics 3:
I can understand the desire for these skills to be quickly available. I think a much better approach would be to reduce their pre-reqs to allow them to be trained much more quickly (I show 8 hrs currently, reduce that to 20 minutes or some such). After that, each race has ships with role bonuses that make exploration much easier to complete successfully, and I don't believe you need to provide more.

♦ Trade, Retail, and Contracting:
These skills take very little time to train that I really see no point in giving out the skills. I would much prefer you to increase the base number of trades or contracts any character can do than start handing out these skills.

At the end of the day, do you really think that your friends would have stayed if they had the skills you suggested? If they can't wait a few days to train up their basic skills, I can imagine them now QQ'ing about Cruiser V or BC V or BS V. You don't need to be "maxed skilled" in (most) ships to utilize it effectively, and that should be something that not only should be explained to them, but something they experience as a new member to the community.

Again with this corp manure.

I like the suggestion. My main is 4 years in the game and still doesn't have some of the mentioned skills, but nobody is forbidding me from redoing the tutorial if I really want, right?

First of all, with the current mission AI, you're going to get raped in your frig and especially in dessie. Very fast, practically instant the moment focus switches. We tried to take our newbs in desses to missions and it happened 100% of times.

SP is a crucial issue of eve. It takes years to achieve basic proficiency in weapon systems. 2 years and my combat alt still cannot get into a marauder - because he lacks SP! Bigger SP blob always wins in pvp, unless he commits a real blunder. So everyone who says SP isn't the issue is entitled to a full shovel of manure in the face from me. Eat some ****, sir.