Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Maybe some didn't, but if you look back at the threads they are chock-full of people who seem to assume that the only cost would be something along the lines of rig penalties and nothing more. The reason why these kinds of overarching nerfs to the base stats are needed never got past their blinders.

The same goes for the middle ground: the notion that the middle ground would forcibly be something pretty bad since the balancing had to compensate for the extremes never sunk in. In truth, they actually end up being much less severe than expected — in most cases, you can shift the penalties to something that doesn't hurt too much.

Sure it is. There are ways of escaping from that kind of trap but nothing sane or sensible done to the freighters themselves could ever help you there. What you have there is a one-vs-many “problem”, not a ship problem. Not the quotation marks on the first since it's entirely fair and balanced that many pilots working together can beat one. Realistically, freighters were so far from needing a buff that the best you could hope for was that they remained the same. Instead, we got rigs and all the nerfs that had to follow.

Freighters were in an excellent position if people just flew them properly. Jump freighters were, if anything, slated for a slight nerf but many thought it would stop with the fuel changes.

As for your suggestions, yes, they would all make the nerfs sting less. The question is, why should they? They're already mild compared to what could have been, and all you're really doing is creeping back towards not having rigs to being with.


Nah. I think I'll instead adapt to the new balance and pick and choose what I need from the ship rather than (futilely) trying to reconstruct a state that no longer exists.

I think I may have already picked the two rigs I need to get back to what I want from my JF, but I'll have to test it on sisi against another set up to see which one works best. Neither of them will be T2 even though it's almost a sensible investment compared to a JF's price tag. But then, I also have to test it against a fully (still T1) rigged freighter to see if I can cash out some profit in the process.

It's intentional, although I have been seeing a few good arguments for reconsidering it in the thread so far.

\o/

How about delaying this and release it with the industry changes?

I understand that you want to have industry more spread out, more hubs, make it more costly to transport a lot of wares, but this is going to hurt until the industry stuff happens.

Its like replacing half a working system with one made to work with another that isn't out yet.

just keep the damm rigs already llike someone said before all this changes for stupid rigs n the outcome is worse then before
leave the freighters as they r so everybody can stop bitchin

Just out of curiosity....

I fly a Freighter, I should not carry more than a bil worth in cargo to make it worth while for gankers (probably pre-talos rule)

With the current changes, I buy the HP rigs and which cost around 1-15b so technically gankers no longer need any cargo value to make any gank cost effective?

If I am wrong please let me know but it seems like I really shouldn't bother hauling anything due to risk vs reward.

Leave freighters as they currently are. There, thats a good post imo.

What's the opinion on a freighter now costing 2 freighter worth of ISK to have the same function as previously? Anyone who went with the charon most likely did it because of the best cargo capacity in class. This then require fitting 1,4 bill ISK worth of rigs on it.

good to hear

i think for many freight and logistics stuff is just boring, but it is essential to the economy and the game. making some of these things harder does not seem to make that game any bettter. lets face it piloting a freighter is simlly boring game play.....making that game play cost billions more than it currently does with zero return is just daft

i think this should be shelved - look what CCP came up with when the t1 halulers were actually reblanced....some of thise changes are awesome...mineral haulers, pi specialists etc... that battle nereus is bloody brilliant.

i would rather CCP take the time and look at all the options for this than rush into a lets add rigs option. One that lets the player make decisions about cost and effectiveness. Not one that nerfa an entire class and then forces you to spend billions to get back what you had.

perhaps there could be cargo control by putting specialized holds on freighters....ie only soo much general cargo...maybe a fleet hanger.....or a rig to add a specialized bay

that is all outside this current discussion but i think that we should not proceed with this current change without thinking about the whole gamit of options.....we have waited this long to even consider changing freighters and stuff up...i have zero problem waiting longer to get it done right

Sounds like a troll "because we add rigs, we just change everything to adapt", in other word, put rigs if you want, at least, the same value as before. (btw, you can have more, but at what cost ?)

IMO, it would have been a better improvement to make slighter changes regarding those announced, but adding something like a few "hull resistance" by level since instead of that speed bonus nobody cares about :
- freighter are hull "tanked" (at least, if we say they can tank)
- they cannot warp quick
- they cannot defend themselves.

With triple Hull HP rigs, you'll get around 50-59k more EHP (since hull have no resist), really nothing, but you'll lose 150k m3 cargohold.
But let's say you add 2% hull res (all res) by racial freighter skill level, so 10% res at level 5. you get something like this for the obelisk (best hull hp with the current announcements)
- base HP : 97500
- 3 hull rigs bonus HP (t2, 20% per rigs): 58200
And it would give something like 171k hull EHP with the 10% res. Even if we add shield and armor EHP, it's still not "ungankable" (it should still be gankable!) but, it shouldn't be a free "6 tornado gank target".

it is now really worth the cargo loss :P

tl;dr;
give a few hull resistance to freighters to allow them being "serious ganking target" if they want to be so, but still easy target when they chose to use cargo rigs.